Just What We Need: "boycott American products and the use of the US currency"

[leftchick]

fuckin A! When is this madness going to end. There is an effort allover the world to boycott not just Israel but the US currency and trade as well. What great timing, eh?


I posted this earlier then did some more googling. This is extremely dangerous for all Americans. Except those in congress I suppose.....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=4795492&mesg_id=4795492

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Tuesday/Frontpage/2445104/Article/index_html

PUTRAJAYA: Former prime minister Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad yesterday slammed the United States for being the main driving force behind Israel's atrocities against the Palestinians.

Calling for citizens of the globe, including the Muslim states, to boycott American products and the use of the US currency, Dr Mahathir said the power to cripple Washington lied solely in the people's hands and not their governments who were "scared stiff" of Uncle Sam.

"The US dollar has got nothing to back it... and the only reason that it is still being used is because people still accept the dollar as legal tender.

"If people stop using the US dollar, the US cannot make any money. It will then be very poor and it will have to stop its production of more and more weapons to kill people.

"That is how the US uses its money and people who use the dollar are actually contributing towards the manufacture, invention and production of weapons to kill."
He also called on countries to reduce their trade with the US.

Dr Mahathir said he would meet several non-governmental organisations and members of the government to push for a boycott of American products.

[Junkdrawer]

1. Had to come sooner or later - more worrying is when T-Bills are no longer seen as a safe investment

That will be Game Over.

[leftchick]

3. I agree

This situation has been decades in the making. I am sure more people will be inspired to partcipate because of the American perfect storm of economic issues + worldwide boycotts + endless costly wars, will be the end of American Empire building. Oh to have someone sane in charge. :(

[Fleshdancer]

2. We still make stuff?

Good for us, lol!

Seriously though, the use of US currency won't end any time soon. Interestingly enough, this morning NPR said almost half of US money is not in America. It still amazes me how our currency is used in so many other countries.

[leftchick]

5. weapons

that will be our number one export if this keeps up. I read this morning China is sick and tired of backing our currency.

[asjr]

8. I saw something the other day that

had a tag that said Made in the USA. I have forgotten what it was. I was in shock we still make things here. My granddaughter's Christmas present was An American Doll. It was made in China. When we moved most of our companies off shore--China, Mexico, I have a coat made in Yugoslavia, we lost our manufacturing base. We employ people from other countries but nothing for our people here. I suppose those companies made money from cheaper labor, but we lost our souls.

[awoke_in_2003]

19. The only way...

you can buy oil from OPEC nations is with the US dollar. If they ever allow Euros to be used the dollar won't be worth the cotton it is printed on.

[Chemical Bill]

26. Hmmm...

you don't think that this boycott has anything to do with that, do you? After all we only invaded Iraq after they started selling oil in euros, and we really started to make noise about invading Iran after they started selling oil in euros. Perhaps there may be some economic warfare mixed in with this nationalistic and religious call to boycott dollars.

Bill

[Political_Junkie]

4. blowback's a bitch.

expected this, or something worse...

[sinkingfeeling]

9. Ditto. We really know how to win the 'hearts and minds' of others, don't we?

[MADem]

6. What a fucking idiot that guy is.

He says: "If people stop using the US dollar, the US cannot make any money. It will then be very poor and it will have to stop its production of more and more weapons to kill people."

Yeah, like Uncle Sam will sit back with his weapons and stay poor? Really. More likely, he'll use his weapons to go take all of the crap he needs from that former PM and anyone else who strikes his fancy. Didn't this idiot learn anything from WW1? When you get too harsh with an economic powerhouse that has fallen on hard times, the resentment comes back to bite years later.

Of course, this guy is just talking out his ass (he's already flushed the next administration before they even take office, the putz). I rather doubt his rallying cry will be heeded.

[OwnedByFerrets]

28. Every word he said is true. Our currency is faith based. Do your homework.

[MADem]

31. His words were exhortative. You think it's going to happen? I have a bridge to sell you.

ALL currencies are faith-based. So fucking what? Why do you think that's news, to me or anyone else?

That's why people will take pieces of PAPER for things of value. No one runs around carting gold or silver coins, or pieces of eight anymore, in case you have not noticed.

Why do you think that comment was...profound, or something?

Give us all a list of how many first-line nations or empires sat back on their asses and let that sort of thing happen without taking aggressive steps to reverse the trend.

