Shameless: Pro-gun groups push for concealed carry amendment on Matthew Shepard Hate Crimes bill

[marmar]

Bizarre Bedfellows: Gun Nuts & The Senate Hate Crimes Act
Submitted by NewsSystem on Tue, 06/09/2009 - 15:28 Joe My God


The Washington Independent is reporting that an amendment allowing gun owners to carry their concealed weapons across state lines may be attached to the Matthew Shepard Act, the Senate's hate crimes bill. The spurious reasoning: It will protect gays from bashing. Yeeeeah. And GOProud nutter Jimmy LaSalvia one of the people behind it. One month after successfully tucking an amendment into the credit card reform bill that expanded gun rights, a small number of Senate Republicans are looking at the Matthew Shepard Hate Crimes Prevention Act as another chance to score a victory for the Second ...

Original Article



http://www.tips-q.com/news/msm/1007043-bizarre-bedfellows-gun-nuts-senate-hate-crimes-act

[ccharles000]

1. assholes

[aikoaiko]

10. This could be a way to gather more votes for the bill?

It might allow some legislators some political cover to vote for main bill.

[konnichi wa]

2. As a longtime gun owner and a longer time gay man I support this.

...

[derby378]

3. If two adjoining states already have laws that agree on CHL, this shouldn't be a problem

I can see where California could prevent an Arizona resident from walking across state lines with a concealed handgun, but that's as far as I'll go.

[JonLP24]

5. I know of a situation very similar to that

While I was in the Army in Washington St. I know a soldier originally from California that went on leave from being stationed from Ft Lewis going to Ft Jackson, SC. Despite a fore warning from another soldier from California saying he should register his weapon before going to California he didn't. His weapon was registered in Washington and not in California, sure enough he was pulled over and got arrested for the gun. I found out when he called his Cali friend.

[Lasher]

4. CCW permit holders can already carry guns across state lines

where there is a reciprocal agreement between the two states concerned.

I don't get it. :shrug:

Edit to offer this link: http://www.nraila.org/recmap/recguide.pdf

[RamboLiberal]

11. Be nice if it was consistent

I live in PA - I can carry in a lot of states where there is an agreement, like Florida, Tennessee, etc, but in Ohio which I go to once a month or so I cannot even though OH has a CCW law there's no agreement with PA yet. Another state I go to frequently WV just got agreement with PA last year.

I'd just love CCW to be consistent like a driver's license. I always wondered why when they had the Congress & the WH why Repubs didn't pass this like they did the law for LEOs and former LEOS.

[Statistical]

13. I "think" the bill is to make it consistent.

I.e. all states issue driver's licenses or marriage licenses.

However a state can't choose which licenses they accept.
You can't get pulled over in NC because your VA license is no good.

So if a state allows CCW for residents they must accept CCW from other states.

Of course all that is speculation until I see the exact text of the bill.

[krispos42]

14. Thanks to DOMA, a state CAN choose which licenses they accept.

For example, the licenses of same-sex couples.

:-(

[Statistical]

16. Well yeah but I disagree with that.

Maybe I should stick with drivers license analogy.

[krispos42]

18. So do I

We're a nation, dammit, not a confederation.

[TheWraith]

31. Another rule that should kiss the ass of "full faith and credit."

Article IV, Section 1 of the United States Constitution, commonly known as the Full Faith and Credit Clause, addresses the duties that states within the United States have to respect the "public acts, records, and judicial proceedings" of other states.

[ThomWV]

6. Why do you consider it shameless for Americans to have their rights preserved

2nd amendment says we have a right to bear arms, why would support of a law reinforcing that right be "shameless". You got something against the Constitution or against Americans demanding their rights under it?

[aikoaiko]

7. At least this gun law amendment is relevant to host legislation.

I'd like to see the text of the amendment before commenting on its merits. Allowing the concealed carrying of weapons across state lines where reciprocity doesn't already exist is a tricky issue involving state's rights.

On the face of it, the amendment and bill seem like win win legislation to me.

[xchrom]

8. fuckin horrifying. nt

[zbdent]

9. if Matthew Shepard had fought back with HIS 2nd amendment rights ... headline:

"Homosexual teen goes on murderous rampage; kills n for no reason ..."

[aikoaiko]

29. better that than dead. nt

[csziggy]

12. NRA called me about this today - with an incorrect name and bad description of the bill

Called for 'Mr. Ziggy' - I don't use hubby's name, phone is listed with my initial and last name. When I asked what they were calling about, the woman said it was about 'H.R. 45 - a bill to prevent changeable magazines' (?) and went on to say if "this thing gaions momentum, they will take away our guns". :wtf:

But she wasn't interested in talking to a woman - only wanted to talk to a man. :wtf:

[krispos42]

15. The laws regarding recipricol recognition of concealed-carry permits is pretty muddled

The states have vastly different issuing standards for CCW permits, and reciprocity is random and fluid.



The really anti-gun states will hate it because they'll have to recognize out-of-state CCW permits. Some states, like California and New York, make it extremely difficult or impossible to get a permit unless you're wealthy or powerful.

Some states, like South Dakota, make it so easy they could almost use a vending machine.

Vermont and Alaska don't even bother to issue permits.

[quiller4]

20. It does clear up the reciprocity issues and that is a good thing.n/t

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

17. I'm completely okay with that

[quiller4]

19. Good for them! n/t

[Hoopla Phil]

21. Great news.

If passed I would not have to check the TX DPS web site on what states currently accept my TX CHL when I travel. I give this one a thumbs up!!

