"Japanese manners squad will force you to give up that seat"

[Bonobo]

There was a time in Japan when courtesy was second nature. If you saw an elderly person, a pregnant woman or somebody on crutches, you would leap up and offer them your seat. These days, you pretend to be asleep and avoid eye contact at all costs.

But the spiralling decline of train-seat etiquette may be about to end with the arrival of an elite, fearless and impeccably polite “manners squadron” - to be unleashed on the Yokohama underground network in an attempt to avert a breakdown of the “Japanese way”.


is simple: to patrol the length of the train and make sure that any seats - highly prized on Japan's packed commuter lines - are vacated by the young and offered to those who need them.

The officers will have no legal authority, no powers to fine and virtually no practical sanction at all. Their success will depend entirely on the high visibility of their bright green uniforms, and their capacity to charm or shame the sitter into becoming a stander.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article3578770.ece

Here's the cute logo:

[Bob Dobbs]

1. Too bad the Japanese manners squad won't force you to stop killing whales.

The "Japanese way" is hypocrisy.

[JHB]

2. And how is that different from most other "ways"? n/t

[Bonobo]

3. It's a fine thing to see the effect of the AMA (American Idiocracy Media) on citizens...

You have reduced thousands of years and billions of people into your own caricature (especially ironic since it is the Americans that have driven some whales to near extinction and NOT the Japanese). Oh, that's right, Whales are smart and cute (maybe even Alien?) and they deserve your ritual attention, unlike pigs, cows, baby cows, baby pigs, chickens and other animals that are tortured systematically by the billions in our own country -not even mentioning the HUMAN KILLING on a GRAND SCALE done by the US...

But you just go ahead and build up your own personal imaginary evil cultures! It's an important facet of being a GOOD 'MURKIN in 21st century America. I'm sure glad you chose the "DEMOCRATIC SIDE (TM)" though! So you're good! You're good!

Keep up with those "progressive values"! You're doing GREEEEAT!!!

[Bob Dobbs]

4. I've been a vegan for 33 years.

I fight american carnivorism daily and understand that america is the worst culture in history on almost every level.

I fought the Vietnam war and every war since. My outrage over the 2000 coup d'etat cost me my career. I just gave Obama for America 50 more dollars today.

You don't know shit about my progressive values, and I stand by my condemnation of Japan for their systematic mass slaughter of whales.

[aspergris]

7. wow. how holy are YOU?

"I fight american carnivorism daily "

do you fight native american carnivorism? Many native american tribes have/had diets that are almost entirely meat based. Inuits come to mind.

Is carnivorism evil?

"and understand that america is the worst culture in history on almost every level."

Right. A worse culture than Nazi germany, or authoritarian communist USSR etc.


"I fought the Vietnam war and every war since. My outrage over the 2000 coup d'etat cost me my career. I just gave Obama for America 50 more dollars today.

You don't know shit about my progressive values"

It's a progressive value to "understand" that america is the worst culture in history?

No, it's just historical ignorance.

Lack of meat has affected yer reasoning ability. Get thee a steak, pronto

I suggest daily watching of Anthony Bourdain, and 5 units of liquified pork! STAT!

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

9. ...

:applause:

[aspergris]

10. thanks!

I'll be here all week. Donations at the door.

[Bob Dobbs]

11. Carnivorism is the most unethical environmental choice available.

Eating sentient beings isn't funny and it is the most major contributor to world hunger and environmental degradation.

Laugh yourself silly, meat eater.

Yes, a worse culture than Nazi Germany and communism. It is you that is ignorant of the real history of america.

[aspergris]

12. Way to dodge the question

So do you also fight native american carnivorism, etc. or is it only american carnivorism that meets your ire?

Also there are numerous examples of meat that comes from non-sentient beings - clams, etc.

is that evil too?

I am well aware of the Real History of America (tm), and anybody who thinks we have a worse culture than Nazi Germany or the USSR clearly is not aware.