You also seem to forget that, even with a shitty ecomony, the US is a nation of CUSTOMERS. That's why people love to sell their shit over here--because it's a MARKET. What are these boycotters going to do, sell to each other? That'll do nothing but screw their own bottom line in a huge way.

One way to motivate an economy? Start a war. A big war. I don't endorse this method, but it is one way to do it.

War is a racket--Smedley Butler said that for a reason. But rackets make MONEY. BIG money. You want to see recovery in the auto sector? Get those bastards making more Hummers and tanks. The manufacturing sector? War creates a requirement for bombs, bullets, aircraft, caskets, uniforms, boots, Meals, Ready to Eat...the list goes on and on and on. If wars require stuff, manufacturers will MAKE stuff. In order to make stuff, they have to hire employees. Employees make money, and spend money. Voila--you've got a recovering economy before you know it.

Someone needs to do homework, all right, and it's not me. A few cherries do not make a pie--your perspective, like the perspective of that clown doing the pontificating in that original article, is woefully incomplete.

Hit those books.

[Statistical]

7. He has a doctorate?

If people stop using the US dollar, the US cannot make any money. It will then be very poor and it will have to stop its production of more and more weapons to kill people.

Seriously? That is his "understanding" of international economics? If people "stop using the dollar" the US can't "make" any more money.

If people stop buying (or reducing buying) T-bills then by supply and demand rates will rise and the "cost" of our debt will take up a larger portion of our national budget which will require budget cuts to other area (including the military). That is a far cry from "stop using the dollar" and it certainly won't stop the US from "making" money.

[roguevalley]

17. no one who his remarks appeal to will have any influence on the

economics of us. We doubt we trade very significantly with most of the arab world. Europe's panties are so wound in with ours that no one will go along with his vision. Pepsi and Coke might take a hint but I doubt the sheiks who control the middle east will stop buying cars, etc from the west. His frustration speaks louder than his expertise.

[Deja Q]

44. Some professor from Russia said the US would break into 5 pieces, of which

Alaska would go to Russia (probably because of the oil :eyes: )

He had a degree too. Got it from the same place as this bloke: A cracker jack box.

[L0oniX]

10. Again: pull out all of our bases and troops and terrorism will diminish.

Of course these people who are calling for this don't seem to know that Sweden is the 3rd largest exporter of weapons in the world. That being said, if I were them I would be calling for the same action. Bottom line is we must stop our military industrial corporations and the money hungry, blood thirsty, war mongers in office. We do not need to be the world police and world bully. We have our own problems to deal with and spending 600 billion every year on our military is working against us. Just think what 600 billion a year could do for our health care problems.

[anonymous171]

21. It wouldn't diminish, it would just be redirected.

Tribal feuds would get precedence over hurting the "Great Satan."

[Hydra]

11. I'm surprised it took this long, frankly n/t

[AndyA]

12. America should return the favor by withholding all aid to the countries

that boycott our products and currency.

After all, they probably wouldn't want it anyway, right? :shrug:

[Fumesucker]

30. Egypt and Israel get the bulk of US aid..

I know damn well we aren't going to cut Israel off.

[High Plains]

38. Don't forget Colombia! $6 billion for Plan Colombia so far...

...and just as much coca and cocaine as ever. Yippee, it's a jobs program!

[Winterblues]

13. This idea that Israel and Republican America have or "Better to be Feared than Loved"

Just seems to have a few drawbacks. :crazy:

[ThomWV]

14. It is very difficult to Boycott American wheat and corn and you gotta have dollars to buy it.

[Deja Q]

45. Quite.

Symbiosis...

[rockymountaindem]

15. Let me know when this actually materializes

I'd hardly take the musings of a retired politician who clearly has no understanding of how the economic system works as a sign that anything concrete is actually going to develop.

[McCamy Taylor]

16. It's a free world. No one can make other countries buy American if we act like pigs.

[Sultana]

18. He may want to boycott some muslim states...

There are not helping the Palestinians.

They may want to boycott the internet, its an American invention :D

[anonymous171]

20. lol The US is a nation of consumers, not producers.

[ThomWV]

34. it might suprise you to take a look at our export numbers.

[Gwendolyn]

22. Grow up leftchick. Many people do read.

No offense. :)

[leftchick]

24. apparently

you are not one of the many. Nice try though. :eyes:

And if I recall, I could be your mother, so age is irrelevant.

