Mary Jane and me.

[angrycarpenter]

I have avoided writing anything in defense of marijuana mostly because I did not want to be on record as an occasional smoker but I think it is time to say a few words.

I was a stoner in high school, I made no secret of it, even my teachers knew. Every morning before school I was out there on the corner getting a buzz on. I was the classic stereotype, long hair, shades hiding my perpetually red eyes, visine in my pocket, and I knew all of the Cheech and Chong routines by heart.

We were a close bunch, we stoners, it was almost like the act of standing in a circle and sharing a joint brought us together in a way that the straights could not conceive. It was a kind of sacred communion where we laughed and coughed together.

It was a more innocent time for recreational drugs. Crack had yet to make it's debut. Heroin and cocaine were something people in the movies did. We lived in peace and happiness.

Then two things seemed to happen at the same time, The president announced his war on drugs and cocaine became commonplace. Suddenly the cops that had left us alone started to come down hard on us in order to get that federal payoff for drug arrests. The price of pot started to climb and the fine homegrown we were used to was replaced by the dry, powdery, Mexican dope. We became fearful. We stopped trusting one another for fear of being ratted out.

Suddenly instead of being a bunch of kids having a good time we were degenerate drug addicts. The war on drugs fragmented a social bond that had made us strong, we were now on our own.

Had not the war on drugs occurred many things would not have happened, there would still be cocaine but the smugglers would not be nearly as rich. There would not be nearly as much strife in South America. We would have a lot less people in jail. We would have fewer addicts as the government was moving toward treating drugs as a public health hazard the way it should be. And more importantly to this post pot smokers would be a group with real political power rather than a fearful demographic who hide even from each other.

The time is long past to legalize it. I am not going to bore you with the rational arguments for this because the people who conduct the drug war are not rational. Only when we, as the large group of individuals we are, come together without fear and demand pot as a right rather than a privilege to be granted us by the government will things finally come to a solution that makes sense.

[Ian David]

1. You forgot the part about the jock, the prom queen and the nerd.

But you make some good points.

[asdjrocky]

2. K & R-

And that's all I'll say about that.

[lonestarnot]

3. Rugh Ro, you done done it now!

[madokie]

4. What a contrast,

when I graduated from high school I can't remember ever hearing anything about weed. No one around where I lived smoked. My first introduction to pot was in Navy boot camp in '67 and they showed us the movie 'reefer madness' and after seeing that and listening to their spiel on how bad it was I just had to try it myself so I did and the rest is, well, history. I never had much interest in the other drugs like coke and crank, I just never liked the way they made me feel. I remember back in the '70s one could not find any weed for months starting around the holidays lasting until well into spring then saint ronnie rode in in '81 with a shit load of drugs following him. Hell in a matter of a year or so cocaine, herion, pot and all kind of pills were everywhere. Yep thats the real war on drugs

[angrycarpenter]

5. Our sheriff

allegedly smuggled it all in and it was plentiful and cheap. However hard drugs and moonshine were punished to the hilt.

[Hestia]

6. I personally know of two towns in Ark that saved themselves from Big Farm take over

in the 1980s. How? One of the country club women admitted it to me, that she did everything she could think of to save her 3 generation farm, and it was the only plan she could think of. So all the farmers got together and covered for each other. It's amazing what a town can do when the people come together, especially behind the backs of the Chamber.

Another thing about smoking too, is that back in the 70s and 80s, you were too stoned to drive 90 on the freeway. Everybody drove slower. A couple of weeks agp, after being on the freeway and almost hit twice by Hemi's why people were driving so dad gum fast - they never drove stoned. I still don't drive fast and hate it when everyone else does. Instead of just driving on the freeway, it's now a Le Mans.

One more point - why is that we were stoned all the way through high school managed to actually graduate and read and cipher, but they can't today? Ergo, smoking makes you smarter.

[Jackpine Radical]

8. I remember getting mildly stoned to study statistics in grad school.

A little pot and I could sorta visualize things like variances.

The stuff was around a little when I was an undergrad in the early 60's but I didn't have the nerve to use it until the Army. I did a lot of weed in Vietnam.

