Hope? For a country that elected Nixon and Bush twice? And where Anthrax 9/11 was inside job?

[bos1]

Sorry but have to rant on this. Let's face it, Americans have been dumb enough to vote for Nixon and Bush twice (there was voter fraud but it has to be close to steal it, so still.) The Anthrax 9/11 attacks were unquestionably an inside job, which means there is an element in the US power structure that will do anything to keep neocons in power.

Then you have have a government that is all but owned by the military corporations and Big Oil. They are not going to roll over and play dead. Add to it that there seems to be a hardcore of Americans who are politically and socially sadomasochistic. Additional factors:
*Fox News, a rightwing lie machine, as a popular permanent institution.
*Talk radio is a constant rightwing propaganda machine 24/7.
*3 Billion USD in aid to BOTH Saudi Arabia and Israel creates endless circle of corruption.
*USA only industrialized country without public healthcare = permanent underclass.
*Substantial percentage of population are active Christian Whacko Fundamentalists
*The USA assassinates its progressive leaders on a regular basis

How is there any hope for the country in this equation?

It's an open question for you all, or you can add any major factors I overlooked.

[zanne]

1. I still have hope.

At least until November. If McCain wins, I'll throw up my hands and give up on the American people.

[bos1]

2. I'm glad you have hope.

I hate being so negative, but sometimes it's realistic. "Cynicism is an unpleasant way of telling the truth."

[nancyr]

3. I'm afraid I agree with you.

I'm feeling the same way this morning. Reading about the convenient "suicide" of the alleged anthrax perpetrator, and thinking how neatly that all now seems to fit together,(case closed!) and thinking about how everything our government says means exactly the opposite. I can't believe anything anymore. I see the daily lies, innuendos and smears coming from the right, and I never underestimate the gullability of the average American to believe axactly what they see and hear. It's difficult to be optimistic and expect things to be better once November rolls around when I'm still hearing people talking about how Obama is a Muslim and how scary he is. I still have a bit of hope, but it's being steadily gnawed away. After the last almost 8 years I don't see how anyone can expect much in the way of change. I desperately hope that I'm wrong.

[calimary]

13. My husband said something similar. If America votes mcsame, and that's what

we get stuck with for ANOTHER four years, then America deserves what it gets.

And four years from now, they'll scratch their heads during the commercial breaks between "American Idol" or "Dancing with the Stars" and wonder why things aren't all wonderful again.

I will NEVER EVER EVER forget the image of that poor idiot woman who sat there and said she just couldn't possibly vote for anybody who doesn't wear a flag pin. I think that was one of the videotaped debate questions during the primaries. This was a woman who was in advanced middle-age, she'd just lost her job, she had no health insurance, no retirement, no income, and no prospects for new employment in her economically-strapped and near-desolate community, and all she could whine about was that there HAD to be a frickin' flag pin. THAT was her biggest priority.

You know, if THAT'S what this country cares about, then I give up. Sometimes I wonder why I even bother, in view of people like that. Especially since you kinda get the impression that no matter how much sense you try to talk to people like her, you just will not reach them. They're simply beyond saving. And there are more and more and more of them every day. But BY GOD she's gonna vote republi-CON every chance she gets and believe all those platitudes about rising tides and trickling down and believing that some magic day that wonderful-sounding pie-in-the-sky (that you'll get your chance at, Mr. and Mrs. America, if you just keep on voting for us CONservatives) will arrive on her table, too. Only it never does. That's not the way things work in IGMFU*-land.

(* I Got Mine, F-U)

[ixion]

4. and don't forget Reagan (twice) and popeye *

so, unfortunately, I've pretty much lost hope in the intelligence of the average US citizen.

[bos1]

12. I didn't include Reagan

because most of the USA actually believed the manure about him. But maybe I should have.

But there's no excuse with Bush2.

And yes Poppy goes on the list -- electing a former CIA head who presided over 9/11/1973, the day the US backed the coup killing democracy in Chile.

[Junkdrawer]

5. Denial - Not just a river in Egypt. Take Rachel Maddow yesterday...

She ended her Glenn Greenwald interview with:

"It's chilling to think that elements within our government may have used Anthrax after the 9/11 attacks to divert anger towards Iraq."

Progress. But the implication is that the Anthrax attacks were organized AFTER 9/11. The facts, however, show that the Anthrax attacks were organized WELL BEFORE 9/11.

[Bigmack]

6. Any country that ...

"elects" Nixon twice.... Reagan twice... and Dumbya twice... is stupid. Bone-headed stupid.

And, according to Gallup Daily.... McSame is tied with Obama.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

7. Or once, for that matter.

[global1]

8. You Know During The Primaries I Was Full Of Hope.....

I support Obama and felt a sense of relief when he finally became the presumptive nominee. But since then couple with the events of the last few months - I'm beginning to question my hopefulness. I'll try to explain briefly what has made me begin to question.

First - the fact that the Dems still are not pushing for impeachment and the fact that even if Obama wins - *Co will get off scot-free with their crimes.

Second - nothing happened for the last 7 years with respect to this Iraqi war, diplomacy with Iran - because *Co didn't want anything to happen - now all of a sudden Obama comes on the scene and has a plan for how he will end the war and bring troops home, sit down at the table with Iran and come up with a diplomatic solution and lo and behold - now the administration is talking the same story. Granted they may have been pushed by Obama to do something - but they had in their power to do this all along and opted not to. Now because they may lose the WH they seem to be pulling out some stops here to help McCain and maybe try and keep it close enough to steal another 4 to 8 years.

Third - With respect to the anthrax investigation - no story here since 2001 and now all of a sudden - suspect kills self - we have the culprit - case closed. The story surrounding this now is suspect - but we'll never know. Nice tidy way to clean up the loose ends.

Fourth - Along with Ivins/Anthrax above - a rash of suicides surrounding the movement of the Nukes from Minot; and I still don't buy the 9/11 story/events; patriot act

Fifth - the arrogance of *Co - aka Meiers, Bolton, Rove, Mukasy snubbing Congress and avoiding testimony; the fact that the Repugs go along with anything - strictly partisan - even though they should know better

Sixth - the MSM - I really can't say anything good about them - I feel we are lied to on an on-going basis; we don't get the full story; we are told what somebody wants us to hear; and their are enough Americans that just go along with this; Example: I had a discussion with a friend that is buying this Anthrax story - hook, line and sinker and isn't a slight bit suspicious.

Seventh - how the government is in our lives in virtually everything we do; they can basically monitor our every move; internet, airports, track your purchases through credit cards, red-light cameras, etc.

I'm rambling now - but bottom line - I beginning to think that we're being thrown a bone with Obama; give them hope and then at the last minute take it away and further squash them down; if you think things are bad now with moral of Americans - I can't imagine what it will be like if Obama loses and the Repugs get another 4 year crack at running things.

So along with everything you mentioned in your orginal post - add some of my frustrations and there you go.

[bos1]

11. but a good ramble.

I think we can add a lot of it to the list of factors, especially the increase of surveillance into citizen's lives. I don't see that every being revoked or reformed.

[Kermitt Gribble]

9. I'll add to it

*Many of us had so much hope after the 2006 elections when the Dems regained a majority, only to watch our Dem majority further the repuke agenda. Only a handful of congressional dems fight for our principles, the rest are no different than the repukes.

Those who have hope for this govt are living in a fairytale.

[bos1]

10. Yes the Dems appeasement of /collaboration with the White House is another factor. n/t