It's not about Proposition Hate or Bubbatollah Rick.

[formercia]

Perhaps someone has already addressed this and I missed it it. That's what I get for not following the issues very closely. After all, it's really not an issue that affects me directly. It does. It affects everyone.
It was Ken Starr petitioning the California Supreme Court to have all of the same-sex marriages invalidated that began to trouble me. I asked myself why the religious right was going to so much trouble to engage an issue that didn't affect them at all. It's not as if Gay people are going to have lots of kids and take over the World.
It's about case law. Starr is trying to set a legal precedent where religious belief by a 'majority' can be used to compel the courts to impose those beliefs on those who do not share them.
The Dominionists and Reconstructionists want to impose 'God's Law' on everyone and turn the US into the Christian version of Iran. This is just one shot in a monumental battle. Once they set a legal precedent, it's just a matter of time before they impose some other religious edict on the population.
One of the pro prop. 8 (prop. Hate) made the comment that if they lose this battle, their cause was lost.

It is the duty of the courts to protect the minority against the imposition of the will of a majority if that will contravenes the constitutional rights of that minority. Let us hope they do their job.

[ihavenobias]

1. That second to last sentence sums it up perfectly.

K & R

[formercia]

2. The sideshow and all of the yelling and screaming

is a distraction to get people to look the other way while they sneak in the back door.

[formercia]

6. Left Behind

The elites forgot to tell them about that ending.

[Bluenorthwest]

3. And half of DU is perhaps unwittingly

promoting Ken Starr's dominionist agenda.

[formercia]

4. Bright and shiny moving objects

I'm sure the reich-wingers have their minions here keeping the pot stirred-up.

They have their eye on the prize too.

Some times I think this place acts like a flock of Guinea Fowl.

[formercia]

5. I'm not trying to discount the concerns expressed here.

The GLBT community's concern is well justified. I think the right fans the flames in an attempt to polarize the issue even more than it is, in order to distract from the global agenda which is dangerous to everyone who might disagree with the religious-right.

[yardwork]

9. Yes, and the right has chosen a group to scapegoat.

History tells us what happens when a group is scapegoated, especially during times of economic disaster.

We have numerous posters here telling us that gay people must change our approach precisely because the decision over gay rights has been moved from the courts to the voting booths. In other words, these posters have embraced this shift without question and are telling gay people that it's our fault we don't have rights, because we aren't being persuasive enough to the voters who now determine our fate.

[formercia]

19. It happened in Germany

The Nazis didn't go after the Jews right away. First they went for the disabled and retarded, the communist, gays, gypsies. They went after minorities the German people found easy to hate.

This is how it always begins.

[Chulanowa]

14. I haven't seen any such thing

Perhaps you could point me in the correct direction so I can vent my spleen?

[BrotherBuzz]

7. The issue before the court....

The issue before the court "presents a conflict between the constitutional power of the voters to amend the Constitution, on the one hand, and the Constitution's Declaration of Rights, on the other," - Jerry Brown

Oral arguments begin in March and I have faith that Jerry, and his 110 page brief submitted to the court last Friday, will carry the day. Interesting, a Jesuit (Jerry) locking horns with an Opus Dei, (Starr).

I really hope our victory and the death of Prop 08 is the final nail in the coffin.

[formercia]

23. There has been a big battle between the Jesuits and OD

ever since OD replaced the Jesuits from their powerful position in the Vatican. Ratso had a thing against Liberation Theology and OD sided with the right-wing reactionary elements in Latin America.

[yardwork]

8. Thank you for getting it.

[formercia]

22. I wish more people would

The people who are behind this are the same people that put Hitler in power. It's just a new generation of the same gang.

We know how that turned out.

[EFerrari]

10. There's another angle here, too, that I haven't figured out yet.

Frank Schaefer said very directly in his interview with us that the radical right doesn't get nearly as upset about gay marriage as they do about abortion.

So, what does Warren get out of getting all his zombie sheep focused on gay marriage?

[formercia]

13. They just chose the easiest path

A smaller minority to attack. Attack abortion and you take on a lot of people over a broad spectrum of the population.

It's easy to get people worked up over a few sodomites.

They thought it was going to be an easy victory. Sorry.

[EFerrari]

15. Less blowback. That must be it.

I hope we make the motherfuckers wrong. We can't keep letting this get framed as about gay marriage. Warren stirs up hate against a lot of people.

[formercia]

17. It's been in planning for a long time

We know all the names: LaHaye, Moon, Falwell, Robertson and on and on.

John Mc:evilgrin: said it when he was talking about SCOTUS: "Let's finish the job."

Too bad, John. Better luck next incarnation.

[AntiFascist]

11. K&R, EXACTLY !

Thank you for stating it so clearly.

[Hydra]

12. None of this is unrelated

Which is what some of the people trying to shut down the discussion are trying to say.

If the LBGTs win the fight for Equal Rights, the Churches are screwed. All of this BS tinkering with the law stops. The Discrimination stops, or the people go to jail.

You don't have to support the LBGT community to see that this has to be derailed- no one can be considered less human under the law without it hurting all of us.

[earth mom]

16. Excellent OP & Thread.

:thumbsup:

Needs a better title though because I almost didn't click on it because it sounded like it was going to be dismissive of how important this issue really is.

[formercia]

18. Glad you stopped in.

I have this attitude problem. I'm really not as outrageous as I first appear. :hi:

[earth mom]

20. Glad I stopped by too!

:hi:

[ooglymoogly]

21. Kr nt