[hendo]

13. but but

clams aren't cute... they don't count

:sarcasm:

[Clark2008]

17. This clam is cute

:)

[Bob Dobbs]

19. Clams are sentient beings.

I fight all carnivorism.

You are aware that we genocided more American Indians than the Nazi's did Jews, gypsies et al. We also had two hundred years of legalized slavery. (Slavery today is perpetrated by the banks.)

Not to mention all our murderous imperial escapades worldwide. And now we think torture is perfectly acceptable.

Yeah, american history is just great.

[Marrah_G]

22. You are just too funny!

I'm on to you now. You are just teasing us!

[Bob Dobbs]

23. Just uncompromising.

I'm too old to be funny.

[Marrah_G]

26. Good luck with that.

[Bob Dobbs]

30. Luck has nothing to do with it.

I just have to stand up for what I truly believe, though I get viciously attacked for it.

Carnivores are more adamant than rethuglicans in defending the indefensible.

[Marrah_G]

36. You are the one doing the attacking

You took a thread on Manners and singe-handedly showed how incredibly rude a person can be.

You have hi-jacked this thread and made some nasty and offensive posts towards other DUers completely unprovoked.

[Bob Dobbs]

57. Hardly unprovoked.

None of my posts have been deleted by administrators, unlike yourself.

[aspergris]

61. still dodging - "clams are sentient beings"

still waiting for you to retract or support that false statement

[aspergris]

31. you are making spelling errors

You meant to say "woefully ignorant and unscientific" not "uncompromising"

hth

[LanternWaste]

27. What/where is the Objective Scale of Unjust Cultures?

What/where is the Objective Scale of Unjust Cultures that allows you, with an absolute morality, to make the claim that the American culture is the worst in history?

Or... and I find this much more likely, it's a simple opinion of yours based on little more than subjective and anecdotal experiences.

[aspergris]

28. Clams are sentient beings?

Clams don't have BRAINS, so how can they be sentient

Your ignorance is showing. Clams react to stimuli, sure. But so does a plant. You eat plants, right?

So, you are already striking out in the logic and science dept. It's like arguing with a creationist. Your knowledge (lack thereof) of science hurts my brain.

I am fine if you choose not to eat clams. But to claim they are sentient shows you are either woefully ignorant, or you have some special insight into sentience that no biologist has. Wow! You are holy and in possession of super secret claim sentience knowledge!

Your other section of the post is equally ignorant. Yes, we had 200 yrs of legalized slavery. There are cultures today that have had many TIMES that much legalized slavery and STILL have it. Many many more cultures had more years of slavery. Many other cultures treated slaves far worse (brazil, for example). That's easily verifiable by the # of slave deaths per slave. Much higher in their culture than we had.

Yes, it's wrong that (the extremely rare instances) of torture are ok'd by bushco. But it's far worse that some cultures routinely torture and even kill people for adultery, for being gay, for daring to proselytize christianity, for mocking islam.

But we are the WORST culture? lol

You need to open a book and your mind.

It's closed and functioning very poorly.

[Bob Dobbs]

34. Clams do feel.

I've read more books than you have, I assure you.

It is your mind that is closed to the suffering your choices inflict.

[aspergris]

37. stop dodging the question

you claimed clams are sentient beings.

that's patently false.

there is no way anybody with even a passing knowledge of science, specifically biology, could claim clams are sentient.

"feel" is not the issue. That's a much more subjective word.

Clams have ganglia, but they don't have a cerebral cortex. They can react to stimuli, but they are not CONSCIOUS or SENTIENT, which is the point.

I can build a simple device that reacts to stimuli. That doesn't make it sentient.

Claims react to stimuli. They can't "feel" in the sense of being aware of pain. They aren't AWARE of anything, since they are not sentient.

So, stop dodging the issue.

You claimed clams are SENTIENT.

You have neither retracted your statement - which would actually require intellectual honesty or provided (lol) proof for same

[Bob Dobbs]

49. Your concept pain is different from mine, I guess.

Compassion should have no limit as to the species to which it is extended.