Only concern would be in states that make you register your firearm or get prior permission to even own one. Take New York for instance, would I be in violation if I go there and carry a handgun that is on their No,no list?

[Recursion]

22. How is that shameless?

It sounds like an attempt to prevent further tragedies like the one Shepard was subjected to.

[votingupstart]

23. i respectfuly disagree

i see this ammendment as a cleaning up of other conflicting case law, individual states laws, regarding CCW reciprocity. i respect your opinion on the matter. IMO i fully supported the bill before the attachment and will continue to support it after.

[Raskolnik]

24. Its certainly tacky, there isn't any question about that. n/t

[aikoaiko]

25. Have no fear -- if your state does not allow concealed carry this law won't allow outsiders to do so

As I understand it, the proposed law only permits outsiders to carry a concealed weapon if the are already permitted or licensed in their home state and the visited state allows its own residents to carry concealed.

A lot of states already reciprocate with one another, but some don't. This will smooth out the CCW areas. I live in GA just a few miles from SC. SC doesn't reciprocate with GA on CCW mostly because GA doesn't have the same stringent requirements as SC. Which is fine really, but SC also won't let me take its courses and get a nonresident permit which would be nice.

States like Illinois or Wisconsin that do not allow their residents to carry won't be forced to allow outsiders to carry.

S 845 IS

111th CONGRESS

1st Session

S. 845

To amend chapter 44 of title 18, United States Code, to allow citizens who have concealed carry permits from the State in which they reside to carry concealed firearms in another State that grants concealed carry permits, if the individual complies with the laws of the State.

IN THE SENATE OF THE UNITED STATES

April 21, 2009

Mr. THUNE (for himself, Mr. BARRASSO, Mr. BEGICH, Mr. BENNETT, Mr. BROWNBACK, Mr. BURR, Mr. CHAMBLISS, Mr. COBURN, Mr. COCHRAN, Mr. CRAPO, Mr. DEMINT, Mr. ENSIGN, Mr. ENZI, Mr. GRAHAM, Mr. GRASSLEY, Mr. HATCH, Mr. INHOFE, Mr. ISAKSON, Mr. MARTINEZ, Mr. RISCH, Mr. ROBERTS, Mr. VITTER, and Mr. WICKER) introduced the following bill; which was read twice and referred to the Committee on the Judiciary

A BILL

To amend chapter 44 of title 18, United States Code, to allow citizens who have concealed carry permits from the State in which they reside to carry concealed firearms in another State that grants concealed carry permits, if the individual complies with the laws of the State.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

This Act may be cited as the `Respecting States Rights and Concealed Carry Reciprocity Act of 2009'.

SEC. 2. RECIPROCITY FOR THE CARRYING OF CERTAIN CONCEALED FIREARMS.

(a) In General- Chapter 44 of title 18, United States Code, is amended by inserting after section 926C the following:

`Sec. 926D. Reciprocity for the carrying of certain concealed firearms

`Notwithstanding any provision of the law of any State or political subdivision thereof:

`(1) A person who is not prohibited by Federal law from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm, and is carrying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant to the law of any State and which permits the person to carry a concealed firearm, may carry a concealed firearm in accordance with the terms of the license or permit in any State that allows its residents to carry concealed firearms, subject to the laws of the State in which the firearm is carried concerning specific types of locations in which firearms may not be carried.

`(2) A person who is not prohibited by Federal law from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm, and is otherwise than as described in paragraph (1) entitled to carry a concealed firearm in and pursuant to the law of the State in which the person resides, may carry a concealed firearm in accordance with the laws of the State in which the person resides in any State that allows its residents to carry concealed firearms, subject to the laws of the State in which the firearm is carried concerning specific types of locations in which firearms may not be carried.'.

(b) Clerical Amendment- The table of sections for chapter 44 of title 18 is amended by inserting after the item relating to section 926C the following:

`926D. Reciprocity for the carrying of certain concealed firearms.'.

SEC. 3. EFFECTIVE DATE.

The amendments made by this Act shall take effect 90 days after the date of enactment of this Act.

[cslinger59]

26. The question is what about states such as....

Maryland, California, Mass etc. that all have may issue type systems which basically mean nobody who isn't well connected or isn't in the right jurisdiction gets one.

I am picturing these states having hissy fits over this as if it happens it will likely drive them to either stop issuing completely or go to a shall issue system to appease residents.

[aikoaiko]

27. I think you are correct that the may issue states will be the most unhappy with this legislation.

But really it should be too much of a concern as it involved visitors only who must abide by the visited state's laws of CCW.

[Statistical]

28. I think eventually it will make them chose one side or the other.

In my opinion "may issue" should be abolished.

In the unwashed masses can't carry guns then the aristocracy can't carry them either.
Sorry "may issue" = "may infringe" is class-ism at its worst.

[Wednesdays]

30. K&R

:kick:

[TheWraith]

32. VOTE FOR IT ANYWAY.

Point one, we really should create a uniform national standard for concealed carry licenses even before now. Failing that, this is close enough.

Point two, it would fuck the GOPers bigtime. Either they vote or guns, or they vote against gays, but not both.

Last but not least, any expansion of the national requirements for recognizing legal acts of another state (which includes concealed carry licenses) is another nail in the coffin of DOMA.

[Kaleva]

33. Looks like a resonable amendment