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deminks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 12:49 PM
Original message
Pelosi Statement on Congressional Briefings on Enhanced Interrogation Techniques
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
1. See also: CIA and Pelosi: Still No Proof She Was Briefed on Waterboarding
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 12:56 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. also "CIA (Letter) Admits That Info About Torture Briefings For Dems May Not Be Accurate"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3868046&mesg_id=3868046

I am not a fan of Pelosi. But I am skeptical about all this noise. Seems like more Republican distraction and Cheney-based misdirection.

The Republicans and Cheney were never very honest. I don't expect they are being completely honest now.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. The Republicans are being totally dishonest but so is Pelosi.
Edited on Fri May-08-09 03:30 PM by EFerrari
In 2002, there were already press reports about torture. It was the world's worst kept secret.

Instead of claiming she didn't know, she could say she's sorry she didn't follow up on reportS of abuse and torture and get everyone focused on an investigation NOW.
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FarCenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
3. Pelosi may be able to maintain "plausible deniability".
But not Rockefeller and Harman.
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Did they write letters of protest on this?
Have we heard from Harman or Rockefeller on this? If they did not protest, they really should resign. They did not do their jobs, and their omissions will have serious repercussions for Americans for a long time.
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FarCenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. She was apparently satisfied as to the legalities
Excerpt below from http://washingtontimes.com/news/2009/may/05/harman-queried-cia-on-interrogation/

It sounds as though she was satisfied as to the "legal questions", and was inquiring as to the "policy review".




Rep. Jane Harman, facing a likely primary challenge from the left flank of the Democratic Party, was one of the only lawmakers in 2003 to challenge the CIA's program of harsh interrogations, according to a little-noticed letter to the CIA that was declassified last year.

The California Democrat's position contrasts with that of a longtime colleague and rival, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. Mrs. Pelosi has in the past two weeks said she was powerless to stop the interrogation program, which critics say included torture, and that she was never told that the program was actually being implemented.

Mrs. Harman, on the other hand, did voice some objections in 2003.

A Feb. 10, 2003, letter she sent to the CIA said that the interrogation program "raises profound policy questions and I am concerned about whether these have been as rigorously examined as the legal questions. I would like to know what kind of policy review took place and what questions were examined."
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. As for the moral questions, I suppose that they thought they
were responding to Bush's actions by trying to get a law passed that prohibited torture.
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. I thought I heard about a letter being written.
Edited on Fri May-08-09 07:23 PM by JDPriestly
Did I also hear that Rockefeller filed a protest or objection letter on something? Was his on torture or on the surveillance or both? Does anyone remember?

Answered my own question in part. Rockefeller at least questioned the surveillance program.

http://www.democrats.org/a/2005/12/senator_rockefe.php

I don't know about the torture. They may have believed that Congress had done all it needed to do or could do to prohibit torture:

Congress has prohibited cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment of terror suspects. Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., said several extreme interrogation techniques, including waterboarding, are specifically outlawed.

"As some may recall, there was at the time a debate over the way in which the administration was likely to interpret these prohibitions," McCain said in a statement. McCain added that he was "personally assured by administration officials that at least one of the techniques allegedly used in the past, waterboarding, was prohibited under the new law."

October 5, 2007

http://cornellsun.com/node/25047

Looks like the Democrats passed a law to make sure the torture stopped when they got some power in Congress. I'm not sure what else they could have done other than write protest letters for the record (which Cheney would have dismissed as CYA letters).

Here is some of the text of Rockefeller's letter on the FISA violations:

July 17, 2003
Dear Mr. Vice President,

I am writing to reiterate my concern regarding the sensitive intelligence issues we discussed today with the DCI, DIRNSA, and Chairman Roberts and our House Intelligence Committee counterparts.

Clearly the activities we discussed raise profound oversight issues. As you know, I am neither a technician or an attorney. Given the security restrictions associated with this information, and my inability to consult staff or counsel on my own, I feel unable to fully evaluate, much less endorse these activities.

As I reflected on the meeting today, and the future we face, John Poindexter's TIA project sprung to mind, exacerbating my concern regarding the direction the Administration is moving with regard to security, technology, and surveillance.

Without more information and the ability to draw on any independent legal or technical expertise, I simply cannot satisfy lingering concerns raised by the briefing we received.

http://www.democrats.org/a/2005/12/senator_rockefe.php

I suspect that the Democrats' hands were tied. What could they have done without being accused of leaking classified information. They could have put something into the record, but they would have been punished by the vindictive Republicans had they done it.

Writing letters for the file was about their only recourse. But, of course, we have no idea and there is no record regarding just what they were told about the torture program.

This is a difficult he said, she said issue.

In such situations, I always ask who has the most motive to lie. Certainly here it is the members of the Bush administration and those who were involved in the torture. They would gain by implicating Pelosi, Rockefeller, etc. and shifting blame onto them. There is probably some blame due for all of those who knew about the torture, but most of the blame must fall on those who directly authorized it -- and they have the most to gain from lying about what they told Pelosi, Rockefeller and other Democrats. They may be hoping that by suggesting that Pelosi and Rockefeller are implicated in the scheme, they (the Bush administration officials) will not have to face charges.

It would be helpful if Pelosi and Rockefeller made some note in a diary or something on this. I don't suppose that they did even that. The statements made to them about the torture may have been made with so little fanfare that they really did not understand what they were being told. After all, the Bush administration and the CIA were and are masters of deception.
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FarCenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Democratic complicity in Bush's torture regimen
From December 2007 on the role of Rockefeller and Harman and Pelosi.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/12/09/democrats/

"The Washington Post reports today that the Bush administration, beginning in 2002, repeatedly briefed leading Congressional Democrats on the Senate and House Intelligence Committees -- including, at various times, Jay Rockefeller, Nancy Pelosi, and Jane Harman -- regarding the CIA's "enhanced interrogation methods," including details about waterboarding and other torture measures. With one exception (Harman, who vaguely claims to have sent a letter to the CIA), these lawmakers not only failed to object to these policies, but affirmatively supported them."

<SNIP>

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theoldman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
4. This situation is a tough call.
If your brother kidnapped my child I would beat you half to death to get you to talk. The odds are that you would tell on your brother. This is apples, now lets talk oranges. If you capture a soldier he will lie to save his friends. A religious fanatic will die before he confesses.
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deminks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. There are reports of scripted sessions.
In other words:

Torture enthusiast: Your cell took orders from Bagdad, didn't it? whack, whack, whack.

Tortured detainee: Yes, whatever you say, now stop.

I think this was task at hand.
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Beam Me Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #5
14. Exactly. They weren't looking for accurate information from torture any more
than they were looking for accurate information about WMD and "yellow cake". What they were looking for was intelligence to fit the established agenda (and to cover their already ignominious treason).
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
7. there you go, printing what ms Pelosi 'actually said' the facts will fuck up a lot of folks
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-08-09 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
9. The GOP likes to denigrate, distort, and decieve......that is a clue
Pelosi will emerge stronger after all Facts come out

The GOP is an elephant in deep quicksand.....you can only see the tip of the nose sticking out....poor GOP...stiull in denial...typ Bullies.....all they do is nit pick and whine....thats the only ammo in their Can....Cow chips
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