[aspergris]

51. again, you dodge the question. intellectual dishonesty noted

you have morphed the topic because you refuse to address your false claim

that's a sophomoric, dishonest tactic

you claimed CLAMS ARE SENTIENT BEINGS

that's false, i've demonstrated why it's false, and you refuse to acknowledge your error or provide (lol) proof for same

you are making yourself a laughingstock because everybody reading this who understands biology at all, or has a search engine can confirm that when you said "clams are sentient beings" you made a false statememt

making a mistake isn't a big deal. we all do it

being intellectually dishonest and childishly refusing to admit your mistake is a big deal. because it's intellectually dishonest (bad) , childish (ditto) and shows you to have no credibility.

like i said, you are like a nonscientific creationist (is that redundant) who, when cornered with EVIDENCE, evades the subject

deal with it.

[Bob Dobbs]

56. Is the clam harmed by you eating it?

I would contend that it is.

Whether it intellectually comprehends the horror of you eating it is relatively inconsequential. It would react to the pain of you eating it, and that is what I would seek to avoid.

I accept the negative karma that I get from eating plants, but I subscribe to the Jain analysis of the levels of karma that are gained by eating more or less sentient beings. I guess eating a clam gets you slightly less karma than eating a cow, but more than eating a tomato.

The operative concept is harm inflicted by the choices you make.

Sentience to me implies the ability to feel pain. If a clam reacts negatively to pain, as it does, that indicates sentience. I also would consider plants to be sentient, and the earth to be sentient.

[aspergris]

63. still dodging

"sentience TO ME" (emphasis mine)

sentient has a meaning. look it up

clams are not, and cannot be sentient.

you do what most intellectually dishonest people do when they finally realize they are wrong.

you try to change definitions to weasel your way out

[Marrah_G]

43. They have no brain

A Mollusk has no formal nervous system, but has a series of ganglia that conduct impulses. A clam has no consciousness.

[hendo]

66. aversion to pain does not a sentient being make

pain aversion is a natural reflex and in no way indicates a planned and thought out response.

[aspergris]

68. correct

a simple robot can react to impulses that we, as SENTIENT beings would refer to as pain

clams react to stimuli. that doesn't mean they FEEL pain.

they have no sentience. pain stimuli, in a sentient being, cause feelings of discomfort, an emotional AS WELL as a physical response.

clams cannot have an emotional response to pain because they DON'T HAVE EMOTIONS, or consciousness or sentience.

I can program a robot to react to the same stimuli a clam does. This doesn;t make the robot sentient.

Again, this OP can't simply admit he was wrong, or his entire ego edifice would come crashing down.

veganism is his religion, as such it is not subject to scientific scrutiny.

I respect veganism as a moral stance.

I don't respect intellectual dishonesty, nor evasion hedging and obfuscation

sentient means something. he can try to dilute it all he wants. those of us who understand science laff

[bean fidhleir]

99. I think you might mean "sensate" rather than "sentient"

They do indeed feel, which would make them "sensate". But I don't believe they've been shown to be able to think, which they would have to do in order to be "sentient". We might just not be able to detect the thinking they do, but it's still an overstatement to claim they have some ability that no one's been able to detect.

[Name removed]

44. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Marrah_G]

Oooooo

Bad :spank:

[aspergris]

48. i was avoiding all bearded clam comments

choosing instead to take the High Road (tm)

Does that make me as holy as Mr. Clams are Sentient?

[TahitiNut]

88. Well ... if memory serves ...

:evilgrin:

[Name removed]

50. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[aspergris]

52. you still evade the topic

you said clams are sentient beings

that is false. and you refuse to acknowledge that it's false, but keep changing the subject

intellectual dishonesty much?

we all make mistakes. some of us can admit when we do

you can't

sign of intellectual dishonesty and immaturity.

sad.

and visible for all to see

[Bob Dobbs]

60. Your definition of sentience is more limited than mine.

My compassion extends further than yours.

