Talking to my freeper father on off-shore drilling

[Brewman_Jax]

After the newscast...

Dad: Those dummycrats won't allow off-shore drilling.

_Argyle: That ban was ordered by Bush Sr.

Dad: Well, Clinton let it continue.

_Argyle: Gas didn't exceed $2/gallon while Clinton was President. Oh, and he isn't President anymore.

Dad: They won't let the oil companies build any more refineries. Damn environmental hippie dummycrats.

_Argyle: The last refinery built in the US was roughly 35 years ago. If Big Oil really wanted a refinery, they'd have done it by now, don'tcha think?

Dad: (grumble)


It's like they have no logical thinking skills in addition to incredible ignorance, and that's sad. :(

[Richardo]

1. The "new refinery" thing is a canard anyway.

Ask them how many exisiting refineries increased their capacity during the intervening 35 years.

[Brewman_Jax]

3. Good point

about the capacity; forgot about that. He was about to talk about ANWR until I showed him a map of Alaska.

[alfredo]

13. let him know that the ANWR oil was promised to Asia.

Let him know that the off shore oil will be sold on the open market, not to us.

[dkofos]

9. And ask him how many refineries have been shut down in the last 35 years.

[RedLetterRev]

15. And quietly disassembled and carted offshore

rather than updated to meet EPA standards. That was also part of the hoohah. A BA load of them have quietly left US soil and gone on to pollute countries with fewer controls. It's not as if the capacity isn't there. It just no longer is here.

T'ink about it. We've been stolen from several different ways and the overwhelming majority of Americans (and probably DUers) don't even realize it.

[alstephenson]

20. You sure got that right, RLR.

[hadrons]

2. That's who your dad WANTS to blame ....

no logical thinking skills needed

[Brewman_Jax]

4. Quite right

To him, Clinton wants to take away his guns, foul his health insurance, raise gasoline prices, and make him file an income tax return every year. He really wants to say is that Clinton caused the drought, forced him to have hip replacement surgery, gave him Type 2 diabetes, made the cat cough up a hairball by his favorite chair, and everything else that went wrong in his life. :crazy:

[Jack from Charlotte]

25. I've always wanted this question asked of the "Drill more & now" crowd.....

2001 through 2006 there was a Republic Party president, a Republic Party controlled House, a Republic Party controlled Senate and 7 of the 9 members of the Supreme court were appointed by Republic Party Presidents and are Republic Party members.... Why didn't the Republic Party completely controlled US Gov't do offshore oil drilling then?

Also, why did Republic Party President George Bush (The elected one from '88 through '92) make the executive order banning offshore oil drilling.

Answer me those questions, please.

[zanne]

36. Yup. They believe what they want to believe...

There's no sense in wasting our time trying to convince them otherwise.

[B Calm]

5. Ask him if they drilled for more oil can the republicans guarantee it

would not be sold overseas! Ask him how he feels about nationalizing OUR OIL!

[OmahaBlueDog]

6. "Dad, why is it the Government that has to solve this problem by allowing drilling...."

...Dad, people should take personal responsibility and get out of those SUVs and get cars with higher gas mileage"

(note: The "Personal Responsibility" argument is what I always hear Republican'ts spout about a) Katrina and b) healthcare)

[B Calm]

7. Republicans = Personal Responsibility & Corporate Freedom

Democrats = Corporate Responsibility & Personal Freedom

[calimary]

8. GREAT ONE!

B Calm! GREAT ONE!!!

Republicans = Personal Responsibility & Corporate Freedom
Democrats = Corporate Responsibility & Personal Freedom

The only problem is - I can think of a lot of republi-CONS I know who'd look at the first line of that couplet and shrug and say "SO?"

:eyes:

[B Calm]

12. No matter how simple you make it for them, they still won't get it!

Working class republicans are dumb as bricks!

[Lorien]

24. Just for you, B. Calm:

http://www.cafepress.com/Lorien.292221100

[Lorien]

10. Now there's a bumper sticker I'd buy

Of course, Repugs only believe in personal responsibility for OTHER PEOPLE. Drive an SUV is a "personal freedom" to repugs, never mind that it's irresponsible because it forces America to rely more on foreign oil to support an idiotic driver's "choice". :crazy:

[Brewman_Jax]

16. Great bumper sticker!

:thumbsup:

[Lorien]

23. OK, here it is:

http://www.cafepress.com/Lorien.292221100

[B Calm]

32. Wow, that looks good. . .

[RedLetterRev]

17. They sure spout enough of it

but I never see the undertake any of it. There's a BA load of difference. They won't until they're called on it and made to, either.

