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Wingers are mad about the un-American pronunciation of SotomayOR

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BurtWorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 11:57 AM
Original message
Wingers are mad about the un-American pronunciation of SotomayOR
Edited on Wed May-27-09 11:59 AM by BurtWorm
They don't know why they should have to bend over backwards to pronounce her name correctly. They think her parents should have been patriotic enough to mispronounce their name for the Anglo majority. And because they didn't, this should disqualify her from serving on the court.

According to Gawker:


http://feeds.gawker.com/~r/gawker/full/~3/GJuCNMp629g/national-review-will-decide-how-sotomayor-should-pronounce-her-own-name

Conservatives are angry at Supreme Court nominee Sonia Sotomayor because she pronounces her name with an emphasis on the last syllable—"SotomayOR"—like a foreigner, which she may as well be because she won't talk Americun. A National Review writer, not a Fox Nation commenter, is advancing this argument.

The National Review's Mark Krikorian—who is, as you can tell by the unusual arrangement of consonants in his surname, himself a foreigner or maybe a Jew—writes that "putting the emphasis on the final syllable of Sotomayor is unnatural in English...and insisting on an unnatural pronunciation is something we shouldn't be giving in to."

More:

This may seem like carping, but it's not. Part of our success in assimilation has been to leave whole areas of culture up to the individual, so that newcomers have whatever cuisine or religion or so on they want, limiting the demand for conformity to a smaller field than most other places would. But one of the areas where conformity is appropriate is how your new countrymen say your name, since that's not something the rest of us can just ignore, unlike what church you go to or what you eat for lunch. And there are basically two options - the newcomer adapts to us, or we adapt to him. And multiculturalism means there's a lot more of the latter going on than there should be.

No, it doesn't seem like "carping" so much as white rage. Sotomayor was indeed a "newcomer" to this country when she was born, in the Bronx, in New York City, in 1954. Her parents (pictured here with their daughter) were also "newcomers"—in the sense that Krikiorian intends—when they moved to New York from Puerto Rico before Sotomayor was born, which they were entitled to do as American citizens, which all Puerto Ricans have been since 1917.

Still, even if there is nothing foreign about Sotomayor herself, her name is still foreign, and must be assimilated. The audacity with which she insists on pronouncing it like it is actually pronounced, instead of the way Krikorian would like to pronounce it, is troubling and different and noncomformist. We feel the same way about Rush Limbogg and the states of Arkansas, Illinois, and Connecticut.

UPDATE: A commenter notes that Antonin Scalia's first name is unacceptably foreign, but more to the point: How should red-blooded American's pronounce Scalia's last name? The emphasis on the second syllable—Sca-LEE-uh—is just about as "unnatural in English" as SotomayOR. I trust Krikorian pronounces it as a two-syllable SCAL-ia—sort of rhymes with "dahlia"—when he repeats it to himself as he masturbates.

UPDATE: Another commenter wonders how Krikorian would pronounce John Boehner's name.

<BurtWorm adds: Or Dick Cheeeeeney's>

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dem629 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
1. Why don't people in the US pronounce Japanese names like the Japanese do?
Edited on Wed May-27-09 12:07 PM by dem629
Or the Chinese, or the Germans?

And why don't we ever hear anyone from England putting on the accent when pronouncing Hispanic names?

I think Fareed Zakaria was right. He said people put on those pronunciations to make themselves feel sophisticated. (He said it's an attempt to be “ethnically cool.”) THAT is why there is selective "correct" pronunciations.


For the record, of course the people opposing her on these grounds are ridiculous. I'm just curious why people use the selective pronunciations.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. What selective pronounciations? I think it honors the indiviual to say their name correctly.
Nothing "sophisticated" about it.
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dem629 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. The ones I mentioned.
It's not universally applied when pronouncing names from all nationalities. Why is that?
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Personally, I will ask somebody "say your name again for me"? so I can get it right.
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dem629 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. That's good.
But I wonder why the people we're talking about (the people Fareed Zakaria said are tying to be "ethnically cool") don't do this for people of all nationalities.