[Hestia]

17. I love the Bill Hicks routine where he is talking about, hey I did drugs, loved them, didn't get

addicted, lived to tell about, will do them again; if that ain't PC, get over it. I like the analogy in the OP about how we started running skeered of our buddies, all over a little smoke. We need to come out of the woodworks and stop this nonsense. You can tell who still smokes too (other than smoking ciggies) they seem to sense of humor about it all but not disrespectful.

[riverdeep]

15. Reminds of the Steve Earle song, 'Copperhead Road'

Well my name's John Lee Pettimore
Same as my daddy and his daddy before
You hardly ever saw Grandaddy down here
He only came to town about twice a year
He'd buy a hundred pounds of yeast and some copper line
Everybody knew that he made moonshine
Now the revenue man wanted Grandaddy bad
He headed up the holler with everything he had
It's before my time but I've been told
He never came back from Copperhead Road

Now Daddy ran the whiskey in a big block Dodge
Bought it at an auction at the Mason's Lodge
Johnson County Sheriff painted on the side
Just shot a coat of primer then he looked inside
Well him and my uncle tore that engine down
I still remember that rumblin' sound
Well the sheriff came around in the middle of the night
Heard mama cryin', knew something wasn't right
He was headed down to Knoxville with the weekly load
You could smell the whiskey burnin' down Copperhead Road

I volunteered for the Army on my birthday
They draft the white trash first,'round here anyway
I done two tours of duty in Vietnam
And I came home with a brand new plan
I take the seed from Colombia and Mexico
I plant it up the holler down Copperhead Road
Well the D.E.A.'s got a chopper in the air
I wake up screaming like I'm back over there
I learned a thing or two from ol' Charlie don't you know
You better stay away from Copperhead Road

Copperhead Road
Copperhead Road
Copperhead Road

[asdjrocky]

19. Very good song by a great artist.

Love that guy.

[Mopar151]

12. SometIme in the 90's

A grumpy old dealer I know was bemoaning the state of the "business"...
"Fuckin'cokeheads, fuck everything up.. I done plenty of it, I usta deal it...
But if they declared ammnesty for pot, I'd turn in every cokehead I know, as a public service, and I'd deliver two, three personally..."

[Hekate]

7. I've never been a user, but it's decades past time to declare victory and go home, as it were...

Our culture -- especially the politicians -- want to define every challenge as a "war", which gives us some sickening results. The so-called War on Drugs is one of those sickening results, and the older I get the sicker it makes me to see the money and lives wasted on this senseless Prohibition.

I voted to legalize medical marijuana in California, and I'd like to see pot legalized period. Treat it like alcohol, for gods' sake: regulate it, tax it, license the vendors. Then declare victory and send the prisoners home.

Hekate

[philly_bob]

9. Revenue source for ailing American economy: legalize & regulate. n/t

[Cybergata]

10. Legalize and let people grow their own in their own homes!

Forget regulation. And Yeaaaa, I hear Cheech and Chong are getting back together.

[tridim]

11. This is the first time in my adult life that I think that's a possibility.

Although I probably would have thought the same had I been older during Carter's term.

[Swamp Rat]

13. :-D

[Cooley Hurd]

22. "What a cute little baby! Oh, yes you are! Hoochie-gooo..."

"...now pass that, you little bogart!!!"
:rofl:

Awesome, Swampy!:hi:

[Faux pas]

14. I loved the personal part of your story. It's true, there is a certain

peaceful camaraderie for those who toke together. I never heard of anyone smoking and then beating the crap out of someone. I never known any who lied (well unless they were denying being loaded lol), cheated or stole either. I never smoked until my late 20's (in the mid 1970's) and wondered where this miracle had been all my life. My siblings and many friends had drug 'problems' when they dipped into the harder stuff. Luckily it was a phase and when they went back to pot they were 'normal' again.

LOL wonder if Skinner would let us have Pot Group??

