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Palin Outcome Tonight: "Cue The Comeback"???

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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 06:45 AM
Original message
Palin Outcome Tonight: "Cue The Comeback"???
Edited on Thu Oct-02-08 06:46 AM by leftchick
I sure hope she is wrong but I doubt it. :(



Cue The Comeback by Michelle Cottle

Will Palin get pushed into a sinkhole of cringe-inducing incoherence tonight? Don't bet on it!


http://www.tnr.com/politics/story.html?id=0038dbb2-ef88-4096-9aa7-5e17fb3b3e91

<snip>

Don't bet on it. The smart money says Palin will emerge with, at most, superficial wounds. In part, this is about the expectations game: Post-Katie, the bar has been set so low for Palin that, unless she faints or vomits on air, her team will rush to declare a victory--not just for her, but for all of Joe Six-Pack America. But it is also about Palin's particular skill set, the audience she's playing to, and the nature of the political media.

First, let's consider the expectations game as it specifically infects the Fourth Estate. Assuming Palin survives the entire 90 minutes, aiding the McCain camp's victory spin will be the media's bipolar, whipsaw approach to covering public figures. Whenever a candidate gives a notably good or bad performance in a debate, on the stump, or at some other random gathering, the media rushes to declare it a defining, game-changing moment. We then immediately and completely recalibrate our expectations based on the assumption that said candidate will never recover/stumble again. Sarah Palin gave a great convention speech: She is a grassroots rock star destined to save the McCain campaign! Sarah Palin gave a terrible interview: She is a clueless loser destined to sink the McCain campaign! Or forget Palin. How many times did the media prematurely pronounce a candidate toast this cycle? (I'm sure the Hillary and McCain campaigns kept a rough count.) You'd think people who cover politics for a living would be less inclined toward such hysteria than civilians. Instead, we're so much worse. It's not about whom journalists favor or disfavor. It's about our professional obsession with watershed moments and clean story lines. Going into the debate, Palin's stock with the media could hardly be lower, and so she is primed to benefit from the soft bigotry of low expectations.

Also aiding Palin will be the burgeoning Gwen Ifill Scandal. It seems that conservatives discovered only this week that moderator Ifill, herself an African-American, has a book due out on inauguration day about the impact of the Obama candidacy on race in American politics. Title: The Age of Obama. News of the book--along with the McCain campaign's insistence that it had no knowledge of it--earned the top spot on yesterday's Drudge Report. And just like that--poof--conservatives have their scapegoat: Any disappointing moments in Palin's debate performance can now be laid at the feet of a moderator who was out to get her.

There is also the possibility that Ifill will involuntarily let all this hubbub influence her own performance--causing her to treat Palin either overly gently to avoid charges of bias or overly tough as a way to prove that she can't be cowed. (And even if she doesn't, some segment of the electorate will nonetheless scream loudly that she did.) A few weeks back, when every criticism of Palin was being rebuffed with charges of "sexism," I suggested to my husband that Ifill was the only journalist who could handle the gender card-obsessed Palin team in a debate. I feared male moderators in this post-Hillary landscape would be so concerned about appearing sexist that they would wind up behaving awkwardly, either pulling too many punches or coming across as grossly avuncular and patronizing. (And even if they didn't, the McCain campaign would nonetheless scream loudly that they had.) Ifill could just be Ifill. Alas, now Ifill can't just be Ifill. She has become Gwen Ifill: African-American Author of a Book Exploring the Brave New Era In Politics Ushered in By African-American Presidential Candidate Barack Obama. She now carries her own baggage, and while I'm hoping that she can rise above it and avoid becoming a major part of the debate analysis, I'm not exactly optimistic.

As for Palin's performance itself, my guess is that it is likely to come closer to her 2006 gubernatorial debates than her 2008 media sit-downs. Sure, the stakes are higher and the issues less familiar--but both in past debates and in some of her non-Katie media exchanges, Palin has displayed a solid ability to tap dance around questions she can't or doesn't want to answer. Neither does she typically flinch when answering a sensitive inquiry about, say, what she would do if one of her daughters wound up pregnant as the result of being raped. (Yes, she was really asked that. And she patiently smiled when explaining that she would "choose life.") She also thrives when there is another candidate or candidates to play off of--often by employing a kind of motherly scolding to suggest that her opponents are being naughty and childish. (See Politico's Alexander Burns for more on this.) And while Biden isn't the stuffed shirt that some of Palin's '06 competitors were, he does look--and often sounds--every inch the political-establishment type that Palin has made a career of dismembering with her cutting remarks and cutesy nose scrunching. No one expects Palin to know more than Biden about, well, anything. She need only hold her own in a verbal jousting match with one of the Senate's legendary gabbers.
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bigscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 06:56 AM
Response to Original message
1. Everyone I know
Edited on Thu Oct-02-08 06:58 AM by bigscott
is going to watch the debate just to watch her screw up. Like watching the Super Bowl for the ads. nobody I know (and they are not all dems) will be swayed either way by the substance - they just want to see her fuck up. i am sure she will not disappoint

