I am a born and bred heathen and I have a question. Why

[rzemanfl]

can't OUR SIDE find some religious types to say things like the Repukes are going to hell for lying and starting wars and letting their kids get knocked up and that Palin's baby was God's punishment for killing moose and drift netting without a license and marrying a drunk driver who cheats in snowmobile races and that all these hurricanes are God's punishment for electing * and that Dick Cheney is Lucifer and Jesus Christ is coming and is going to kick their asses and other fairy tale shit like that? Huh? Why not? Do they have a godamn monopoly on crazy shit or what?

[niyad]

1. because pagans and heathens, etc., are generally not that stupid.

[Hello_Kitty]

2. Yes. eom

[GreenPartyVoter]

3. I can't speak for others, but I don't believe in Hell, and I don't believe in judgement.. not

in the sense that they do.

In other words, we are too tolerant and too nice. :( And too sane

[MrModerate]

4. Not a pure monopoly, but a corner on the market.

Problem is, those sorts of attacks are considered "unChristian" and so anyone who actually follows Christian teachings is pretty much prohibited from using them. Moral consistency's a bitch, no?

[rzemanfl]

5. Makes me glad I am a heathen. n/t

[rzemanfl]

7. Just a sec, doesn't the Catholic Church run on the premise that

everybody else is going to hell?

[nomorenomore08]

12. Not so much anymore. That's more the domain of the born-again/evangelical types.

Then again, not all evangelicals are hard-right, and a fair number are actually Democrats, but I would assume that those who vote Dem aren't as much into the fire-and-brimstone stuff. I couldn't imagine Jim Wallis, for instance, condemning the Bush administration to hell.

So yeah, I think putting on the wrath-of-God act would fit more liberal Christians awkwardly, to say the least. And I say this as an agnostic, not a believer, myself.

[Mind_your_head]

13. No - not at all - sorry you have been misinformed somewhere along the way

Peace,
M_Y_H

[rzemanfl]

16. My wife was raised Catholic (in fact the first one too) did this

change some time in the past forty-fifty years?

[Mind_your_head]

18. I really don't know where you are 'coming from' here.......

"everyone except a Catholic is going to hell".

That was never anything I was ever taught ~ and all my 'school-years' were in Catholic grade, hs, and college.

Heck, catholics are some of the 'hard-est drinking, plain-speaking, truth-seeking people that you could ever meet'.....and they "don't wear it on their sleeves" as some 'badge of honor' like some evangelicals do.

Catholics tend to just 'do their work' and leave it at that has been my experience.

I'm truly sorry that you have felt pressure/un-due guilt, if you have.....If you follow Christ and His Word, you're a Christian ~ all different flavors and stripes don't matter. Jesus didn't want us to fight among ourselves about stupid little MAN-MADE details, while we lose the "BIG PICTURE", surely not!

Peace,
M_Y_H

[rzemanfl]

19. Well, I am a heathen, so I guess it doesn't matter how mis-

informed I am.

[Mind_your_head]

20. It DOES matter.......as long as you find peace/rest/comfort "in HIM"

....then the 'politics' ~ the rest doesn't matter ~ it is insignificant.

[kath]

28. I think the old-timers of my parents' generation WERE taught this - they're in their mid-70s.

But the C.Church softened on that quite a bit in the 60s.

My parents say that when they were kids, they were told by the nuns that it would be a sin for them to set foot in a Protestant church.

[Mind_your_head]

30. Well, the ''good sisters' always patiently 'spoke to their audience'

by this I mean that, the sisters were always better off to speak a 'word of caution' so that anyone doesn't "get burned" in their simplistic view.

NOW, if one wants to actually LOOK at the history of how the prtestant church seperated off from the Catholic church.....It's a fascinating story. Several people gave up their lives for it. They thought it was THAT important. And so, *I* too want to look at their lives/deaths/their position on things. People don't generally give up their lives very easily.....

[Fumesucker]

17. Moral consistency's a bitch, yes.

Although holding someone to their publicly stated standards is not the same thing as attacking them.

[Rabrrrrrr]

6. Because the Democratic/Progressive Christians aren't judgment/hate oriented, but mercy/justice

And so, we aren't gonna find people on our side to spew the same kind of hateful, ignorant, unbiblical garbage that they spew.

[TomInTib]

8. I'll do it.

I have grown my hair long and look a lot like Jesus and have a voice that can sound like Charlton Heston.

A few nights ago, I walked into a convenience store in Mill Valley where this Vietnamese woman was behind the counter, reading her Bible. I walked up to the counter with a sixpack of Anchor Steam and she looked up, dropped her Bible and exclaimed, "Oh, my. I thought you Jesus Christ!".