[RedLetterRev]

18. Well, nobody beat the crap out of anybody, with a certain qualification

...unless they were holding the last bag of Cheetos or the bottom of the barrel of KFC. :D

I never smoked until I went to take care of my dad when he got cancer. To my shock! horror! surprise! he was smoking that evil marree-jewannee. I just knew the cops were going to come in the door at any second, and just what sort of shady characters were going to be coming around the house as his, um, contacts?

Jeez, was I naive.

The only relief from pain and the only way he could get an appetite and keep his meds down was to roll a little. The "shady" contacts were widows on fixed income who, by selling a pinch here and there, didn't have to eat cat food in order to survive. This, in the 20 years since then, has been the vast majority of both consumers and retailers I have known. Yeah, I've known a few recreational users, and, so what of them. Not a single one has ever harmed a soul. Not one. Everything that has ever been said about pot being harmful or a gateway or causing people to go insane or to commit heinous crimes is. Horse. Shit.

That is my considered experience.

No, I don't smoke it, myself these days, though I see absolutely nothing wrong with it. I did when daddy was alive, just to be sociable with him. The only thing wrong with it AFAIC is that I tend toward pudge. I've worked hard to get something like a physique back (at 51 that ain't as easy as it sounds!) and I'm not inclined to waste that work on eating up the kitchen. Which is exactly what would happen. And I'm not talkin' a little snack out the kitchen. I'd eat up the. Whole. Kitchen. Won't do.

All this time and energy the police are spending on busting people for a pinch of emjay or for holding up a Progressive sign, when we've got people running around loose in DC who knock over whole nations and steal trillions of dollars. Somebody PLEASE tell me how TF that makes sense.

[RNdaSilva]

16. Either 323 persons here didn't know who or what...

Mary Jane is, or what, or else they didn't want to commit.

In case...I was counting hits on this thread.

[Cleita]

20. When I lived in South America as a child our

domestic employees chewed coca leaves openly. It was part of the culture of the indigenous people of the Andes. Considering we lived at an altitude of 11,000 feet, it was a practical necessity for them to do a day's work when the air was so thin. No one thought much of it and coca tea was a cure for altitude sickness that we might get coming from sea level to the high altitude until our bodies adjusted that we all drank at one time or the other ourselves. However, I was shocked how it became a recreational drug snorted as a powder at parties during the seventies. I don't feel coca is harmful but when it's refined to such a high degree, it becomes the dangerous drug and addictive drug cocaine. I agree that drugs should be legalized, not only to remove the criminal element from them, but to regulate them as well.

[LWolf]

21. I can't disagree with anything you say.

I, too, used to know all of the Cheech & Chong routines by heart. As a matter of fact, if you start one up, I'm sure I can still join in.

Pot was just a fact of life when I was growing up. It was everywhere, everybody had it, everybody smoked it. My mom offered me my first joint at the age of 12, thinking that she was being liberal and "daring." I thanked her, and didn't mention that I'd known where she kept her stash for at least a year.

Also at the age of 12, I spent about 6 months in a state park that had a small private neighborhood on the edge. There were some big pot plantations, and we knew where all the stuff was growing. We pilfered a little here and a little there, and no one was any wiser.

I once spent an afternoon emptying my boyfriend's house, garage, and basement of the plants his dad was growing, hiding them in the brush by a creek, and waiting for the "man" to finish their raid.

By the time I graduated from high school, I left pot behind. So did most of the friends I kept in touch with. Those that didn't did not end up well, as they moved on to the more easily available, harsher stuff.

These days, there are drugs that SHOULD be illegal. Meth, for one.

Would legalizing recreational amphetamines get rid of the prevalence of meth? Is there a way to reduce the prevalence of stuff produced illegally that causes real harm?

I don't know, but I do know that the "war" is not productive, and needs to come to an end.

[RedLetterRev]

23. I have seen so many people kill themselves

with meth. It's not a drug, it's slow poison. A very addictive poison made out of whatever crap people find under kitchen sinks. At least pot has been well-known for its medicinal properties for thousands of years, going back to the Babylonians and Egyptians. Meth has zero redeeming qualities whatsoever.

While I'm very much in favor of decriminalizing pot -- at the very, very least for compassionate use -- I can't bring myself to wrap my head around the same for meth, having seen the vast amount of damage it causes. Pot has never killed anyone. Meth has killed at least hundreds of thousands, some of whom I've known and still grieve for the loss of.

