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DeeDeeNY (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 07:26 PM Original message |
The “half of Americans pay no income tax” fraud |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 07:38 PM Response to Original message |
1. Deleted message |
Seen the light (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 07:39 PM Response to Reply #1 |
2. Welcome to DU!!!! |
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Laelth (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 07:44 PM Response to Reply #1 |
3. Well said. |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 07:55 PM Response to Reply #1 |
4. Deleted message |
Barack_America (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 07:57 PM Response to Reply #4 |
5. ? |
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dorkulon (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 08:08 PM Response to Reply #4 |
6. Self-delete |
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bahrbearian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 08:29 PM Response to Reply #4 |
7. Idiot is not a sentence, it doesn't end with a period. Idiot |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 08:34 PM Response to Original message |
8. We should remove the cap altogether and drop the rate from 15.3% to 6.2424% |
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DeeDeeNY (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 08:38 PM Response to Reply #8 |
9. You are right. |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 02:30 AM Response to Reply #9 |
33. Simple & brilliant - if you want to destroy SS. |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 02:41 AM Response to Reply #8 |
18. Social Security *is* solvent for the forseeable future. Raise income taxes at the top & |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 03:07 AM Response to Reply #18 |
20. No, DON'T privatize it. Just change it from a regressive tax to a flat tax... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 05:41 AM Response to Reply #20 |
21. It's regressive in collection, progressive in payout. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 10:01 AM Response to Reply #21 |
22. No, they say that since it is YOUR money, then YOU should be able to control its investment... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 03:18 PM Response to Reply #22 |
23. " when you in effect add 15.3% of a person's salary" |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 04:44 PM Response to Reply #23 |
24. Let's do the math, and perhaps this will show why... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 01:32 AM Response to Reply #24 |
29. The example has nothing to do with your original claim, which was that the current set-up |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 03:39 AM Response to Reply #29 |
34. btw, SS = 12.4%, not 15.3%. 1/2 paid by the worker from his check, 1/2 paid by the |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 06:16 AM Response to Reply #34 |
38. I was quoting the OP's numbers. If you have different numbers, then take issue with the OP! |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 06:35 AM Response to Reply #38 |
40. I understand perfectly well. But the *fact* is, SS taxes are 12.4%. |
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Dr.Phool (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 12:20 PM Response to Reply #40 |
48. They're probably counting the Medicare payroll tax in the 15%. |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 03:36 PM Response to Reply #48 |
49. yes, i already explained to the posters 2.9% = Medicare. fell on deaf ears. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-19-09 01:04 AM Response to Reply #49 |
68. WHAT F'N DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE WHETHER IT's 15.3% or 12.4% |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 06:28 AM Response to Reply #29 |
39. I made no such claim that they DON'T have to pay SS taxes for higher paid workers... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 06:38 AM Response to Reply #39 |
41. No, even "relatively speaking," employers don't pay less for high-paid workers. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 12:09 PM Response to Reply #41 |
45. The cost they would pay to government in the form of payroll tax WOULD be more... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 03:39 PM Response to Reply #45 |
50. not hard to understand, but irrelevant. employers aren't laying off workers |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-18-09 06:42 PM Response to Reply #50 |
63. Why should employers care if they're "covered"... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-18-09 06:51 PM Response to Reply #63 |
64. If they're competing against other employers with the same requirement, it's a wash. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-18-09 07:03 PM Response to Reply #64 |
65. To THEM payroll tax is a cost. Quit changing what I'm saying... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-18-09 10:17 PM Response to Reply #65 |
66. To them, everything is a cost. Wages are a cost, so they'd be less likely to lay people |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-19-09 12:51 AM Response to Reply #66 |
67. Now you are trying to say it is not a competitive disadvantage... |
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MajorChode (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 05:06 PM Response to Reply #21 |
26. Social Security is everyone's responsibility, not just the working class |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 01:38 AM Response to Reply #26 |
30. "Consider a business that pays its employees (and the owners) a regular wage v another business that |
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MajorChode (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 09:47 AM Response to Reply #30 |
42. I'll take that as a "yes" |
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Hansel (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 05:50 PM Response to Reply #21 |