[aspergris]

67. the issue is science, not compassion

sentient has a scientific meaning

you are exactly the same as a creationist, except your religion happens to be veganism. because it's your religion, you will ignore science, and evidence, and instead redefine words to suit your "compassion"

again, an exact analogue to an unscientific creationist who when presented with evidence of evolution will do the same.

sentient means something.

clams are not, and cannot be sentient

you are using your emotions to ignore science

how typical.

nice to know that progressives can be as ignorant, as dismissive of science, and as intellectually dishonest as any other type of ideologue.

not that I didn't already know this, but thanks for reinforcing that people are people, and some people will discount evidence when it conflicts with their religious beliefs.

[ForrestGump]

105. Tempers are flaring

I think we need to heed that old adage about music soothing the savage beast. So I here offer neutral ground for reflection:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=furscuLX_Zs

[hendo]

72. Thats fine with me

it means that I get your share of the tasty fleshy animals.
*drool*

[bean fidhleir]

83. The trad Inuit diet is situational - there's essentially no growing season that far north

So their diet is not a choice.

I hope we avert the disaster instead, but if climate change progresses far enough, the Inuit diet will change because the non-humans they now exploit will be gone, and there WILL be a growing season. No land -it'll all be occupied by the wealthy elites who've escaped from Mexico, the US and lower Canada- but a growing season.

[aspergris]

84. You begged the question

"the non-humans they now EXPLOIT" (emphasis mine)

It is nowhere clear that the inuits are exploiting the animals they eat.

that word has negative connotations that show your bias imo.

I've hunted wildlife (to include fish). I have not exploited wildlife

[bean fidhleir]

92. Of course I didn't.

"Exploit" is also a technical term, which is how I used it. Read some anthropology.

The bottom line is that the diet of the First Nation people living near and above the Arctic Circle is determined by their environment, not their personal or cultural choice.

[aspergris]

96. Fair enough

In that usage you are entirely correct. my bad

[Marrah_G]

20. Hhahahahahahahahahahah

You are a real piece of work.

Insanity or satire, I have yet to decide which I am viewing.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

69. What do you call it when your ego eats itself?

[hendo]

16. I wonder

if he smells his own farts, or thinks that his sh*t doesn't stink.

We have a major smug alert in the area: http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/104282/?tag=Smug

[Bob Dobbs]

21. Just trying to do what I think is right.

Obviously, it's not easy to really stand up for what you believe without compromise.

[aspergris]

33. nobody is faulting you for veganism.

I respect veganism

you are being faulted for being an unscientific ninny. far worse than any creationist I have spoken to. "clams are sentient beings".

or your absurd statements that american culture is the worse in history.

or your great campaign against american carnivorism, yet you still refuse to condemn native american carnivorism. Is that because they aren't part of the "worst culture in history" so it's kewl that they are carnivorous?

cue me in to your way of thinking. I need a new subject for abnormal psychology

[Bob Dobbs]

35. I condemn ALL carninvores through history, Indians included.

American culture is now the most intellectually dishonest in history. Americans live in total denial about how this country was founded, how it flourished, what it has done throughout the world and what it is doing now throughout the world. Americans live in denial about what the culture is doing to its own people right now.

The reference to american carnivorism is in response to the OP's vicious attack on me for condemning the Japanese for systematic slaughter of whales.

[aspergris]

39. and again you fail to address your "clams are sentient" claim

That's a scientific statement, thus subject to scientific evidence.

present some.

there is none, so you will either go the intellectual dishonesty route, or the evasion route.

or maybe some nice ad hominems

i'll stand by

[WriteDown]

58. So you condemn my tribe?

You will never escape the fact that all humans are omnivores and our bodies are meant to eat both plants and animals. Do you feed your dog meat-free dog food or how about your cat?