The look on her face was priceless.

[rzemanfl]

10. Did she charge Jesus for his beer? n/t

[Mind_your_head]

14. LOL n/t

[TomInTib]

15. Yeah, dammit.

Maybe if I hadn't started laughing...

Maybe if I hadn't blurted out, "Man, that is goddamned hilarious"....

I'll try to pull it off, next time.

[trixie]

9. from my 11 year old

when he noticed that the hurricane and the convention were on the same day, "Guess God hates McCain".

[muriel_volestrangler]

11. From about 150 years ago:

"I never meant to say that the Conservatives are generally stupid. I meant to say that stupid people are generally Conservative. I believe that is so obviously and universally admitted a principle that I hardly think any gentleman will deny it."
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/John_Stuart_Mill

John Stuart Mill, philosopher, MP, and early liberal, 1866

Still holds today.

[Delphinus]

34. Smart guy

for 150 years ago!

[uberllama42]

21. Many (if not most) American liberals are secularists

We think that sort of rhetoric should be off the table. The Religious Right is adept at converting left-leaning memes to their own purposes. They put out flashy, colorful youth bibles and glossy Christian magazines to attract readers from demographics attracted to those kinds of publications. They study the ideas and terminology used by liberals and apply them to their own causes. They might criticize the lifestyles of the audiences they target with these measures, but they are not above venturing into that cultural space to encourage people to sign up.

Liberals are generally reluctant to do such things. We don't like to spout bible verses, parade our families around and make ostentatious displays of patriotism. The Left usually considers those things off-limits. Personally, I think we're better off leaving those things alone. I don't see any proper place for that kind of rhetoric in our politics.

[Egnever]

22. Because we have been shitting on them for years

[magellan]

23. We who? Have been shitting on who for years? n/t

[Cleita]

24. There is something we could do that's just as crazy and it's updated.

Threaten them with extra terrestial aliens, like an X-Files thing. Tell them that it's the Republicans who are allowing alien abductions and medical experiments on the abductees and that Sarah Palin and John McCain have been implanted to be good robots. So if you believe any thing that they say you are aiding and abetting the aliens who are trying to take control of our planet.

[jberryhill]

26. You don't visit the DUngeon much, I guess /nt

[jberryhill]

25. You do know the answer to that, yes?

Was it Emily Post that said that one of the basic rules of etiquette is not to point out other people's breaches of it?

It works the same way.

When I get to the point where I'm perfect, then I'll be ready to work on you. I just haven't gotten there yet.

But I'll let you know.

Don't hold your breath.

[Mind_your_head]

27. Yes@ Emily Post

:-)

[Festivito]

29. It's a good question. You may not want a real answer.

But, here I go.

I do try to remind people that by judging others specifically as going to hell that they risk that same going to hell themselves.

Ministers get a boost from the same money that lobbies congressmen. Oh, they should be above it, but, these days they make a mint full of money. It goes with our lottery mentality. The good ones speak softly. The over-paid ones are loud.

But, the religious don't have a lock on loose brain cells. Many un-religious keep-it-all-for-myselfs became Republicans for the tax cuts and then stayed for the intolerance.

There are the help-raise-all-ships religious and irreligious, and there are the I'll-raise-my-own-ship in the religious and irreligious also.

So what does the heathen community do to pull its Machiavellians into sensible policies? What, sit back and complain about others?

I guess if you don't have and organization, I guess you don't have an organization gone awry--and no way to reach those extra people.

[ColbertWatcher]

31. Well, isn't that crazy asshole Phelps a "registered" democrat? n/t

[Ahpook]

32. Because we are honest?

I have never felt the need to lie to myself or anyone else to get on with an agenda. This whole fucking thing is hate and the REAL GOD of these motherfuckers..greed.

The hypocrites change their story daily.

My stepmother is this way. Oh so pleasant to be around, being that born again. But, the devil is in the details.

I hear it under her voice. Kill all those damned people that do not agree.

What a wonderful Christian?

[Holly_Hobby]

33. That was a great rant.....

from another heathen. :)

[Dammit Ann]

35. K and Fucking R, my bad brother or sister! You are the future!

(Thank God.) It's a reflex, I was raised Catholic. Recovered nicely, thank you.

[seabeyond]

36. i dont know about all that but i would like to see the reliigous left even the religious that are

not fundies address these issues.some have started last couple years, but they are not loud, are not heard and are not aired. so that makes it challenging. kinda like our dem voice isnt heard.

on a personal basis and living in the religious belt panhandle of texas, i always and continually address it. i never let it slide. i am respectful and in love.... call their bullshit bluntly.