peace
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tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 06:58 AM
Response to Original message
2. If she is absolutely perfect tonight, and gets some jabs in at Obama
and Biden, she rises to "below average". One good debate will not save her, more importantly, one good debate for her would do nearly NOTHING for the mcPOW campaign.

If Biden shows up and gives the answers he usually does, we will be fine, no matter what she does. And, that is the worst case scenario.
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Vinca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:00 AM
Response to Original message
3. I can't imagine Palin will be much better than she was with Couric
unless the moderator isn't doing her job. She's nothing more than a wealth of generalities. I think she's gotten very far on her looks and she knows it.
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demokatgurrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:47 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. Oh she will, she's been practicing and memorizing
for days on end. She'll have her talking points down, and will get them in, regardless of what questions are asked.
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Jade Fox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 10:53 AM
Response to Reply #10
23. But she's been practicing and memorizing since the RNC.....
and it didn't do any good so far. It is obvious when Palin is mouthing pat answers. And anything not rehearsed throws her completely off track (like the oh-so-hard question about what mags/newspapers she reads).

The Republicans are winning the war of nerves here, convincing people that we somehow have not seen the real Palin. We have.
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ixion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:01 AM
Response to Original message
4. I'll be interested to hear if she can speak English
because I've not heard that from her yet.
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mikeytherat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:02 AM
Response to Original message
5. Palin displays a solid ability to tap dance around questions she can't or doesn't want to answer
OMFG! Someone actually wrote that!

:rofl:

Solid tap dancing? Like "um..." followed by seven seconds of silence? Perhaps a restating of the question just asked to provide exposition?

:rofl:

Whatever the author is smoking should be banned internationally - it appears to cause The Stupid.

mikey_the_rat
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Sherman A1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:05 AM
Response to Original message
6. Agreed
The bar is set so terribly low for her that she will as David Brooks said "rise to the level of mediocrity" . She will be going for the sound bites and the quips. Her answers will be short and the ones that aren't will cause her problems. I think Ifill will do a good job as moderator (but the RW will scream foul no matter what). Joe really needs to just answer the questions and be pleasant when doing so. He should ignore her for the most part (while being pleasant on a human level) and let her make whatever screw ups she does.
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:19 AM
Response to Original message
7. The media will probably call it a win for her just if she doesn't fuck up
In the end Biden will have creamed her but that won't be the story on the news, except maybe MSNBC.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #7
19. The media will call a win for her, even if she does fuck up. Wait for it.
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #19
22. If every american would just turn the damn TV off right after the debate
Edited on Thu Oct-02-08 10:45 AM by shadowknows69
This country might make up its own mind for a change. The mind boggles at what we could accomplish were that the case.

edit to add: Groupthink works for good or ill.
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Habibi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:35 AM
Response to Original message
8. Feh. Even if she and McCain get a bounce from this debate
we're still too far out for it to matter. If she rises a little after this, it's just that much further for her to fall in the next few weeks.
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demokatgurrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:46 AM
Response to Original message
9. I think that unless she drools or says something toally insane
the spin will be that she "did what she had to do", and that she answered her critics, and she will give McCain a bump in the polls.
On the other hand, if Biden commits the tiniest gaffe, mispronunciation, malapropism, stammer- anything- he will raked over the coals. If he's deferential, he will be called weak. If he goes after her, he will be called a bully.

I'm afraid this is one we can't win, folks. But not to worry, Obama will kick McCain's ass in their next debate.
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Smart Guy 4 Freedom Donating Member (31 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:51 AM
Response to Original message
11. All Gwen has to do is just let her talk and she will commit
suicide on the TV right before your eyes. All she can do is barely remember her talking points that is why in the Katie C interview she was answering a question and in the middle she said "OH" and went on to babble as though she had just remembered what she was allowed to say.
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beac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:55 AM
Response to Original message
12. It REALLY pisses me off that the writing of a book seems to be being referred to everywhere as
the "Gwen Ifill Scandal." What is SCANDALOUS about writing a book? Controversy, maybe (due to the fact that the McInsaniacs apparently didn't vet Ifill either and are just NOW hearing about her book)-- but "scandal"?? Um, NO.


