Had a conversation with a Fair Tax guy this weekend.

[proud2BlibKansan]

I was at a political gathering and the Fair Tax folks were there tabling. So the guy tells me this long story about his dad who was retired from the railroad and had a great pension, had never paid into Social Security and got screwed when Uncle Sam came in and decided the railroad workers needed to pay into SS. I told him the teachers in some states also don't pay into SS and every one of them that I know works part time in another job so they can get some SS when they retire. They get a little more take home pay in their paychecks but without SS, don't have as much when they retire as a worker who did pay into SS. He said well we need to make SS voluntary and let workers choose if they want to invest and where to invest their retirement money. I said what about the workers who choose NOT to invest in a retirement fund, how will they survive when they retire.

So he says well we need to make it mandatory. I said "How is that different from Social Security then?"

He paused and said "Well the system is messed up, that's for sure. Nice talking to you." And he walked away.

:rofl:

Too easy.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

1. The problem is that the current tax system is really screwed up. Forbes' Fair Tax is not the answer

but something has to be done to simplify and streamline it. Then and only then will it be possible to have a clean progressive system

[proud2BlibKansan]

2. I agree

But the Fair Tax is taking the 'solution' too far.

[gratuitous]

3. Well, see, it would be coercion of a voluntary contribution

:crazy:

If you tilt your head just right, squint your eyes just so, it all becomes "fair." And after what we just witnessed in the mortgage market when an investment frenzy collides with an unregulated environment, a lot of people take it in the shorts thanks to fast-talking hustlers. It's quite unfortunate to lose your house or to suddenly be sitting in a house that's worth only a fraction of what you owe on it. How much worse is it to be on the brink of retirement, and because you wanted to make a few extra dollars in your self-financed pension someone scams you out of it entirely? Now what do you do? Work and save another 40 years so you can afford to retire in your 90s? Say "fuck it" and take the pipe? Starve in the streets while the talking chuckleheads tut-tut you on the teevee for being so greedy that you wanted a monthly pension of $1,100 instead of settling for $1,050?

[proud2BlibKansan]

4. Hard to see anything 'fair' about it.

Well it may be fair to them. But then this is just another financial scheme where it is what's best for 'me' and not for the people as a whole.

[Urban Prairie]

5. Uh, how does his "dad" now pay into SS

If he is already retired on a RR pension and never paid into SS while employed?

I'm confused.

:freak:

I am both a former federal government AND a former RR employee who is under 60 and disabled, I receive disability checks from my ex-employers and SS, and I don't see a deduction for SS on any of them.

That guy read a RW email or was just retelling a fable that someone else told him, IMO.

[proud2BlibKansan]

6. I was thinking that while we were talking

But he closed our conversation and walked away before I could bring it up.

[Toucano]

7. The Railroad Retirement Board's fund is an equivalent to Social Security

Retired railroad workers are well taken care of, and don't get screwed by Uncle Sam because they don't pay into Social Security.

"The Board administers a trust fund which operates at a substantial profit. In 2007, the fund recorded a net profit of $1.4 Billion, a return of 16.38% on its investment."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_Retirement_Board

[proud2BlibKansan]

10. So he was lying?

LOL

[Toucano]

12. Imagine that?

A conservative lying to defame a public institution and garner support for privatization.

That almost never happens! LOL!

[Fire1]

8. I think he contradicted himself, if I'm reading this correctly.

[proud2BlibKansan]

9. Exactly

He was promoting a voluntary retirement fund and then said well it should be mandatory. And in my dictionary, 'voluntary' and 'mandatory' are opposites.

[safeinOhio]

11. I might go for a flat tax of

10% on WEALTH of a half million, or so.