[LWolf]

24. That's where I draw the line.

Pot is a plant. You grow it, pick it, dry it, smoke it.

It isn't a laboratory concoction of poisons guaranteed to kill.

Pot, alcohol, tobacco... okay.

[roody]

31. Prohibition, like Bush, is a miserable failure.

Drug addiction is a health care issue. Decriminalize all drugs. Pot is not a drug, it is an herb.

[RedLetterRev]

32. You might have seen from my introductory post

that I was raised in the mountains with traditional herbal medicine. My granny knew everything about every plant that grew around her home for miles around. Could name every one and could tell you if it was good for something, or if it was poisonous, or if it had a use of some kind. Modern medicine is just now getting around to admitting that there's a whole lot of truth in what the old folks knew.

And they're patenting the hell out of it and putting it out of the reach of common folks. Then, just like what they're doing to food crops, they're suing the piss out of people for growing or using commonly-growing things. They're doing to common medicinal stuff that grows naturally in woods and fields just what they've done to mj and what they've done to food crops. They're doing this worldwide; Monsanto, Sygenta, Dow, Cargill and others in agriculture , with all the usual suspects in Big Pharma doing the same thing with plants that may be useful as medicines. Buh-bye ayurveda.

[noiretextatique]

25. compassionate conservatives want sick people to suffer

our war on drugs makes absolutely no sense, especially the war on marijuana. i spoke occasionally, as i have for 30 years. it's a great stress reliever and mood stablizer for me.

[kimmerspixelated]

26. Last dance with Mary Jane,

One more time to kill the pain!!

[Beam Me Up]

27. The History of the Non-Medical Use of Drugs in the United States . . .

The Marihuana Tax Act of 1937

Now, first again, does everybody see the date, 1937? You may have thought that we have had a national marijuana prohibition for a very long time. Frankly, we haven't.

The marijuana prohibition is part and parcel of that era which is now being rejected rather generally -- the New Deal era in Washington in the late 30s.
Number two, you know, don't you, that whenever Congress is going to pass a law, they hold hearings. And you have seen these hearings. The hearings can be extremely voluminous, they go on and on, they have days and days of hearings. Well, may I say, that the hearings on the national marijuana prohibition were very brief indeed. The hearings on the national marijuana prohibition lasted one hour, on each of two mornings and since the hearings were so brief I can tell you almost exactly what was said to support the national marijuana prohibition.

Now, in doing this one at the FBI Academy, I didn't tell them this story, but I am going to tell you this story. You want to know how brief the hearings were on the national marijuana prohibition?

When we asked at the Library of Congress for a copy of the hearings, to the shock of the Library of Congress, none could be found. We went "What?" It took them four months to finally honor our request because -- are you ready for this? -- the hearings were so brief that the volume had slid down inside the side shelf of the bookcase and was so thin it had slid right down to the bottom inside the bookshelf. That's how brief they were. Are you ready for this? They had to break the bookshelf open because it had slid down inside.

...

So, over the objection of the American Medical Association, the bill passed out of committee and on to the floor of Congress. Now, some of you may think that the debate on the floor of Congress was more extensive on the marijuana prohibition. It wasn't. It lasted one minute and thirty-two seconds by my count and, as such, I will give it to you verbatim.

The entire debate on the national marijuana prohibition was as follows -- and, by the way, if you had grown up in Washington, DC as I had you would appreciate this date. Are you ready? The bill was brought on to the floor of the House of Representatives -- there never was any Senate debate on it not one word -- 5:45 Friday afternoon, August 20. Now, in pre-air-conditioning Washington, who was on the floor of the House? Who was on the floor of the House? Not very many people.

Speaker Sam Rayburn called for the bill to be passed on "tellers". Does everyone know "tellers"? Did you know that for the vast bulk of legislation in this country, there is not a recorded vote. It is simply, more people walk past this point than walk past that point and it passes -- it's called "tellers". They were getting ready to pass this thing on tellers without discussion and without a recorded vote when one of the few Republicans left in Congress, a guy from upstate New York, stood up and asked two questions, which constituted the entire debate on the national marijuana prohibition.