Let me tell you something, my tribe comdemns you! Its people like you with your holier than thou attitudes that just gravitate toward militantly forcing people toward your way of life. Next time we need advice on our diet we'll be sure to give you a ring since you seem to be the authority.

[cherokeeprogressive]

73. Do you extend that condemnation to carnivores in the animal kingdom as well?

Is the lion worthy of your condemnation? Surely it's a sentient being, and the animals it predates are sentient beings.

Is the tuna worthy of your condemnation? Being one of the most ferocious predators in the sea, and the fact that it eats fish which are surely sentient beings, it's worthy of your condemnation also?

Where does it end with you?

[aspergris]

74. I'll play devil's advocate and reply to this

Lions, Tuna, etc. do not have the level of intellectual and moral development such that they can make moral choices.

Since they CAN'T by their nature make moral choices... and are simply responding to instinct, a vegan wouldn't condemn them

Humans, as moral agents can make moral choices.

Like I said, I respect veganism as a moral stance.

Scientifically I don't respect a vegan who claims clams are sentient. That's just dumb

[cherokeeprogressive]

75. Oh I totally agree with you. The poster said though that "carnivores suck" without qualification.

Which in my mind, since he/she's so intellectually superior to me, means that every living thing that is carnivorous is caught in his net.

[aspergris]

76. Yes

And think how many prey animals he could save by killing a few carnivores.

Of course carnivores (generally) help the Cycle of Life (tm) by thinning the herd of weak and diseased animals, etc.

But of course, hunters do the same. I used to live on an island with a fair amount of deer. Hunters were crucial to maintaining a healthy deer population.

Without hunting, many deer would starve.

I would argue, whatever you think of carnivorism, it is more humane to kill some adult deer with a shot to the head, then to let many more , especially young fawns , starve to death.

[cherokeeprogressive]

78. Completely agree.

I used to live on Whidbey Island in WA and there were deer everywhere you looked it seemed as long as you were a mile out of town or more.

And, damn were they ever tasty!

[aspergris]

81. Similar situation where I lived

Fwiw, I used to hunt sometimes with a wampanoag friend (they had access to pretty choice hunting grounds), and they would eat the raw liver of the just killed deer. I wonder mr anti-carnivore would think of that.

I'm a huge liver fan in general, but on the whole - I prefer it cooked :)

[cherokeeprogressive]

85. Cooked! By all means cooked.

I can see it in my mind though... my wanpanoag friends and I celebrating a successful hunt... I bend down with my bowie knife and cut out an organ and take a huge bite... they laugh til they cry and fall to the ground slapping their knees... see, I've just eaten the dead animal's spleen...

One of the most succulent things I have ever tasted was heart of venision, just hours after the kill. Never refrigerated. It was cut into strips, and sauteed with butter and garlic.

[Ignis]

40. "I respect veganism"

You think it makes people stupid and unable to reason.

You're free to be an idiot and an asshole, but do try for consistency in your arguments, at least. :hi:

[aspergris]

46. No i think plenty of vegans

are intelligent, logical and scientific.

this one isn't.

he claimed clams are sentient. that's demonstrably false. and he refuses to provide (lol) evidence of same or retract his statement and show intellectual honesty.

veganism is a moral stance i respect.

his particular moral stance is tangential to his scientific ignorance, which is undeniable. his historical ignorance is also notable but that's at least an OPINION, since whose culture is worst is at least ARGUABLE since it's an opinion. whereas claiming that clams are sentient is antiscientific rubbish right up there with creationism

I don't think veganism makes people stupid and unable to reason. if you can't see the humour in my anthony bourdain pork injection post, then you need to get a life.

Vegans, just like carnivores, christians, atheists, democrats, republicans, libertarians, etc. can be smart or dumb, honest or dishonest, etc.

I am indicting this particular poster for his ignorance and his intellectual dishonesty. Not his veganism. Oh, and also his I'm so Holy (tm) attitude doesn't help

hth

[Ignis]

82. Oh yes, the problem is ALWAYS with the reader, isn't it?

I don't think veganism makes people stupid and unable to reason. if you can't see the humour in my anthony bourdain pork injection post, then you need to get a life.

