Merseyside (UK) plant to punch out Chevy Volt

[FarCenter]

The Chevy Volt looks set to be made in the UK at the Vauxhall production line at Ellesmere Port, it has been claimed.

If the plan goes ahead, Volts could be flowing off the Merseyside production line early in 2011, Autocar magazine reports.

Moles from General Motors - Vauxhall's owner - suggest Business Secretary Lord Mandelson gave the project his broad blessing earlier this week.

GM sources alleged that Mandelson was keen to secure the deal for the UK and has agreed “outline government support”.

Most likely, Mandelson has pledged government support if GM agrees to the move. Car company execs will now crunch the numbers in a bid to persuade the powers that be to stump up cash or tax breaks.

http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2008/12/03/uk_govt_blesses_volt/

[hlthe2b]

1. So much for our heated "Buy American" debates....

:shrug:

[FarCenter]

3. Business, finance and political leaders are among the least patriotic Americans

So why would anyone be surprised at this.

[Subdivisions]

2. We're going to bail those assholes out just so they can open

plants in Brazil and make Volts in the UK.

WHAT THE FUCK!!??!!!11!

[Kalyke]

5. OK... pick what you want.

Do you want them to start making the Volts as soon as possible? Because, if you do, then they have to make them at a factory already tooled to do so.

Or...

Do you want them to employ Americans? If so, then you'll have to wait on the Volt for several years while they retool American factories.

You can't have it both ways... yet.

[csziggy]

15. A recent story here was about the Chinese buying American factories

Dismantling them, and rebuilding them in China. Why can't American car manufacturers do the same in reverse? Or why did they not tool some of the non-operating American car factories to build electric vehicles here?

For the second question, the answer is that the lobbyists paid by the American car manufacturers were too successful - they got the stricter standards delayed or eliminated in the USA while Europe and other countries have been requiring more fuel efficient vehicles. And our spineless legislators at the state and federal levels have gone along with it.

No wonder Congress is giving the Big Three so much flak - it is their guilt showing!

[Barack_America]

7. Congress said no.

So now GM is turning to the UK. If you're going to ask a country to bail you out, you're going to have to produce jobs in return.

[Subdivisions]

10. Whaddya mean Congress said no? I specifically heard Pelosi

say yesterday that allowing the auto industry to go down was not an option. I admit that after the election I've let life's other matters seep into my daily routine. Did I miss something?

[Barack_America]

14. I'm glad that Pelosi feels that way, but there's still no deal...

At least not that I have heard of. :shrug:

I don't honestly think that this UK deal is going to happen. But it is a cleverly timed threat as the bailout fight heats up.

[riqster]

20. Congress said "Come back with details"

Hearings are tomorrow. No 'NO' has been said.

[EnviroBat]

12. I think we've slipped into some parallel, retarded universe.

I can't believe what I'm seeing with the events unfolding before us here. If I clench my jaw any tighter, my teeth are going to bust out of my mouth.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

17. Maybe in parallel retarded universe the Volt will save GM

The fundamental problem with American carmakers, as I see it, is that their structure and corporate culture is derived from a self-image that dates to about 1962, when they owned the whole world. I don't see how the Volt, or *any* individual successful product is going to change the basic calculus of this situation. This is a systemic failure, and unless the Big Three are radically restructured, there is simply no way they can continue to survive. Throwing money at the problem may stave off disaster for a while (and for that reason I'm not necessarily opposed to bailing them out) but let's be honest here - The fundamental problem is that they have failed to adapt to changing times.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

18. Do you have some kind of basic objection to non-Americans being employed?

Toyota employs Americans. Volkswagen employs Czechs. Renault employs Indonesians. Products are build where it makes the most economic sense to build them. International corporations, by definition, employ people from many different countries. There is hardly a case to be made that GM is producing the Volt in the UK because labor costs are lower.

Do you have even the slightest idea what would happen to GM's international market share were it to move all of its production to the United States?

[Romulox]

24. Citi bought a Spanish company for $10 billion of bailout money recently.

DUers were indifferent...

[NV Whino]

4. Way to go, GM

Nice way to put Americans to work.

Now, let's see, where are our UAW members today?

[Barack_America]

6. This is the only leverage GM has against Congress.

Congress is all too willing to throw money at Wall Street, but when automakers turn to Washington (for a fraction of the money Wall Street got) to save millions of American jobs and accelerate green technology, Congress said "no" (claiming that the Big 3 had a "bad business plan"...yet they rewarded companies that gambled on mortgage assets Vegas-style).

So, this might not be a popular point of view around here, but good for GM. I sincerely hope that they don't take their business elsewhere, but I'm glad they're threatening to do so.