"Mr. Speaker, what is this bill about?"

To which Speaker Rayburn replied, "I don't know. It has something to do with a thing called marihuana. I think it's a narcotic of some kind."

Undaunted, the guy from Upstate New York asked a second question, which was as important to the Republicans as it was unimportant to the Democrats. "Mr. Speaker, does the American Medical Association support this bill?"

In one of the most remarkable things I have ever found in any research, a guy who was on the committee, and who later went on to become a Supreme Court Justice, stood up and -- do you remember? The AMA guy was named William C. Woodward -- a member of the committee who had supported the bill leaped to his feet and he said, "Their Doctor Wentworth came down here. They support this bill 100 percent." It wasn't true, but it was good enough for the Republicans. They sat down and the bill passed on tellers, without a recorded vote.

In the Senate there never was any debate or a recorded vote, and the bill went to President Roosevelt's desk and he signed it and we had the national marijuana prohibition.

Excerpt from: http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/History/whiteb1.htm">The History of the Non-Medical Use of Drugs in the United States, by Charles Whitebread, Professor of Law, USC Law School. A Speech to the California Judges Association 1995 annual conference.

[grannie4peace]

28. sounds familar

its courageous of you to speak up. i can dig it. you know what is strange is that a few people really have seen the wisdom of :hippie: 's i've been thinking the same thing :) about speaking out. i know i can call my senator with no problem but not my reprsentative. he's a wacko. i did call barney frank's office the day his bill was introduced & thanked him for his efforts. :freak: :hi: :hug: i also tell myself that i need to stand up for what i believe in & not let a society define me. especially an unhealthy one.:toast: :applause: :patriot:

[angrycarpenter]

29. these days I only smoke if someone else has it.

I lost contact with my steady dealer when he was busted about two and a half years ago. The search for another went nowhere and finally I just said screw it.

The police here are lazy. They do not go looking for it, they just bust one guy and then pressure him to rat for a reduced sentence. The police in Florida have the option of just issuing a citation and confiscating the weed. In my county they do not do that. We have a low population and if they just let them go they would not have enough arrests to get the federal money. They will bust in your house and drag you to jail for residue.


So these days I would not know where to start if I wanted to buy some. With everyone turning each other in the risk is just too great.

I am rather bitter about that.

[aspergris]

30. i have never smoked and have no desire to try it

But I 100% support decrim.

I don't support (OR OPPOSE) political policies based on how they positively or negatively affect ME.

I support decrim because I think criminalizing mj is ridiculous policy.

And the more time I spend in law enforcement, the more certain I become of this.

fwiw, I also support concealed carry, even though it doesn't affect ME personally. I can carry on my badge. Otoh, it does affect me because it means there will be more law abiding citizens who carry, able to assist me with their firearms. I had a friend who was wrestling with a robber for a gun, and a CCW'er walked up and shot the guy in the head, probably saving her life.

[RedLetterRev]

33. Well, there's a whole 'nuther thread

and I agree with your final paragraph. I'll probably get flames from both sides of the issue, but that's nothing new :D I support ALL TEN Amendments in the Bill of Rights, each one as preciously and rabidly as the other. I don't favor just the Second at the expense of the rest as NRA-ILA. I've paid for and signed up for a CCW course, and like you, don't ever expect ever to carry. I do want to know the rules and I do want to have the safety training. I do own a rifle and a shotgun, against varmints to protect my dogs. (I posted about this elsewhere in my introduction.) I was an expert shot in the military, and probably still am. Mom chided me for buying single-shots of each, but I told her, hell, I only ever needed one against a varmint. My neighbors hunt; I farm. If I want venison, I can trade home-grown blackberries and stuff they don't have. That's the up-side of living in the country. Folks get along and barter.

We're changing some minds out here, being who we are and not apologizing.

Tell you a story.