If you are serious about where we are watch and listen to some truth....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x257025

[Gwendolyn]

25. I will always listen...

Thanks mom.. although somehow I think we meet in the middle. :)

As jaded and a hard sell as I am, I will read. I do think I'm right though about human nature.

[NoPasaran]

23. Mahathir's understanding of economics is almost on the same level as many DUers'

That's not a compliment, by the way.

[MADem]

32. I have to agree with you.

I remarked on his poor grasp upthread.

[OwnedByFerrets]

27. Dr Mahathir has stated the unstatable....the only reason the dollar is

worth a dime is because people believe it is. Once that belief is crushed, our money is worthless. Why do you think Cheney has been putting all his wealth in foreign currency.

[MADem]

33. The only reason the EURO is worth a Euro is because of BELIEF.

The only reason the RUBLE is worth a ruble is because of BELIEF.

Why do you act like that statement is a revelation, or something?

As I said upthread, we don't prance around carrying gold or silver coins anymore. EVERYONE carries paper.

Cheney put his money in Euros because he was currency speculating. Buy low, sell high. People actually DO do that sort of thing, you know--some people do it in a big way, others do it in more modest fashion. I used to do it all the time when I lived overseas. I'd wait until the local currency was a "good buy" and stock up. Then, when the currency fluctuated and became more expensive, I'd be able to spend my discount pounds, rials, late-great lire or pesetas (later Euros), yen, yuan, etc., etc., on rent and other necessities and reap a "discount" from managing my buying schedule.

This guy is talking out his ass--he's hitting themes that excite people who DON'T understand how economies actually work.

[JackRiddler]

35. No. Belief in an economy's productive power...

its long-term ability to meet obligations (in other currencies too), its competitiveness on the world market, etc. This belief isn't just faith but comes from an assessment of the economic fundamentals. By any measure the dollar's now suck. Not that the US has no productive base at all, but definitely: too many dollars in circulation for it!

[MADem]

37. When the dollar is not worth much, it's time to SHOP, bay-bee.

When the dollar is in the toilet, that trip to Disney World is affordable to even that Turkish family. Go up near the Canadian border and count the Canadian vehicle tags over here, shopping at WalMart and filling up on cheap gas. Back in the eighties, the Japanese came over here and bought up EVERYTHING...land, buildings, half of Hawaii, Pebble Friken Beach...a decade earlier, it was the Saudis who were spending it hand over fist--they bought half of New York, it seemed.

No one's talking "long term" here. The dollar has been up, and the dollar has been down.

I lived in Japan when the yen went as high as 280 to the dollar--I was living pretty large then. Those were the days.

Currencies fluctuate. We're in a bad patch now, but so's the rest of the world. When we get a cold, a lot of other economies get pnuemonia. I'm not ready to give up on this nation, even if some gloom and doomers are.

[JackRiddler]

39. No, You are for gloom and doom -- I am for for hope and love.

The "gloom and doom" comes not from those who see it, instead of denying it like you; it is an objective assessment of reality.

The gloom and doom comes from the inevitable workings of the capitalist/productivist/growth-at-all-costs system, which has burned the planet, killed the seas, generated wars, reduced all meaning to money, given dominance to gangsters (the Bush regime) and speculators (the "financial sector" of which Enron and Madoff are not the exceptions but the PARADIGM), and predictably bankrupted the peoples and countries, this one finally after many others.

To acknowledge this is not "giving up on this nation," it is to make the first, necessary step to saving the nation. I want to save the nation, you apparently want to advance its destruction. Why are you for gloom and doom?

Your proposed recovery program begins with the notion that some families from Turkey will now, thanks to the cheap dollar (and the global depression?!), suddenly afford to go to Disneyworld (tm). The dollar's been cheap for a while, how is Disneyworld (tm) doing? Maybe it's not cheap enough? How about three or four dollars to the euro, maybe then the Turkish invasion will arrive to save Disneyworld (tm) and its low wage drone workers?

Meanwhile, you've seen a lot of Canadians take advantage of cross-border gasoline-price arbitage, a product of the irresponsible US policy of externalizing the vast costs of keeping oil cheap -- let the Maldives sink and the Iraqis die and the patsy taxpayers pay for this -- one of the central causes of disaster. While they're doing this, they also pay a visit to the low wage drone workers at Walmart, where they stock up on cheap products made at vast Chinese labor camps.

