Remember, There Are NOT Two Sides To This Debate

[KingOfLostSouls]

abortion is legal in the united states.


terrorist activities and first degree murder are not legal.




so whenever you hear people like bill o'reilly or you talk to conservatives in your neighborhoods or work places and they try to cloud the argument with murky arguments about ethics and the bible and whatnot just remind them of that simple fact


abortion is legal, first degree murder is not. its not a matter of what your book tells you, its a matter of the law.



letting them drag it into a debate of the bible says this or that clouds the simple fact: a doctor was murdered by an assassin in his church. period.

[csziggy]

1. K&R

[annabanana]

2. Good point! . . If you're in the position of having to argue with

someone about this at all, it's probably because you're dealing with an "all or nothing" sort of person to start with.

[slackmaster]

3. Abortion is legal only when it is done in accordance with applicable state and local laws

It's not strictly protected activity. No state allows a person who is not licensed to practice medicine to perform abortions at any stage.

The OP is correct in that the LAW defines what is and is not legal.

[Deep13]

9. Yes, but there is a virtual mob-veto of that right in mcuh of the country. nt

[BOSSHOG]

4. My Sig line is simple, to the point

Great post, just more proof that christian conservatives hate the constitution because it is a shield not a weapon.

[OneGrassRoot]

5. Oh, snap!!! That's brilliant. Thank you, BOSSHOG! :) n/t

[Deep13]

7. bingo! nt

[Hepburn]

11. Oh, I love that sig line....

...and thank you for your service! :hug:

[Deep13]

6. I heard one hate monger played on either Keith or Rachael last night that had the gall...

...to equate this murderer and terrorist with John Brown. I wanted to reach through the TV and the strangle the guy.

Zygots, embryos and feti (fetuses?) are are only people IF one believes that these things have souls--a concept with no basis in fact. And for the sake of these nonpersons, they will commit acts of murder and subject our most vulnerable citizens to harassment and deprive them of medical assistance. On the other hand, slavery really was evil. No religious doctrine is necessary for slaves to be people and no rights of other persons are implicated in ending the practice (except for the illusory "rights" of slave holders.) So I find the comparison to John Brown to be grotesque and offensive.

[KingOfLostSouls]

8. these people don't believe in facts

its easier for them to hate than it is to accept the reality that they might be wrong.

[reggie the dog]

10. what you say is true

and I firmly support the right of a woman to choose. Here in France abortion is legal in the first 12 weeks because we esteem that the featus is not yet human life, but that after 12 weeks the form is humanoid and therefore illegal to abort unless the mothers life is threatened or there is evidence of deformities. The debate about when life begins, at conception - at birth- or somewhere in between, is a real one.

[paulsby]

12. you are conflating two issues

fwiw, i am pro-choice. fwiw, i have LOTS of anti-choice friends. fwiw, i watched the oreilly episodes after the tiller murder.

one can simultaneously believe

1) abortion is wrong
2) acknowledge it is legal
3) protest/fight against men like tiller.

i respect that. oreilly et al have condemned the murder. i respect that. i have tons of anti-choice friends and none would EVER condone the murder.

it does not therefore follow that they do not have the right to protest abortion and/or men like tiller.

i can respect debate and i refuse to vilify anti-choice people because a tiny tiny minority of them are violent.

just like i won't condemn the anti-war folks (of which i am one, at least when it comes to the iraq war) because of the recruiter shooting. and i won't condemn muslims for it, either.

[uppityperson]

13. OP is not about "right to protest" but the right to murder.

[paulsby]

14. fair enuf

i think i misread the OP, by inferring stuff that wasn't there.