The other night, we had a helluva storm with those famous central NC straight-line winds. I live up a dirt road that goes down a steep dip then back up to the top of the hill where my partner and I and our only neighbors across the way live. Now, they know we're gay and they don't care. We all hit it off and got pretty close right off the bat. Her brother, way down the hill is a bigole phobe. When I got home the other night, there were a couple of big trees blown down at the bottom of the dip and I heard neighbor-man in the middle of them with a chainsaw and saw neighbor-lady handing in tools every so often. I got out of the car, allowed as how I'd get my chainsaw and stuff and would be right back. I trod up the hill, loaded up my ittybitty lawn-tractor with its buggy behind with a chainsaw, bar oil, two-stroke fuel, log chain, a roll of deer-wire to repair his fence that got creased when the trees fell over it. Her daddy brought his John Deer (which, I'll admit I covet, sigh) and his mom brought some other tools and ice water for us all. We set to cutting and clearing together. I hooked the log chain to the box blade on her dad's tractor and he pulled the logs I had cut through out of the drive-side and we worked together to get that much cleared while neighbor-man cut and cleared inside the fence-line. Directly, her brother-the-phobe came down and asked if he could help (we were nearly done by then) and OH NOES he sees me, the one he thought was "one of them". I could see the shock and dismay at seeing me, then the confusion as he saw me with a chainsaw in one hand and a log chain over the other shoulder, as covered in mud as everyone else. I could see the gears in his head going EEERRRKK@#@#(&(&*$$^#(*()$!!!! I walked over, scrubbed my hand on my jeans, introduced myself, shook hands like anyone else and there went another stereotype bitin' the dust.

Heh. Gayguys really, really are just like everyone else. You know more of 'em then you think you do, believe me on this. You just don't know you do.

Same with folks who've smoked a little. Same with people who happen to own a firearm or two.

I'll say it again. We can't change the whole world. Well, not at once. But we can sweep off our own front porches, stick out a hand (even if ya have to do like I did and scrub it off on your jeans first :D) and demonstrate that folks are folks. Screaming didn't work and the RW have gotten really tiresome for it. Screaming back didn't work. Guess in all our issues we're just gonna have to lead by example.

:grouphug:

Peace, y'uns.
:hippie:

(EDIT: To clarify antecedents)

[aspergris]

35. good post... but ... :)

"I don't favor just the Second at the expense of the rest as NRA-ILA"

I don't think this is fair analysis. It's not that the NRA et al favor the 2nd at the EXPENSE of other amendments, it's that they are a narrowly focused advocacy group. It's like the difference between NARAL and NOW. THe former concentrates on abortion rights specifically. It doesn't mean it favors the 4th (where the right to abortion comes from via judicial review) at the EXPENSE of the rest.

Similarly, FIRE concentrates on 1st amendment issues specifically related to college and high school campuses. That's an even narrower focus - 1 amendment and only in education. It doesn't mean they favor the 1st at the EXPENSE of the 4th, 5th, etc. It means that is their focus.

I have no problem with that.

It's kind of like some attorneys focus on DUI defense. It doesn't mean they do so "at the expense" of defendants in other types of crimes. It just means that's their focus.

Specialty is good. It's hard to be effective or expert at everything.

[RedLetterRev]

36. Aahh, read closely, my friend

The NRA-ILA are a separate entity from the NRA. I am an NRA member, but I will have nothing to do with NRA-ILA.

The ILA focus strenuously on the Second as a hook and are a rabidly right-wing political think-tank. They're involved in a whole lot more issues than gun control. Right now, they've got a whole campaign going on about "elitist" Obama is going to take all your guns away and force hummasekshul marriage and appoint activist judges... all typical extremsit freeperschpiel. (Now, somebody please tell me how Obama how grew up from very a modest, if not humble, background to make something of himself on his own is an elitist and McKook who cheated on his first wife to marry the second for the second for a fortune and umpteen mansions isn't. I'd love to know how that freeperlogic works.)

No, they're worse than the freepers, believe me. I read mailings from both entities and the ILA are entirely, entirely different from the NRA.

Just sayin'.

[Pavulon]

34. Stupid laws punish the poor and minorities

drug laws drive murder, and violence.

Prohibition is a failure and waste of money.