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pokerfan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 01:33 PM
Original message
Proper punishment for Joseph Duncan?
I am anti-death penalty on principle but some cases really try my position.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/6420ap_id_duncan_slayings_california.html">California eager to try Duncan for 1997 murder

BOISE, Idaho -- California law enforcement officials are watching the sentencing hearing for convicted killer Joseph Duncan closely in expectation of eventually trying him there for at least one murder there.

The Riverside County, Calif., district attorney's office charged Duncan in January 2007 with a Beaumont, Calif., boy's death in April 1997.

Ten-year-old Anthony Martinez was forced into a car at knifepoint; his body was found 15 days later.

Duncan has also been linked to the 1996 slayings of two young half-sisters in Seattle.

Duncan is eligible in Idaho for the death penalty after pleading guilty to kidnapping, torturing and killing Dylan Groene. His fate will be decided at hearings starting this week in Boise.

Duncan has already been convicted in state court of killing three people, including Dylan Groene's mother and brother, in a May 2005 attack near Coeur d'Alene.


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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
1. I think hard labor should be put back in sentencing
Edited on Sun Aug-24-08 01:37 PM by MadMaddie
I don't care if it is considered cruel and unusual punishment but he should spend every minute of his miserable life in a tiny cell or busting rocks, never to see the outside of a prison in his lifetime.
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
2. Solitary confinement, no tv or radio or books. No creature comforts of any kind
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bean fidhleir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. I, too, think that would be appropriate. People talk about how imprisonment
is sufficiently awful itself, but that's only true for someone who would never commit this class of crime. Those who would are so emotionally blunted that imprisonment hardly registers.
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liberaldem4ever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
3. I've been anti-death penalty all my life
But there are a few people, like this piece of human shit, really make me question my views. I hope there is a hot burning Hell, cause he is surely gettin an invite, IMO.
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helderheid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
4. Castration.
A painful one at that.
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SmokingJacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
5. I'm against the death penalty, too...
I just think it's a bad policy.

But if I were on this jury, I think I'd make an exception.

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pokerfan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Duncan rages against the system
http://www.kxly.com/Global/story.asp?S=8885572

BOISE - A jury of 12 men and women have now heard from witnesses, seen the evidence, heard the closing arguments and are now deliberating whether or not Joseph Duncan should die for his crimes.

Their deliberations began after Joseph Duncan summoned all the rage he could muster and lashed out at prosecutors, the jury and the system itself.

The final day of testimony in the sentencing trial of Joseph Duncan got underway in Boise at 9 a.m. - 8 a.m. Spokane time - Friday morning with Assistant U.S. Attorney Wendy Olson delivering the federal government's closing argument in the case.

She outlined the aggravating factors that must be met for Duncan to be eligible for the death penalty and then walked the jury step-by-step through the state's case, showing them the aggravating factors in Duncan's writings, Shasta Groene's interviews, the physical evidence and the videos that Duncan filmed with him sexually abusing and physically assaulting Dylan Groene to near death.

As Olson presented the state's case Duncan showed little emotion. In the gallery Steve Groene was among those listening in on the closing arguments. In all Olson spent an hour-and-a-half laying out the state's case and showing that at every turn they had proven the aggravating factors needed for the jury to consider giving Duncan the death penalty.

Then, just as he has represented himself throughout the trial, Joseph Duncan stood to deliver his closing statement, with Judge Edward Lodge warning him not to testify but to only argue the evidence presented in the case.

Apologetic once again for being ill-prepared to address the court, Duncan then unleashed his fury on the jury.

"You people really don't have any clue yet of the true heinousness of what I've done," he said. "I was not searching for a child, but rather I was on a rampage."

His plan was to "rape and kill until I was killed, preferring death over capture" and that he had planned a variety of different scenarios including home invasion, attacking a daycare as well a parking lot hijacking. He confirmed that the GPS waypoints that pointed to a variety of homes and daycares that stretched from Arlee, Montana to here in Spokane were indeed targets he was considering.

"Revenge was certainly putting it lightly," Duncan said.

He wondered aloud to the court if rape, which started for him when he assaulted his first victim in 1980 when Duncan was just 16, was about sex. Duncan thought it was more about power and control.

Duncan then changed the record, which included his own previous statements, and said that Dylan's murder was not an accident and that he had lied to Shasta at the time to win her compliance.

"I was on a rampage, I hated myself, and I hated you," he told the jury.

"I knew the best way to hurt you was the way I was hurt ... an eye for an eye ... but the system didn't take my eye, it took my heart and my innocence, and I wanted to do the same to it."

Judge Lodge stopped Duncan at that point telling him that his closing argument was to argue the facts of the case, not to confess. The judge ordered a short recess so Duncan could confer with his standby legal counsel.

Fifteen minutes later Duncan returned, again apologizing for his lack of legal abilities, before continuing to vent his rage, picking up where he had left by saying that Shasta Groene had been told by Duncan he had accidentally shot Dylan. Duncan said the true story was the shotgun slaying of the 9-year-old boy, following brutal and systematic physical, sexual and emotional abuse, was intentional.

"Evidence consistently shows that I have been honest, that I have been forthcoming," Duncan said. "I think that's important to be considered."

Duncan says that at the time he had Dylan and Shasta Groene held hostage in the Lolo National Forest he had no intention of bringing them home, however, "for some reason that changed, and I think the evidence supports that also."

The convicted killer then turned his attention to the prosecutors saying that he should thank the government for helping him get his "eye for an eye."

"I should thank them, but I won't. Despite the heinousness of all my crimes, and the sickness, the insanity, the evidence shows clearly, that completely contrary to all my life experience, that something happened," Duncan said, adding that he was on trial in Boise not because he was caught but because Shasta Groene showed him the truth.

"This is not for my own salvation, but this is for yours and the hope of all of us together," Duncan concluded.

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SmokingJacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. Okay, the death penalty's too good for him.
Life sentence, no parole, no access to any kind of media.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 02:33 PM
Response to Original message
8. Killing this man won't unkill or unhurt anyone.
What a terrible case. :(
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. It serves no purpose to mimic his crimes.
Castration, solitary confinement for life, death. To what purpose, except to make the perpetrators of such crimes the same as the victim?

I'm far from saintly enough to gin up any sympathy for the likes of him but I refuse to become like him to satisfy some primitive urge for revenge under the guise of concern for his victims.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. It must be DNA. Unless you are threatening me or mine in real time,
I don't have that impulse that overrides conviction. It doesn't seem to be any greater moral anything, it's more like a lack of a reaction. It's just not there.

Maybe that's why there are so few of me. :rofl:

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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Alas.
That there are so few of you.:hi:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-24-08 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Lol. Because DU doesn't have enough mouthy ideologues.
peace, Tierra_y_Libertad. :hi:
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