SoS Clinton apologizes for Afghan civilian deaths

[bigtree]

32 minutes ago

WASHINGTON (AP) The Obama administration took on high-stakes diplomacy with the leaders of Afghanistan and Pakistan Wednesday, seeking more cooperation against Taliban militants while apologizing for a U.S. bombing strike that Afghans said killed dozens of innocent civilians.

Meeting with Afghanistan President Harmid Karzai and Pakistan's Asif Ali Zardari in a prelude to their talks with President Barack Obama, Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton said Washington "deeply, deeply" regrets the loss of life, apparently as a result of a bombing there on Monday.

"Any loss of innocent life is particularly painful," Clinton said. Karzai responded before the cameras that he appreciated Clinton "showing concern and regret."

report: http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h-hrZnbYFs50kcKT8gjWlpJuNcuAD980RUR80


Afghan President Hamid Karzai, right, talks with Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton before the start of a meeting at the State Department in Washington, Wednesday, May 6, 2009. (AP Photo/Kevin Wolf)

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

1. An empty gesture while the killing goes on.

"We regret.."
"Mistakes were made..."
"An investigation is underway by the military.."

“What difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy.” - Gandhi

[malaise]

2. Ditto

Get the hell out of Afghanistan and Iraq

[bigtree]

4. yep nt.

[Liberation Angel]

3. Regret and sorry is not enough

Obama has embraced this war from the start...

now he owns these war crimes too

I had "hope" but news like this just maks me weep for these children and innocents.

Yeah war is hell

that is why we should not be there

[Psychic Consortium]

5. PC abhors violence of any sort. However Obama has no choice

in this matter. There is grave danger to the US in this
region. More than we know. He will be strategic
and time limited as much as he can.

Hillary works to bring about peace on her end.

They will be successful.

[joeybee12]

6. If Bush had a brain and Cheeny wasn't a nazi, we would have concentrated on

security Afghanistan and ignored Iraq which had nothing to do with 9-11...if we leave now, any gains whatsoever will be wiped out in a week.

[bigtree]

7. There is no 'grave danger' to the U.S. in Afghanistan

There is a danger to the interests of the administration in preserving their Potemkin democracy in Kabul, but the collateral effects of that militarism threatens to overshadow and cancel out whatever 'peace' their diplomacy intends.

Obama has a choice. He's chosen to ignore the lessons of the past and escalate the continuing military campaign to defeat an ideology there. Strategically, we're up to our necks defending a dubious ruler who is busy feathering and defending his corrupt regime. Where anyone expects to see peace breaking out of all of that I'm sure I don't know.

[Psychic Consortium]

9. PC sees danger. In a small part of the country.

The place is seen clearly.

Peace will happen, Hillary and Obama will pull it off.

[polmaven]

10. I'm going to trust the president on tis one...

I do think he likely has access to a lot more information than we do when it comes to these types of things. I doubt very much that anyone in this administration takes any pleasure in killing civilians for ANY reason.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

13. I'm sure the families of the dead feel great relief that they weren't killed for "pleasure".

Undoubtedly, the politicians and generals, will tell us they died for a noble cause.

“What difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy.” - Gandhi

[polmaven]

20. My point is, and you know it,

that the poster seemed to say that s/he knows more than the president about the amount of danger posed to the U.S., and that we are doing the bombing for reasons other than what is being stated.

With the previous administration, there is proof otherwise regarding Iraq.

I still feel that President Obama has a lot more information than does the poster to whom I was responding. This president will not continue with hostilities for political purposes.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

21. He's covering for a lost war by continuing it.

But, you're right about "political purposes". That's all it is.

Get back to me when the fearsome Afghans (who survive our Noble Cause) storm the shores of New Jersey.

[bigtree]

23. this poster doesn't need to know more than the next idiot

. . . to be able to gauge the adverse effects and consequences in Afghanistan of these collateral killings.

In the case of most of the incidents (as in the very last one two days ago), the excuse offered is that the U.S. had received 'faulty information' about the targets and a similar apology was offered. Not much special knowledge from the administration there.

I consider expecting our troops to fight and die in defense of the Karzai and Maliki regimes to be a primarily political effort as the goal is to effect some sort of political reconciliation or political stability behind our offensive attacks. To claim, as many do, that the Taliban pose some threat to our national security is a lie which folks indoctrinated into the rhetorical 'war on terror' eat up like cotton candy. To suggest as many more do, that the Taliban have any chance on earth of taking over Afghanistan is another fear-coated deception.

[polmaven]

27. Well, i guess we should all

be thankful that we have someone as in the know as you apparently are to keep us on the straight and narrow. You evidently have access to a lot more information than the president does.

[bigtree]

28. what a stupid defense

. . . as if Americans can't make sound judgments about the exercise of our military by the people we elect. Sorry you feel you can't make those judgments.

[polmaven]

29. Well, as I said,

I guess I will simply be thankful that we all have folks like you who are able to determine the actual threats to our safety without the need for any information. I guess youare right. Who NEEDS information? Who NEEDS intelligence briefings.....we have bigtree!

