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ulysses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 08:22 PM
Original message
is it enough to simply elect Democrats?
No argument from me that it doesn't make things *better*, but is it enough to put our folks in office and then sit back like some celestial watchmaker?

Or isn't it simply a part of participatory democracy that we stay on their asses no matter to what party they belong?
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kiva Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
1. No, it's not enough.
Past elections have taught us that just having a D next to their names doesn't mean that our elected officials will automatically make anyone live up to the principles of their party--stay on their asses.
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trayfoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 08:36 PM
Response to Original message
2. We have to stay engaged in the process............
because many dems are really DINOs!
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 08:48 PM
Response to Original message
3. not at all -- they STILL need their feet held to the fire, even if they are DEM
Far too many of them get to Washington and get a memory lock on WHO their constituents REALLY are.
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TheKentuckian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 08:52 PM
Response to Original message
4. Hell no, but it is a start
Shutting down the Republicans would go a long way towards improving the Democrats as well. Even most of our righties at least can have a useful conversation and compromise some but 95% of the Republicans are only sane compared to say the Taliban and that isn't by a whole hell of a lot.
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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:04 PM
Response to Original message
5. No.
It's what they do after they're elected that matters more.
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deaniac21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:08 PM
Response to Original message
6. No,unfortunately poliitcians are politicans.
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KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
7. obviously not.
but there are many knaves on DU that would strenuously argue otherwise.
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
8. I 've posted this before...about why Obama needs criticism...here:
Criticisms, political pressure and Barack Obama
Tuesday Jan. 13, 2009 08:47 EST Glenn Greenwald

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald /

Just as Congressional Democrats have known for the last eight years, Obama will know that there is only a price to pay when he acts contrary to the Republican and Beltway "centrist" agenda, but no price to pay when he acts contrary to the agenda of his most ardent supporters (because they won't criticize him, because to do is to "tear him down," "help Republicans," act like a Naderite purist, etc. etc. etc.). That meek and deferential attitude -- aside from being a wildly inappropriate and even dangerous way to treat a political leader -- also ensures that one is irrelevant and taken for granted and one's views easily ignored.

When Obama does things that warrant praise -- when he appoints someone like Dawn Johnsen as OLC Chief, or defies Beltway demands by going outside of the intelligence community to find his CIA Director -- he should be praised. When he does things that warrant criticism -- such as going on national television to talk about the need for a special process to allow the use of "tainted" evidence against Guantanamo detainees, or when he openly contemplates naming someone as CIA Director who supports rendition and torture, or when he votes in favor of warrantless eavesdropping and telecom amnesty -- he should be vigorously criticized. When he makes statements without any apparent basis -- such as Sunday's assertion that Iran is pursuing nuclear weapons -- he ought to be made to account for that claim and show evidence for it. That's just basic accountability for a political official.

Like all politicians, Obama is not intrinsically good. Good things don't happen by virtue of the mere existence of his presidency. His presidency will be good only and exactly to the extent that he does good things. Pressure and criticisms make his doing those good things more likely (there is a quote from FDR, which I cannot find but am certain commenters will quickly cite, where FDR privately instructed his supporters to publicly criticize him for not doing X so that he would be able to do X more easily).

Obama is about to become one of the world's most powerful political leaders, if not the single most powerful. He begins with sky-high approval ratings, his political party in control of Congress by a large margin, and enjoys reverence so intense from certain quarters that such a loyal following hasn't been seen since the imperial glow around George Bush circa 2002. He's not going to crumble or melt away like the Wicked Witch if he's pressured or criticized. The far more substantial danger is that he won't be pressured or criticized enough by those who are eager to see meaningful changes in Washington, and then -- either by desire or necessity -- those are the voices he will ignore most easily.


More of a very interesting read about how the "other side" is vocal and will move Obama to "their direction" if we don't stand up for what we on the left believe in at.............

REALLY...it's an EXCELLENT READ...whether you like to read Greenwald or not...it's challenging.
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald /
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:17 PM
Response to Original message
9. for now it is
then I'd give them a few months of actually being in office, legislating and such, before trashing them.
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ulysses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. I might agree if,
between the election and the office-taking, the newly-electeds went into a sort of cryogenic freeze through which no stupid advice could penetrate. And then, if in the first few months of being in office, they were rendered biologically incapable of making stupid decisions.

Sadly, neither is the case.
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. it won't be all bad
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backscatter712 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
11. No. It's not enough.
People like us need to put them under constant political pressure to push them to do the right thing - lobbyists from corporations, big oil, right-wing groups, etc. already have them under pressure.

We need to keep sending our Congresscritters letters, emailing them, calling them, occasionally throwing rallies at their offices & such to let them know that they can't just throw a few platitudes at us then go back to business as usual - we expect them to work for us.

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PVnRT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
12. Yes, dammit, now quit your fucking whining and shut up
God, you Naderites just want a bunch of Kucinich clones running everything so that gays can marry all willy-nilly and stuff.
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ulysses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. I'm a hater, it's true.
A guy's gotta have his hobbies. :D
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PVnRT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-09 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. Braves suck
Feel the hate.
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ulysses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-09 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. hell, between them and the Sooners,
I've about decided that I'm going to become an anti-sports crank in my old age.
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mudesi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-09 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. I detect sarcasm
But some people might not....
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