28. During the Bush admin Social Security was used as one giant pyramid scheme |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 02:27 AM Response to Reply #28 |
31. I totally agree they took the money & need to pay it back, I simply differ over the mechanism. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 11:58 AM Response to Reply #31 |
44. You aren't working with what's proposed... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 03:44 PM Response to Reply #44 |
51. i certainly did work with your proposal, as you'd know if you'd actually read my post. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 04:19 PM Response to Reply #51 |
55. We're talking about payroll tax here, not income tax... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 04:46 PM Response to Reply #55 |
57. get the income tax piece in place first & i might listen - but the reverse will be the case. |
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TahitiNut (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 04:50 PM Response to Reply #8 |
25. Bad idea. Very bad. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 05:25 PM Response to Reply #25 |
27. I'm still not clear why you think this is a bad idea... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 02:29 AM Response to Reply #25 |
32. Totally agree. Wage increases to the bottom & middle solve the root problem. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 12:15 PM Response to Reply #32 |
46. And how do you propose forcing the employers to "raise the wages" of the bottom and the middle! |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 03:46 PM Response to Reply #46 |
52. same way you propose lifting the cap. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 04:13 PM Response to Reply #52 |
54. Where is it proposed that one should move this tax revenue to the general budget? |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 04:42 PM Response to Reply #54 |
56. it's implicit in the numbers; they produce more surplus, & and all surpluses |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 03:44 AM Response to Reply #8 |
35. Social Security tax (oasdi) = 12.4%. |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 04:11 PM Response to Reply #35 |
53. Alright, so it still shows 15.3% here as part of the *payroll tax* in the bottom corner doesn't it? |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 05:10 PM Response to Reply #53 |
58. I don't say it's "unfair". I say it's politically astute not to create a powerful |
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cascadiance (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 09:34 PM Response to Reply #58 |
59. That's the same argument they'll use with attempts at income tax reform... |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-18-09 12:31 AM Response to Reply #59 |
61. Nope, the difference is two-fold: |
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handmade34 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 08:50 PM Response to Original message |
10. I think also that "those who don't pay taxes.." |
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Rage for Order (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 09:06 PM Response to Original message |
11. More info here... |
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ConsAreLiars (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 04:11 AM Response to Reply #11 |
37. Jeezuz lord, you are certainly one wholly sick ass licker. |
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Rage for Order (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 10:40 PM Response to Reply #37 |
60. LOL. Hyperbole much? |
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Rage for Order (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-18-09 10:47 AM Response to Reply #37 |
62. Your silence is deafening |
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scrinmaster (563 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 09:27 PM Response to Original message |
12. I checked my taxes |
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roamer65 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 10:44 PM Response to Reply #12 |
14. No one at or under $20k of income should have to pay ANY federal income tax. |
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Omnibus (676 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 02:18 AM Response to Reply #14 |
15. Hear, hear! |
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uppityperson (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 02:27 AM Response to Reply #12 |
16. Being a dependent probably helped your parent(s) out though |
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many a good man (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-15-09 09:53 PM Response to Original message |
13. Over half pay more in payroll taxes than they do in federal income tax |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 02:39 AM Response to Original message |
17. While I sympathize with the message, I don't like the way the story confuses income tax & payroll |
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LooseWilly (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-16-09 02:49 AM Response to Original message |
19. Wait a minute, they're excluding payroll taxes when they cook the books? |
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Warren DeMontague (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 03:46 AM Response to Original message |
36. 95% OF AMERICANS DON'T PAY ANY TAXES AT ALL!!!!..... |
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Egalitariat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 09:50 AM Response to Original message |
43. Isn't the payroll tax for Social Security that they end up getting back? |
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nonconformist (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-17-09 12:16 PM Response to Original message |
47. Most corporations don't pay income tax |
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