Also, the Japanese (or someone) will want to come over here and buy a lot of land. No doubt! And you think this is going to cause economic recovery, How? This is a proposal for the same kind of speculative bubble that got us here, nothing more. How does this raise demand for the cheap-dollar low-wage US workers, as long as demand and therefore investment are in fact still dropping around the world? And when will you consider this strategy a success? When Americans achieve the same standard of living as the Chinese? Or perhaps the Indonesians?

You remember some happy time as a student or young person (I presume) partying, thanks to the cheap yen (= a long period of stagnation in Japan!). And you think this, too, is a paradigm for US recovery?

"Currencies fluctuate," you say, and it's true. The rest of your statements show why you have very little clue why, though in the best CNBC mode you'll be cheerleading in both directions.

Unlike gloom and doom and the market chimeras that have destroyed so many and so much, let us choose love and hope, a system that sustains its ecology, in which peoples live at peace, work to create and justly distribute what they make.

Never mind. I am a liar. Truth is, I'm just a mean old man, picking on you because you and your laughable gaps in logic make an easy and delicious target for a cathartic beating, as the Titanic sinks.

[MADem]

40. "And you think this is going to cause economic recovery?"

Why YES, I do!

Why? Because it's worked BEFORE. That IS how economies, from Ireland to Japan to Canada and elsewhere, recover. I've seen it a number of times in my lifetime.

I wasn't a "student or young person" who was "partying, thanks to the cheap yen." I was an adult living and working in Japan for the US government. That was a few decades ago, too. My point, that apparently whooshed right over your head in your eagerness to categorize me in snarky fashion, was that currencies fluctuate, economies do dip (or dollars do get unreasonably strong), but most importantly, that you're not going to get that exchange rate nowadays, and you haven't been able to get it for a long, long time.

See what ass-uming gets you? It sure doesn't help you win any discussion points.

One thing you don't seem to get about money, despite your protestations--it really DOES ebb and flow. This is the nature of commerce. And another thing you don't seem to get is that tourism is actually a huge sector of our economy. So's "higher education." So are a number of other ventures that bring foreign investment and consumers to our shores when the market conditions are right. We are a large cog in a WORLD economy, you see.

Something you don't seem to get about PROPERTY, though--it doesn't ebb or flow. The Japanese or Saudis cannot "take it with them." The best they can try to do is "Buy low, sell high."

The world did not end when "Them Saudis (of course, the word used sounded more like bag heads) bought up all of New York," or "Them Japanese done bought up Pebble Beach and all of Hawaii." They bought when the dollar was cheap, and even though they lost dollars when they sold their properties because they waited too long, they sold when the dollar was dearer, so they didn't take a complete bath.

All of this, like it or not, has very little to do with your rather pompous and didactic sermon on love and hope in the short term. Nice words, those, but pretty meaningless in the context of this discussion. Getting angry at me because I'm not about to stop the world and demand that everyone drive a hybrid or a bicycle and grow organic tomatoes in their backyard or do other "peace, love, and sustainable" stuff is pretty silly, too.

It's the MARKET, that you disdain, and not your angry lecturing, that drives that sort of behavior.

People thought that London couldn't get any filthier or more unhealthy back in the days of "London Fog"--which was actually soot from all the coal fires. Go there now--the air is quite breathable, much nicer than LA. And they haven't put "commerce" or "growth" on the back burner, either. They haven't "drawn down." They're simply behaving sensibly. If you want to drive your car into the city, you certainly can, but you are going to pay for the privilege, and that has had the effect of limiting private vehicles entering the city. They are, of course using cleaner climate control fuels in their buildings nowadays, too. And they have WAY more people and buildings now than they did fifty to a hundred years ago. "Growing smarter" or "growing sustainably" is not impossible, and when market forces press hard enough, it IS what happens. Most homes in the US didn't have a single compact fluorescent bulb in 1995--now you'd be hard put to find one that doesn't have at least one, and frequently many more than that, today.

Your last paragraph is nothing but insults and suppositions, save the first two sentences, which are right on the mark.

I'm probably older than you--I'm retired. And if anyone has "laughable gaps in logic" it's not me. You do, though, have an inability to argue without being rude, obstreperous, and personally insulting, to say nothing of simplistic--but that's your issue. It doesn't, FWIW, help your arguments, that approach.