There's absolutely, positively NO WAY IN HELL that the problem could EVER be with your ham-fisted writing and tin-eared humor, is there?

Talk about "holier-than-thou" attitudes.... :eyes:

Enjoy your stay!

[aspergris]

87. are you one of the perpetually outraged?

one of the things I enjoy about Bourdain is his ribbing (no pun intended) of vegetarians and vegans.

As a former vegetarian, I can have a sense of humour about vegetarianism.

Vegetarians don't win friends or sympathy by being humourless. No group - religious, ideology based (feminist, pacifist, etc.) gains sympathy by being viewed as a bunch of holier than thou humourless ninnies.

The perpetually outraged humourless progressive is a stereotype that is unfortunately represented too often. We've all seen it.

I can respect people REGARDLESS OF IDEOLOGY much more when they aren't uptight humourless ninnies.

If you can't laff at yourself, your just a bitter person.

Reminds me of Isaac Hayes of South Park (plays chef). South park routinely riffs on Christians in general, Catholics (especially that Catholic league guy), Jews, Atheists (they totally skewer dawkins), feminists, rednecks, conseratives, Mormons, etc.

but when lord forbid they ragged on scientology, Isaac Hayes who is a scientologist. quit. the OUTRAGE.

[Ignis]

93. Oh I can "laff" at _funny_ jokes just fine.

But when your text consists of the following:

- insult 1
- disparagement 1
- argument 1
- insult 2
- supporting factoid 1
- insult 3
- argument 2
- disparagement 2
- supporting factoid 2
- insult 4
- etc.

...then you need to learn how to write effectively so as to highlight the transition from your usual ad-hominem style to when you're attempting humor.

It's all very well to say, "You're fat and stupid" to another DUer--if that's what gets you sweaty, I suppose. But when someone calls you on those insults and you say, "Oh I was just kidding about the fat part," you're being disingenuous at best. Most people will probably (and justifiably) assume that you're just back-pedaling because you're afraid of having your little hand slapped.

Then again, most of the South Park Libertarians I've met have a problem with taking personal responsibility for their actions, despite all their bluster to the contrary.

"Grow up" indeed, Mr. Pot.

[aspergris]

95. Except that's not what I did

I made fun of his holier than thou attitude which other people noticed as well

He CRIED out to be ridiculed

[Ignis]

97. Except that's not what you wrote.

Please explain exactly how the sentence you wrote--"Lack of meat has affected yer reasoning ability"--can be interpreted to mean "You are lacking in humility."

You'll have to bear with me, as I was assuming that the sentence above was written in English. Perhaps there's another language in which "you are dumb" and "you are too proud" are semantically identical?

:shrug:

If so, you should probably write in that language, rather than using English words that mean something completely different. The word "black" isn't semantically equivalent to the word "white," no matter how much it would assist your attempts at back-pedaling for it to be so.

[aspergris]

98. There is no backpedaling

only your lack of humour. Read his frigging post and then read my response.

[Ignis]

100. I've read both. I even posted the words YOU wrote.

So are you claiming that those words mean something other than the traditional English meanings, or that you have a secret language that you're using, or that "dumb" and "proud" are exactly the same thing, or that you're writing in code, or ... what, exactly?

Look, I'm sorry you got caught in a lie. That's no fun for anyone. But back-pedaling, obfuscating, and insulting me doesn't change the fact that you claim to have said X when your words actually said Y.

Wishing really, really hard doesn't make "dog" mean "cat." Sorry.

[bean fidhleir]

104. "He CRIED out to be ridiculed"

I'd disagree. He just used the wrong word, as anyone might and many do. That would merit respectful correction, but not ridicule.