[Brewman_Jax]

18. I hit him with the "that's what you voted for" counter

they hate personal responsibility, when it is THEY that have to be responsible. I'll have to ask him why Bush* had 2 terms in office and is responsible for nothing that happened during that time.

[The Backlash Cometh]

11. Really, is there any reason why the oil companies couldn't build a

refinery somewhere else?

[alfredo]

14. More leased land = greater value for the oil company.

[Richardo]

19. We're *exporting* about 6 million barrels of finished gasoline PER MONTH

Dec-07
6,406

Jan-08
4,095

Feb-08
5,700

Mar-08
5,691

Apr-08
6,048

May-08
5,687

http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/dnav/pet/pet_move_expc_a_EPM0F_EEX_mbbl_m.htm

I mean, what the hell?

On edit: You're welcome, Mexico and Canada. :eyes:

[The Stranger]

21. Big Oil is sitting on 68 MILLION ACRES they refuse to drill on already.

[Brewman_Jax]

27. I'll remind him of that, too

[Rambis]

22. Oil companies bought and closed hundreds of refineries

there were 362 and they have closed over 200 to drive up prices. I read it somewhere and don't have a link.

[alstephenson]

26. Interesting. I've had the same conversation with my freeper father!

Almost exact same discussion, same outcome. You're right, it's sad.

[Brewman_Jax]

29. You, too?

I think freepers read from the same script.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

28. Oh my. Sorry you have to experience that on a regular basis.

You handled it quite well... Me, I would be pulling my hair out and sticking sharp objects in my eyes.

Keep up the good work! :thumbsup:

[Brewman_Jax]

30. Thanks much

I do a lot of research and practice, because he's not the only freeper I deal with. There's always seems to be a freeper lurking around waiting to interrupt me. :hide:

[ColbertWatcher]

31. Obedience requires no thinking at all.

BTW, the "mascots" for the Truthiness Encyclopedia are the "Truthiness Monkeys", whose names are: Obedience, Ignorance and Fear!

Obedience
see no commonalities and obey the authorities
Ignorance
hear no objection and stick to traditional moral principles
Fear
speak no objections and do not consider possible consequences

--Truthiness Monkeys

[Vinca]

33. Talking to a Republican is like talking to a brick. nt

[n2doc]

34. 2 things- Refineries haven't been making money lately

In fact, many have been losing money lately. And second, It takes a long time to get oil to market even if it is there. I'm at an oil science meeting right now and they speak of things in decades to market, not years...

[varelse]

35. I thought that several oil companies had recently shut down refineries?

Not to mention, even if they did start off-shore drilling, the oil wouldn't be sold to the US...

[asdjrocky]

37. It's like they enjoy being ignorant.

[sknabt]

38. Was the show dad was reacting to on Fox News?

Fox News has become the drill, drill, drill channel. When gas hit $4/gallon and public opinion shifted on expanding drilling offshore and in wilderness areas Fox News saw an opportunity to prop up their boy McCain who was dragging serious ass in the polls.

I've observed and blogged on Fox & Friends shamelessly shilling for drilling over and over and over again.

Refineries are a Republican talking point which is to say it isn't a serious issue. When prices spiked quickly largely based upon speculation refineries actually cut production into the 80-something percent range. Why? Because they were getting squeezed. Raw petroleum cost was expensive to buy yet the wholesale price of refined product lagged badly behind. So they cut production to bring the two back in line.

While I'm not opposed to drilling - I like the "gang of 10" compromise - it has to be part of a comprehensive package. Because we don't have enough oil to have a lasting significant impact.

Oil's day is done. We need to find another source of energy. Drilling may buy us some time but what I'm afraid of is the Republicans will use domestic drilling as an excuse to boost short-term business profits and just delay a permanent fix onto the next generation.

[Ganja Ninja]

39. Damn it! They know it's the Democrats fault and don't even

try to tell them different! It makes their heads explode when they have to disagree with Sean Hannity.