You have a nice day, now. Take a Happiness Pill or something. Your rather condescending method of communicating makes you seem angry and out of sorts. When the economy recovers in a few years, as it will, put a little salsa on your words and make a nice lunch of them, why don't you?

:hi:

[JackRiddler]

41. Oh yes, indeed:

You write:

"My point, that apparently whooshed right over your head in your eagerness to categorize me in snarky fashion, was that currencies fluctuate, economies do dip" ...

...and crashes happen, countries default, currencies melt down, empires fall, civilizations decay, ecosystems collapse, and even the French Revolution is known to have occurred. These are all more or less frequent types of occurrences. Your faith that one type of historically common event happens a lot in happy land (Disneyworld) and the other type never does is merely that, faith. Of the self-serving or self-justifying variety. In the absence of facts, at the moment.

"It's the MARKET, that you disdain, and not your angry lecturing, that drives that sort of behavior."

The "market" is a myth to explain and justify the power and economic relations under capitalist political economy as a natural state. It's the "market," which you worship, that has led to cyclical as well as century crashes. We're at the start of the latter right now. One of those that at best will be called a Great Depression. No doubt you'll come out with some celebratory point that the Great Depression turned into the longest boom in Western history in just 15 years and one world war later.

And if any thanks are to be given for that, then to policies that explicitly curbed capitalism and the unleashed flow of capital exemplified in the "currency fluctuations" you wish to now count on. It was thanks to the New Deal and Bretton Woods.

As for angry lecturing, why not go review your posts on this thread, which precede my own, for a sample. It's clear that the tenor of this thread from the OP on down angered you, and you arrived to bully on behalf of last year's platitudes with claims of superior knowledge.

Sir/Madam, "Happiness Pills" are for Disneyworld visitors. Being tanked on them apparently makes one immune to irony and subtle discursive logics, so please go ahead:

Last one to post here wins!

[MADem]

42. Oh, forgive me. I thought you were a "gloom and doomer."

You're not that.

You're one of those "apocalyptic" types.

Gee, France is doing just fine after that revolution, now, aren't they? I was there not too long ago. They managed to get over it, you see. Shit does happen. Some people (not all) are bad. Wars do occur. Sure, we'd prefer they didn't, but we're still evolving.

I'm not "bully(ing) on behalf of last year's platitudes" or claiming superior knowledge. My posts aren't full of secret wisdom, they're simply a recitation of obvious facts. The market is not a myth, but I don't "worship" it either. It simply IS.

You go wait for the world to end, if that's what floats your boat. I think humans are much, much smarter than you, evidently, credit them. I think they're capable of solving problems and bettering their lives and the lives of future generations.

My glass is half full, you've knocked yours over, apparently, and spilled all the contents. Not much hope of discussion, given that gulf in viewpoint.

Have a nice day! Do have the last word if you'd like. It's apparently important to you.

:hi:

[JackRiddler]

49. "France is doing just fine after that revolution, now, aren't they?"

We agree.

[leftchick]

50. omg

one of the best posts ever here!

:yourock:

[JackRiddler]

51. * blushes * thank you

[okiru109]

29. i think that has been in effect since at least Dec 07

i don't even think we can afford to buy Chinese, let alone American, anymore.

but i am sure once we get the new admin in office lots of folks will feel a lot better about us.

[Deja Q]

46. I hope so too. The President-Elect comes across as articulate, intelligent, and is a family man.

Eminently respectable, complete with a degree he didn't get out of a box of cornflakes, unlike the ranter in the article posted by the OP.

[JCMach1]

36. Might happen in Malaysia... Ain't gonna happen here.... they would have to shutter the malls

American culture is nascent in Arabia.

[Deja Q]

43. Phew, thank Allah for offshoring.

:shrug:

:sarcasm:

[MadMaddie]

47. Does that also include importing into America?

Is it only me? By destroying our manufacturing base as the Republicans have, it becomes a matter of National Security if America is cut off from the world.

The US must be able to create it's own products and maintain a manufacturing base to support America. It's not rocket science.

Drives me crazy.

[Quantess]

48. Dr Mahathir Mohamad is naiive and misguided if he thinks boycotting American will solve anything.

In the past 8 years, the US government has shown that it doesn't give a shit about the prosperity of its people. Our government won't change its policies just because other countries are boycotting us.