I guess they'll never tell. Fareed was right, I think.
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BurtWorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Shouldn't they be presumed ethnically proud until proven ethnically cool?
Or maybe some feel funny *mispronouncing* their names just because they're switching code?

People get annoyed when others don't play by their rules, but instead of not giving a fuck what people do as long as it doesn't hurt anyone, they always have to denigrate it. I'm doing it right now. It's annoying me that anyone gives a fuck how others pronounce their names, so I'm trying to explain it away as a defect of human nature.
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BurtWorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. In New England, many people of French-Canadian heritage pronounce their names in Franglish
Boucher is BOO-shay not BOOcher (although in Canada it might be boo-SHAY). Desjardins is often DayJARdins (though in Quebec it would be more like dayzhardEHn).

There's no hard fast rule for what is an American way to pronounce a name. (Brits, by the way, can have some pretty odd pronunciations of names: Featherstone/Faversham, eg.)
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dem629 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. How do they pronounce "Tokyo"?
Or this?

字/会意字
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BurtWorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. Are those French-Canadian names?
:crazy:
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Kalyke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #2
17. My name is a simple name - four letters
and people constantly mispronounce it. They rhyme it with Tara, from "Gone with the Wind" or pronounce it as though it has a "o."

It's not that hard - and I appreciate when people say my name correctly, so I agree with you.
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BurtWorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. You don't have to roll the final Rrrrrrrr.
We're just talking about which syllable is stressed.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. I could never do that.
I tried imitating the Ruffles has Ridges commercial to no avail.
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dem629 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. Right. I'm talking about people who put on the fake accent.
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BurtWorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. You mean like MArria eenaKHOsa of NPR?
It's just a little latina pride.

(I do have to admit, I used to find it funny--odd and humorous--when anglo reporters on NPR would pronounce the name of Daniel Ortega's country NEEharrrAAAwa.)
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Badgerman Donating Member (378 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:19 PM
Response to Original message
11. Dam ggod thing some Slavs and Danes etc aren't so phoney sensitive about pronuciation...
Only ignoramouses put on fake accents trying to sound sophisticated...pure affectation. And as for the touchy-feely all inclusive set, when THEY try to pronuonce with a proper accent it is pure, unadulterated condescension! Screw the phonies. Their is a small subset of 'latinos' usually 2d, 3rd or 4th generation Americans who are faddishly demanding an exact Spanish inflection when you say their names...my solution, I simply DON'T say their names, I ignore them as if they do not exist and guess what soon they don't seem to mind if you mess up a little bit in pronounce Gonzalez as Gunzahlus or gone zahl is.

Phonies, PHOOEY!!!!
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BurtWorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. Thank you, badGERman
Edited on Wed May-27-09 12:35 PM by BurtWorm
:patriot:
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madmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:36 PM
Response to Original message
16. One word.....boehner.
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BurtWorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. Another word: Cheney
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SCantiGOP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 01:19 PM
Response to Original message
19. moron says...
"...and insisting on an unnatural pronunciation is something we shouldn't be giving in to."

As Winston Churchill said, "Ending a sentence with a preposition is something up with which I will not put."

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bigmonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 01:30 PM
Response to Original message
20. How can a person tell the "regular" American pronunciation?
As somebody who makes an effort to pronounce names as the owner of the name prefers, I find this "regular" pronunciation to be both elusive and arbitrary. I've run into foreign words that I actually have to mispronounce exactly the right way or people think I'm affecting an accent. It's ridiculous to have to go through such contortions just to keep ignorant people from facing their own ignorance.
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phosdick Donating Member (2 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-31-09 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
21. Don't be cruel... be understanding - he may be mentally or verbally challenged...
Edited on Sun May-31-09 10:49 AM by phosdick
Clearly, the man (Krikorian) feels that expecting him to actually pronounce the judge's name correctly would be tantamount to discrimination against his mental and/or verbal impediments. Certainly, we can't expect more verbal proficiency of him than we did of Georgè Büsh!
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