[hendo]

65. I know

But that is no reason to attack the entire history of Japanese civilization and thier legendary honor system because they happen to still hunt whales. Just like it is not fair to judge the entirity of german history based on the actions of the Nazis, or judge the entirity of American history based on the actions of Bush.

The japanese have historically been far more environmentalist, and pacifist than just about any other industrialized country. Whale hunting though, is an historical tradition.

[Ignis]

38. "Lack of meat has affected yer reasoning ability."

Cute. Nice broad brush.

Enjoy your stay.

[aspergris]

47. it's called humour

grow up.

boot up yer humour chip y0!

[Ignis]

79. d00d ur so FLY wit'cho dank lingo dawg

But your ability to effectively communicate via written/typed text is only marginally above that of a squashed apricot.

Written humor is difficult. Stick to bathroom walls; they're more your level.

Enjoy your stay!

[aspergris]

89. When a humourless person

Tells me I am not funny, that's a compliment.

thx

[Marrah_G]

15. "I fight american carnivorism daily"

Sorry but....



:rofl:

[Bob Dobbs]

24. Laugh yourself sick.

That meat is rotting in your intestines right now.

[Marrah_G]

29. Yes- I will continue to laugh at you and your special way of communicating with others.

Good luck with your fight.

[aspergris]

102. to quote Tom Petty

"a rebel without a clue"

one who thinks clams are SENTIENT.

What's his current justification? Well, he has HIS OWN DEFINITION of sentient.

lol.

I think my golf club is sentient. Why? Well, I have my OWN definition

lol

[hendo]

86. I like vegans

they are like carbon offsets. For every vegan I know, I get to eat more meat.

[Ignis]

94. I'm in the wrong business!

I should be selling my diet in the form of carbon-offset coupons outside steakhouses!

[hendo]

106. damn straight

It must be the ethical issues that make so many vegans unaware of the millions to be made in making people feel better about thier meat eating habits.

Silly vegans/vegitarians.

edit: although I suppose its like they say in "Thank you for smoking". You can't condemn something and still keep the money.

[Retired AF Dem]

109. The real question is

how do we stop all animals from eating meat before they help us destroy the enviroment?

[progressive_realist]

5. But tell us how you really feel...

:)

Too bad we can't recommend responses.

[Bill McBlueState]

18. way to take the flames!

First you have to convince the OP that you actually care about all animals, not just whales, and then you have to fend off the "centrist" squad because you care *too much* about animals.

Welcome to DU!

[Bob Dobbs]

25. I was born in East Texas,

and it hasn't been very fun to try to be me all these years.

Carnivores suck.

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Ignis]

42. A vegan in east Texas? You're a braver man than I! (nt)

[masmdu]

55. What about Meat that doesn't come from an animal ... would you eat that?

Seriously

[Bob Dobbs]

59. And that would be. . . ?

?

[masmdu]

71. In vitro Meat....Lab grown meat that doesn't come from animals...

http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2008/04/i...

Rapidly evolving technology and increasing concern about the environmental impact of meat production are signs that vat-grown meat is moving from scientific curiosity to consumer option. In vitro meat production is a specialized form of tissue engineering, a biomedical practice in which scientists try to grow animal tissues like bone, skin, kidneys and hearts. Proponents say it will ultimately be a more efficient way to make animal meat, which would reduce the carbon footprint of meat products.

More here:

New Harvest is a nonprofit research organization working to develop new meat substitutes, including cultured meat — meat produced in vitro, in a cell culture, rather than from an animal.

http://www.new-harvest.org/default.php

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_vitro_meat

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4148164.stm

[aspergris]

90. to quote

PJ ORourke.

"If meat is murder, are eggs rape?"

[Bob Dobbs]

91. I wouldn't eat that for health reasons.

It doesn't sound very good for you.

[ZombieHorde]

54. The "Japanese way" is hypocrisy.

Just because you don't understand something does not make that thing bad.

[Bob Dobbs]

62. I have worked with Japanese and in Japan.

Unfortunately, I understand plenty.

