Imagine if Bush's social security privatization plan had passed congress in 2005 in light of crash

[Politics_Guy25]

In light of recent events, I was just pondering that. I can't imagine how bad things would be right now. Retirees would have no source of government pension income whatsoever because it would have been wiped out by the stock market crash. Many would probably be close to having nothing left right now. Thank god our senate and house leaders had the courage to stand up and prevent this when Bush was at the height of his influence in February 2005 just after his 2nd term commenced.

At the same time, I can't say that I'd have a lot of sympathy. The voters would have got exactly what they voted for. Just glad it didn't happen though. Also, maybe it would have permanently killed any semblance of GOP chances in the upcoming election.

[chill_wind]

1. I've thought about that quite a few times in recent weeks, too.

We can't let Republicans anywhere near the oval office and the major reins of Congress again for a long, long, long, long time...

[irish.lambchop]

2. I don't want to imagine it.

My mother depends on her social security. I don't know what we would have done.

[lelgt60]

3. I don't agree with all your points...

1. The SP500 is down 21.8% from November 1, 2005 until yesterday. About the same from March 2005. While not great, hardly "nothing left"

2. The plan as proposed was to put a "portion" of your social security into the market, not the whole thing.

Still, I think we are fortunate that it didn't pass. Unfortunately, many more people have the rest of their retirement savings in 401k's which might not have fared as well, depending on what investments they made, and when.

[elocs]

4. I have seen FactCheck.org used to refute McCain claims or support Obama claims, so fair is fair:

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/more_social_security_spin.html

More Social Security Spin
October 2, 2008
Obama-Biden ad misrepresents the Social Security plan McCain supported. Again.
Summary
An Obama-Biden TV ad once again twists McCain's position on Social Security.

* It claims he backed a "plan to risk your Social Security in the stock market." In fact, the plan McCain endorsed in 2005 would have been voluntary, and workers could have put only one-third of their Social Security pension fund taxes into private accounts.

* The new ad also asks viewers to imagine "your future retirement benefits" invested in Lehman Brothers, AIG or Merrill Lynch, three firms that collapsed recently. In fact, the accounts in the plan McCain backed could not have invested in any of those stocks directly. They would have been allowed to invest only in a few government-run stock or bond funds with risks spread over many companies and industries..

Analysis
This is becoming a pattern. In a Sept. 19 article we criticized an Obama-Biden ad for its false insinuation that Sen. John McCain favored massive cuts in current Social Security benefits. And in a Sept. 20 article we criticized Obama for claiming in a stump speech that Social Security recipients would have had their money tied up in the stock market if the plan McCain once endorsed had been enacted. That was also false. Nobody who is now older than 58 would have been allowed to invest in Bush’s proposed private accounts.

There is more at the link. We cannot use sites like FactCheck buffet style, quoting them when it suits us and disregarding anything we do not like.

[votetastic]

5. I thought today's workers funded today's the Social Security of today's retiree's

And the individual accounts are mostly "virtual"... In other words, my deductions are going to a current recipient of Social Security benefits.

[elocs]

8. That's pretty much it. There is no actual account, but they do know how much you have paid into SS.

Under the Bush SS plan I would have been eligible to invest a portion in some very conservative stock funds that likely would not have recently have suffered big losses. If you think about it, contributions that were invested in a simple passbook saving account would have made something. We have enough on McCain that we really do not have to puff up accusations against him. FactCheck is good on calling out both candidates for making what they see as being at least not totally honest claims.

[Not Me]

6. I am not wealthy by any means, but my retirement (8-10 years from now) is

based on a 'three-legged stool':
- Social Security (defined and dependable)
- Defined benefit retirement plan (defined and dependable), and
- 401k/457 plans which are invested approximately 60% equities and 40% fixed securities.

I can live without hitting the 401k/457 for a while, so I can afford to be somewhat aggressive.
But that is only because of the sure nature of the other income.

[GoesTo11]

11. I'm much less comfortable now.

I don't qualify for social security.
I don't have a defined benefit.
I only have 401k type plans.
And that one leg just got chopped in half.

Not quite true. The other two legs of my stool are working longer and selling my house.

[yy4me]

7. As a senior, I cannot tell you how devastating this would have

been. Social Security is, for many of us, the only thing that keeps us from the streets. This lifeline does not go very far as it is. I resent the fact that it is called an entitlement program. It was paid for by all workers. It is our due. There are many of us who never had the opportunity to buy 401K's, have no pensions. We had jobs that paid fairly but not excessively. All the fancy extras are a rather new invention.

We had little to invest. In my case, what my husband had available to invest toward our retirement is worth a very small fraction of what it was a year ago. He has recently died. I know he would be crying to see all that he saved for be worth so little new. I hear that we might have to wait 5 or 6 years for things to return. Want to bet that a lot of us whose retirement money was partly in stock will be in real trouble? Sale of stock plus S.S. was to keep many of us afloat and some of us may not have that much time left on this planet.

To the crew in Washington responsible for all of our distress, go to blazes and thank heaven you lost on the privatization issue. I, and countless others would be homeless. Bunch of self serving idiots. I cannot wait for 1/20/09. From November 4 until then still gives **** time to mess up things even more.

[aikoaiko]

9. My entire organizational retirement plan is in high growth stocks, and I'm still at 6% ave growth

[bertman]

15. aikoaiko, would you mind sending me a list of those stocks. Thanks.

[aikoaiko]

16. TIAA-CREF: high growth fund (I forget the name).

tiny little bits of lots of stocks.

Next time it get backs to 14000, I'm diversifying.

[bertman]

18. Thank you.

[cliffordu]

10. I'm thinking bluehairs would have stormed the white house by now....

[WoodyM]

12. Social Security

was instituted by FDR. Everything FDR put in place for working people the republicans every since have tried to undo by going at them with just a small change at a time. Slowly chip away. Social Security was one of the things they were wary of attacking because of its popularity. This privatization plan was just an attempt begin the destruction of SS by depriving it of income.

[bvar22]

13. Better to call it the "Republican Plan".

We are not running against Bush*, but there are some Republican seats in jeopardy for 2008.
They should share the blame.
Privatizing Social Security has been a Republican plan since FDR.
It has also been supported by the Republican Wing of the Democratic Party, the DLC.


"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone

[leftofthedial]

14. the fucking repukes would have hit another trifecta!

[unblock]

17. things would have actually be JUST FINE right now.

with extra fuel for the fire, things would have kept on humming for longer.

the meltdown we're having now, we would have had in 2009. and it would have been even bigger. and obama would have been blamed.

[Th1onein]

19. It would have put off the current crash until Bush left office.

And the Dems would have been blamed for it. That was their plan. They knew it was coming.

[CreekDog]

20. McCain would have voted for it; Obama against and we'd be kicking so much ass

and it would be repealed next year.