That said, I predict that Gwen Ifill will do the same kind of TERRIBLE job she did moderating the 2004 VP debate. She's an AWFUL moderator and WILL probably over-compensate by being super 'deferent' to Spiro Igloo and going for Biden's jugular.
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Gin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:58 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. did they get the questions? if not...she will stumble.. IMO
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Jim__ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 07:58 AM
Response to Original message
13. Is it true that no follow up questions are allowed?
According to Katha Pollitt in The Nation, the McCain campaign demanded and got that the format of tonight's debate not allow follow-ups. That sucks. Palin can say anything she wants and no one can point out that she's not answering the question. Not answering the question is her strong point.
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VWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 08:02 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. No follow-ups, but rebuttals are allowed, so
Biden will have to point out her evasiveness.
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MadinMo Donating Member (519 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 08:01 AM
Response to Original message
15. Seems to me they will think they HAVE to wire her.
I can't imagine they will trust her to 90 minutes of ad lib. She suffers from oral diarrhea.
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Mike Daniels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. According to past opponents she rarely used any of her full time in prior debates
Edited on Thu Oct-02-08 10:26 AM by Mike Daniels
It sounds like she does her respective sound bite for the question and that's it. She doesn't attempt to drag out the answer or improvise in order to fill the given time limit.
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MadinMo Donating Member (519 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. She has no message to impart then, does she.
Good!
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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
17. Primed to declare her the winner merely by showing up and not causing an International incident
Mika, Ms. Greenspan, Kelly O'Donnell et al. -- have the Free Ride Express warmed up and ready to go.
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RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 10:23 AM
Response to Original message
21. conservatives will have their scapegoat no matter what
independents are the ones who hear Palin and ask wtf was McCain thinking.

women, also, have left the republicans since the Palin pick. Women, iirc, were supposed to flock to McCain because he chose her. That assumed, of course, that women were too stupid to understand that Palin is to feminism what Bush is to democracy: a killer.
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northernlights Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
24. what the MSM doesn't get is...
they're no longer really calling the shots. They call them every time, and they are wrong every time. Even the moderate lefts like Slate are calling it wrong every time.

Too much is at stake and too many people have been too badly burned by this administration. So too many people are paying attention and no longer accepting media lies over their own ears and eyes.

What struck me most about what I've see of the Palin interviews is the obvious fear/panic in her eyes when she's trying to come up with an answer. It's one thing to bs your way through a state-level debate, where you need to bone up on 1 or 2 issues, know the local culture and can sound like you know what you're talking about. Putin as a direct, immediate threat to Alaska would fly in Alaska. It's just not going to work in the US as a whole, where it's pretty well understood that logistical and financial centers are first targets (cut off their heads so they don't know what to do), not arctic backwaters. And enough geography known that Moscow is closer to the east coast than the west.

All their panic cramming sessions are backfiring, because they've destroyed her self-confidence and in doing so, have destroyed her ability to fudge, tapdance, pretend or cutesy her way through.

But nobody can cram the breadth, depth or complexity of the issues national leaders face and have that info readily at hand to apply to unexpected questions.

So she's left drowning in the big pond. Her old ways are failing, and she has nothing to replace them. She's in so far over her head it's not funny, and she knows it. They've set up multiple softball interviews and she's been been scared and flopped for every one of them. Snarky returns, eye-rolling or nose wrinkling just aren't working any more. Just like Gore's high schoolish sigh-heaving, eye-rolling and attempts at physical intimidation killed him in the debates. But trying to give serious answers highlights shocking ignorance.

Couric did a great job in staying low key, quiet and allowing plenty of time for Palin to dig herself in deeper and deeper. The more time she's forced to fill, the more she is exposed as not even having the most superficial level of knowledge.

She can't answer a single question, she can't bunt every question she's asked, she can't tapdance around anything any more. She can't give someone old enough to be her father, and lightyears above her, a schoolmarm lecture. And Biden, having raised 3 kids including a daughter, is too smart and experienced to give her the opportunity.

It doesn't take a knockout blow to win against Palin. It takes simple quiet. Just let her keep babbling and trying to BS her way through. And when she runs out of steam, ask the killer follow on questions, and allow her to go right back into panic mode.

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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. I don't believe there will be follow up questions
I think I read that yesterday? Anyway, I sure hope you are right!
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-02-08 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
26. People said the same thing about McCain's debate.
"Oh, if he simply gets through it the media will call him a winner. And he'll come back in the polls."

That didn't happen.
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