[bigtree]

30. now you're just being ridiculous

Do you read anything independent of the administration's reports and statements? I would suggest that you expand your reading to include reports and analysis outside of what the administration offers. I do take the time to read as much as I can, and I weigh what I learn against what the administration presents as their view. I work rather hard at it . . . every day. It's because of that level of dedicated research that I feel comfortable in offering an opinion here - often independent of what's being offered by the government and the military. I would again encourage you to find outside sources of information that you feel you can trust to weigh against the often politically compromised views offered by administration and Pentagon sources - including those offered by the president. That's just a basic exercise of our responsibility as citizens, as far as I'm concerned. In fact, I believe our government and military benefits from that independent learning and the sharing of that knowledge which folks here at DU are so wonderfully adept at. I'm sorry that you've taken such a myopic and presumptuous view of my own input. Best of luck with all of that.

[ShortnFiery]

31. I'm going to trust in Obama like the anti-war movement trusted in LBJ.

Continue to protest these ILLEGAL and IMMORAL occupations.

Has anyone considered that IF we pulled our military asses out of Afghanistan, the Taliban MAY not be attempting to bleed into Pakistan?

Oh boy, we're going to ramp up to 21,000 troops. :crazy:

Reload buddy, they're not all dead yet. :puke:

[polmaven]

34. Gee, no..

I'm sure NO ONE in the Pentagon OR the White House has considered that!

As I said in other posts in this thread....Unless you are in the position of being able to see all of the available information that the president sees, you are not able to fully know what is behind his decisions.

No sane person LIKES war. Dubya is not, imo, sane....President Obama IS sane. He will not continue with hostilities for a day longer than he deems absolutely necessary.

The Taliban MAY not be attempting to bleed into Pakistan.....MAY is not good enough for me. The president apparently sees evidence that they WILL "bleed into Pakistan. They already HAVE begun to re-establish their foothold.

[Liberation Angel]

11. I have to agree with you BT and the waste of tax dollars...!

The incredible drain on all our resources in fighting two wars of aggression while exacerbating the hostility against us is mind boggling.

I see more and more homeless and frustrated jobless, hopeless and driven to extremes of frustration in our streets and cities while we pour flames on these fires and kill civilians en masse.

I retain some degree of "hope" that Obama has the backbone and intelligence and humanity to correct an insane course of war and violence and there ARE signs of some progress.

But these mass killings of civilians only brings to mind, for me, the justifications used by the Nazis and the US in Vietnam and Southeast Asia and the events in Gaza and all of the appeasement and justifications used for socalled collateral damage which imperial states inflict and try to justify.

Where is the greater good here?

War s not the answer.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

14. Nixon had a "plan" too. It also involved killing a lot of people.

Hillary had a plan too. Remember her plan to support Bush's war?

[Psychic Consortium]

26. Obama is not Nixon. And he is not Hillary. She works for him now.

Obama has the intellect, temperament and moral core
to handle an innovative foreign policy.

He is also ruthless when fighting evil.

[The2ndWheel]

8. Must be a hell of a feeling

To be able to hold that much power over so many random people that you've never met. I'm talking generally, not specifically this administration. Just throughout history. Good or bad.

[Liberation Angel]

12. I have a word for it

Necrophilic

[MadHound]

15. Instead of mouthing pious platitudes, Clinton and Obama should bring the troops home

Instead, the death and destruction, along with the pious platitudes will continue, indefinitely.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

16. Pious platitudes are more PC than admitting to a lost war.

Besides, think of all the jobs provided for the MIC and speechwriters.

[MadHound]

17. Shades of Vietnam, eh?

The longer this keeps up, the more like 'Nam it looks.

And let's not forget Powell's own words to the Afghan PM regarding a big pipeline project "We can give you a carpet of gold or a carpet of bombs, it's your choice." Looks like Obama is intent on carrying out the "carpet of bombs" promise.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

19. Like Nixon, he has a "plan".

[Fireweed247]

18. Time to end the war on terror and pay for health care here at home

3,000 died on 9/11

100,000 die EVERY YEAR due to lack of health care.





I don't think the Afghanis or the Iraqis are really impressed by apologies. Just get the hell out now!

How is it possible our anti war president is responsible for this?

Why are we not in the streets protesting this bullshit?

[Cha]

22. How the heck did

this happen? Of course, it doesn't bring back the people who got killed but she's the one who has to apologize for someone's fuck up.

[Liberation Angel]

24. When will we apologize for the deaths of detainees who were tortured?

http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-05-05/how-many-were-tortured-to-death/full/

Approximately 100 detainees were murdered and/or tortured to death by the Bush administration.

How can we as a people allow such war crimes as these continue and go unpunished?

How can Obama do so and keep any "hope" alive?

I try to keep the faith but death and murder in my name and with my tax money is a crime, as is covering it up.

[bvar22]

25. As long as Obama continues to prop up....

...the incredibly corrupt puppet Mayor of Kabul, who was INSTALLED by Bush and Halliburton, ANYTHING we do in Afghanistan is doomed to failure.

The WORST, "unintended consequence" of our ruthless Occupation of Afghanistan and support for the puppet in Kabul is the radicalization of Pakistan. Our militant presence in Afghanistan and the killing of innocents is chasing the moderates into the arms of the fanatics.....and rightly so.

[Forkboy]

32. Color me revolutionary, but maybe we just shouldn't kill them in the first place.

I know, I know...that's fringe leftist talk! :silly:

[Liberation Angel]

33. No fringe

Nothing fringe about that.

Left wing holds the olive branch!

[Smith_3]

35. Hillary voted for the war. nt