[Occam Bandage]

64. A direct hit!

[johnfunk]

110. Nothing like harpooning a li'l hypocrisy -- besides, their wimpy manners squad is...

... no match for America's greatest superhero; POLITENESSMAN!

[aspergris]

6. Same is true here

"There was a time in Japan when courtesy was second nature"

I was taught that way, and damn if I'm still not that way. I mean you are on a bus (can't remember the last time I was on a train), you give your seat to the elderly or a woman. If that's sexist, then fine.

It's a matter of civility I think.

From what I have seen on buses here in Seattle, there are many here who do abide by that courtesy, but sadly - many who don't

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

8. Oh How Silly LOL

Manners squad :rofl:

[Marr]

14. Someone once told me, "Japan isn't just weirder than you think...

... it's weirder than you *can* think".

Hehe.

[MadHound]

41. Hmm, these same manners were once prevalent in America

However for the past thirty five years or so we've just become more rude and obnoxious every passing year. Perhaps we need a manners squad here in the US.

[lukasahero]

45. We could use one in this thread in fact.

;)

That said, this manners squad rings a little too close to the "Ministry of Virtue and Prevention of Vice" to me. (Not that anyone's actually talking about the OP anymore.) I suppose the amount of legal authority the squad actually has makes a difference but still...

[hootinholler]

101. Yeah I wish a couple of posters would just clam up! n/t

[tpsbmam]

53. Thank you.....

If you're the person who has difficulty standing on those trains, particularly for a long ride, I suspect you'd be grateful. I have MS and use a cane (and if my legs are really bad, a scooter, at which point seating isn't an issue....it's caused me to use it sometimes when I haven't needed to).....more often than not, I've been left standing while young (and not so young) healthy people have been sitting. There have been times I've asked if someone would be willing to give up a seat if I'm getting to the point where I feel like my legs are going to give out.....most of the time I just seethe and leave the area as soon as possible. It tends to wreck the strength in my legs for hours though -- energy conservation is key with most people with MS. I note that this has happened lots of places, including Democratic meetups and similar "progressive" meetings.

Note that there are plenty of people with invisible disabilities who also need to sit -- can't make assumptions about the people who are sitting. But I know damn well that a significant portion of the people who do their best to pretend they don't see you are perfectly healthy but just lazy and inconsiderate. It's those people I wish would get something disabling....just for a month...but I do wish that on them.

I have my own "manners squad" in my house and have pissed a few parents off as a result. I've given parties where I've had kids quickly take all of the available seats despite the fact that there were people present who NEEDED to sit. I throw the kids out of the chairs, point them to the floor, and make sure all of the people who NEED to sit in a chair can do so. A couple of times I've gotten nasty stares from their parents. Ummmmm, teach your kids some manners and common decency!! The parents may need some lessons in all of that themselves.

(When I was a kid, if I wasn't out of a seat in 2 seconds flat when an adult needed to sit, I got the death stare from my mother!)

[PVnRT]

70. This thread belongs in the DU hall of fame

If we have an accusation that gays cause global warming, it will be in the top spot.

[Occam Bandage]

77. You don't think they do? Look where gays are.

San Francisco? New York? They're always RIGHT AT THE WATER. And they're all talking about how hot they are, and the WATER LEVELS ARE RISING THIS IS NOT A COINCIDENCE PEOPLE

[cherokeeprogressive]

80. Actually, I thought it was vegan flatulence that caused climate change... n/t

[hootinholler]

103. No it's the clams, silly!

Actually, bovine flatulence is a major source of methane. We should eat more beef!

-Hoot

[Buns_of_Fire]

107. So what have we learned today?

I now know that if a clam is sitting where a nice little old granny-lady needs to rest, the Japanese Polite Squad will eject their sentient (or not) carcass tout suite. (The clam, not the nice little old granny-lady.)

Or something like that.

[Deja Q]

108. Hmmm, a heart placed over where its gonads would be...

Still, with parents not teaching manners to children, don't color me shocked.