[Nederland]

8. This will be good for Britain

They are hurting a lot worse than we are right now and need the jobs more than we do.

[EnviroBat]

11. Ok, the stupidity of these automakers and people on this board

is fucking staggering. So you want our tax dollars to bail out a corporation so they can provide jobs for people in BRITAIN? You're being sarcastic right?

I've staggered into the fucking Twilight Zone here?

[muriel_volestrangler]

13. Are you saying you'd rather that GM turns down UK tax pounds that are on offer?

The UK government seems willing to provide government support to GM, at a union plant that has plenty of worries of its own (eg http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2008/11/12/union-fears-for-vauxhall-s-ellesmere-port-plant-100252-22239482/ (note the UK unions coordinate with the US ones), or http://www.chestereveningleader.co.uk/news/Vauxhall-workers-reassured-over-Ellesmere.4665397.jp ), but you'd rather that went out the window?

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

16. That's a very good point.

But seeing as this is DU, the initial reaction to anything like this is going to be one of ire and derision. If you look back through some of the other threads on the topic of the US auto industry, you'll find some people decrying the fact that GM even owns profitable overseas divisions. My personal feeling is that this mindset is part of what landed GM in trouble in the first place, but obviously others will disagree.

Muriel, I'm interested to have your opinion on something: I've been living in the UK for four years now, and perhaps it's just down to the sorts of people I associate with, but I haven't seem this same attitude here. I find that many people here are quite proud of owning and using British-built products (Triumph motorcycles and Land Rovers come to mind) but I haven't seen the same sort of animosity towards foreign products here that I've seen in the US. Maybe that's just an artifact of my mostly associating with white-collar professionals during the New Labour years when I've been here. I'd appreciate it if you could shed any light on this subject.

[muriel_volestrangler]

19. Not so much as DU seems to have; perhaps we British have been resigned to it for longer

There was much more talk of 'buying British' in the 70s and 80s; but the 1 volume manufacturer (which underwent a name change every few years - I tend to think of it as 'British Leyland', which you can use to date me - it made the Mini, Rover, and at one time, Land Rover, Jaguar, and Triumph cars too - I suspect Triumph motorcycles were separate by then) had a reputation for bad cars, and industrial disputes which looked silly from the outside, and it doesn't seem surprising that it gradually went under. People tend to think of Ford and Vauxhall as British in a sense too.

British manufacturing has in general declined earlier than American; Thatcher's fights with the unions in the early 80s is part of it, though lack of investment in research and development has always been worse in the UK, so I suspect most of it would have happened even without her. But it's true that the left in Britain is quite keen on international trade; overall, it supports the European Union. The rejection of NAFTA, or a hypothetical North American Union, by the majority of DU does look more like Britain in the 70s, I think (when Labour had more anti-EEC people than the Tories did; now, of course, the Tories want free trade, but nothing more, out of Europe, while the left is keener on trans-national bodies).

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

21. It's interesting that you should bring up British Leyland.

I'm familiar with their troubles. When I was sixteen I wanted nothing more out of life than to own a 1973 MGB (pre godawful North American spec rubber bumpers) and read everything there was to read about the British auto industry in the 70s. I didn't realise that the UK had anything equivalent to the "Buy American" mantra at that time, though. Anyway, I'm digressing. I have to wonder whether the troubles being experienced by US automakers right now might in some way mirror the demise of British Leyland. The particulars are very different, but in purely psychological terms I can't help but equate both with the sort of kinetic sculpture that slowly tears itself to pieces.

Sorry for the rambling. I don't think that was very coherent. But the Home Office is kicking me out of the country in sixty days, so perhaps my head is in a bit of a bad space at the moment. Thanks for your comments. I'll try to process them and respond with something useful later.

[Nederland]

22. Nope

I'm opposed to all the bailouts, auto or financial.

[muriel_volestrangler]

9. When was the last time GM exported a car to Europe, rather than building it there?

Did people really expect the production of the Volt for the whole world to all be done in the US?

The Financial Times said this was likely, back in July: http://gm-volt.com/2008/07/24/gm-considers-chevy-volt-plant-in-england/

Ellesmere Port, is, of course, unionised, eg http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpool-news/regional-news/2008/02/23/fears-460-jobs-could-go-at-vauxhall-s-ellesmere-port-plant-64375-20513848/

[Romulox]

23. All you anti-labor zealots need to calm down. GM makes cars in Europe FOR THE EUROPEAN MARKET.

[IDemo]

25. They'll be extra energy efficient if they come with Lucas electrics

[FarCenter]

26. Why do the Brits drink warm beer?

They have Lucas refrigerators.