What is Liberalism

[mkultra]

There has been much discussion lately about Obama's position on the spectrum and the meaning of Liberalism.

I say Liberalism is about insuring individual rights and freedoms.
Insuring Equality and Equal opportunity.
Protecting the weak and needy.


To me, these things include elements of private ownership and free but regulated markets.

How has Obama neglected these concepts through his selections(aside from Hillary as SOS of course :) )

[w4rma]

1. Note: Liberal economics are different from Progressive economics. (nt)

[nomorenomore08]

5. If by "liberal" you mean "neo-liberal," then I certainly agree.

And if by "progressive" you mean old-fashioned liberal, in the FDR/New Deal sense, then I agree even more.

[w4rma]

7. Yes. Outside of America "neo-liberal" / "neo-conservative" are known as "liberal" economics. (nt)

[nomorenomore08]

10. Right, whereas what we call "liberalism" here would be called something like "democratic socialism"

elsewhere. And by that I mean Feingold/Kucinich liberalism, not the wishy-washy DLC variety.

[w4rma]

11. Agreed. And that is, of course, very different from Communism. I call myself a progressive. (nt)

[nomorenomore08]

14. Indeed. Communism and Fascism are merely two sides of the same coin.

Absolute state control, as far as I'm concerned, is an absolute evil. Not much of a gray area there for me.

[mkultra]

16. and thus the birth of Liberitarian socialism?

ala Chomsky?

[nomorenomore08]

20. Bingo!

:hi:

[DJ13]

2. and free but regulated markets.

Larry Summers DE-regulated the markets.

I think many are upset with the notion that after the fox has emptied out the henhouse you dont put the same fox in charge of filling up the henhouse with chickens.

[mkultra]

4. summers is no right winger

no conservative would admit that free trade is bad for the environment of third world countries.

[mkultra]

8. the Clinton era policies are NOT resposnible for this meltdown

Bush and Bush alone is responsible. If your interested in dueling on this point, ill be happy to oblige you.

[nomorenomore08]

3. I think you're right. It's not so much where one falls on the political "spectrum,"

but rather, what his/her base-level values are. So for instance, a liberal (or progressive, if you prefer) and a libertarian could find common ground on a lot of issues of personal freedom, even if they disagree completely on economic policy.

I think the most important thing that the extreme right (authoritarian capitalists) and the extreme left (authoritarian socialists, though they seem to be less common than the former) have in common, is that they prioritize social order over personal freedom to such an extent that the rights of the individual become unimportant, and everything from political repression to censorship of media/arts/academics becomes seemingly justified.

And before anybody flames me, this is coming from a proudly left-of-center Kucinich Democrat...

[mkultra]

6. i agree, i think both of these schools of thought

could either be classified as fundamentalist or rather use such means to obtain the overly prized ends.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

9. A rag-back of political positions with no underlying theme, adopted by one "gang" in politics.

I don't think there is an underlying theme between liberal vs conservative positions.

Left and Right are very much like groups of football fans, or the Greens and the Blues in ancient Rome.

I suspect that if we all woke up with amnesia, we might very well find that, for example, the supporters of higher taxation and spending, tighter restrictions on abortion, a more militaristic foreign policy and tougher equal rights legislation banded together against the supporters of separation of church and state, gay rights, tougher drug laws and the spread of capital punishment.

[nomorenomore08]

12. Good point, that what is considered a coherent political philosophy often isn't.

For instance, how does one reconcile "small government" with restrictions on abortion, or draconian drug policy? And on the other side of the spectrum (what we call "the left"), there's a bit of a fine line between promoting "the common good," and unjustly restricting personal freedoms.

[MedleyMisty]

13. I think it's kind of like Christianity

You make up your own definition of the word and then proclaim that you belong to the tribe.

[mkultra]

15. well, i think LIberalism has a tighter definition

that was actually recorded by others for future reference.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

17. In Australia, the Liberals are the right-wing party...

It's not a well-defined term.

[mkultra]

18. in US english it is.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

24. No, even in US English, there is a great deal of ambiguity about it.

There are plenty of issues where I could happily make a case that either position was the liberal one, and neither case would be much stronger than the other.

[ZombieHorde]

19. Conservatism is taking responsibility for yourself,

liberalism is taking responsibility for your community. Many liberals consider the whole world to be their community.

[mkultra]

22. actually Conservativism

is about limited government and spending along with individual freedoms and self determination.

Of course, the religous, war mongering, spend and borrow right is nothing like is nomenclature.
Liberalism is also about personal freedom.

I think the communal aspects assumed into liberalism are really more communistic.

[ZombieHorde]

23. I don't see how our two definitions are different.

[Greyhound]

21. You left out recognition of the commons, that which we all benefit from

and is necessary for society to continue. Our society's needs outstripped Maslow long ago, yet we seem stuck on mere survival as the only imperative.

"Necessitous men are not free men." - FDR