Are Lewis Hamilton and Tiger Woods selling out?

[tachyon]

Their venues of success (golf and car racing) are frequently the objects of hatred from Liberals in general and DU in particular. Or do they get a pass because of ethnicity? There are obviously a lot of folks around here with mixed
emotions about this...anybody care to comment?
(I've been accused of elitism for liking both those sports...and indeed been informed they're not even 'sports' at all)

[AP]

1. Most great professional golfers grew up poor.

There are more great golfers who made money caddying when they were young, rather than grew up playing at their parents' country club being caddied.

And for every Ayrton Senna (whose family was rich), there's an Alain Prost (whose father was a carpenter) and Michael Schumacher (whose father ran a go-kart track).

I don't know how it's selling out to work really hard at something, do really well at it, and get paid what you're worth.

[tachyon]

2. Mostly true but doesn't address my question...

nu?

[AP]

5. It answered it with a question.

[tachyon]

7. Well, I can't find the question but my own opinion is that

99% of the highest-paid people are grossly overpaid. Of course what they're "worth" is a function of what others are willing to pay them for being talented...which of course has nothing to do with their putative contribution to humankind.

[AP]

10. Right you are. Let me rephrase my comment as a question:

How is it "selling out" to work really hard at something, do really well at it, and get paid what you're worth?

Those sports make millions of dollars. If the athletes weren't making that money, the owners of the teams and leagues would be the only ones getting rich, and THAT would be unfair.

Woods and Hamilton are the ones who worked hard and make the sacrifices (especially Hamilton, who risks his life).

Your complaint should not be with the money made by the athletes, but with the fact that so many working class people are willing to spend their money being entertained by them. Amusing the millions, huh? What's wrong with that?

50 million Elvis fans can't be wrong, no?

[tachyon]

17. I didn't really mean 'selling out' in the true sense...only in the way that many "progressives"

would describe it - participating in ecologically-destructive and inherently wasteful enterprises. I don't personally begrudge their success (I'd LOVE to get a ride in a Formula I car!)

Funny you mention Elvis...I actually met him in person back in...god when was it, 1960 or so. Anyway I just think there's a tiny bit of disconnect when some folks get all bent about the "waste" of fuel (car racing) or real estate (golf) but are willing to suspend their outrage when the politically-correct people use them to their advantage.
:D

[AP]

18. They should go back to 4 cylinder turbocharged F1 cars that were expected to go flat out for

almost two hours on one tank of gas.

[tachyon]

20. That is one thing we absolutely agree on!

:D

[TheMightyFavog]

3. And a lot of the pioneering NASCAR drivers...

Started out as low paid couriers for bootleggers during Prohibition.

[tachyon]

9. And now they are high paid couriers for bootleggers.

:D

(Not actually kidding...much)

[tularetom]

4. Woods is probably the most amazing athlete in the world

It's impossible not to admire his skills, concentration and determination. His social conscience while more developed than most pro golfers could still use a bit more work.

Although he does a lot for kids he sorta wimped out on the whole "women joining augusta National" controversy a couple years back. Again, however, I didn't see other tour pros take up the cause of women either.

[tachyon]

8. I won't even weigh in on the question of whether a golfer is actually an "athlete",

I leave that argument to others. :D

[Mountainman]

11. Do you play golf?

[tachyon]

13. Yes. Not well, but I do. A lot of people think my doing so is exemplary of

elitism (using up real estate for frivilous activity)...I'm not apologizing for it, I just wondered how some of us think about it. That's all...:D

[Mountainman]

23. You can find something wrong with everything if you try. We have a group of people I like to call

the DU Taliban. They will piss on anyone's parade out of liberal elitism.

[WillowTree]

6. Of course not.

For that matter, there were few public courts making tennis a sport enjoyed almost exclusively by people who could afford to join private clubs in the 50s when Arthur Ashe was growing up. Why should any of them be criticized for making use of whatever talents they have?

[tachyon]

12. Is talent the same thing as accomplishment? No offense, I'm just wondering -

if it's proper to extend adulation to someone's innate ability in the same way we generally laud success achieved by dedication and hard work.

[LSdemocrat]

14. Nothing wrong with making money through non-exploitative means

I respect Tiger Woods making tons of money by playing golf and making ads much more than some CEO that gets paid millions to ship job overseas and run their companies into the ground.

[kenny blankenship]

15. What do you care what some DUer thinks of them ?

I don't know Woods' story but I do know that Hamilton has worked hard his whole life to be where he is. And he's more than a great driver and a good sport, he's a good person. You can see it in his face and you can see it by watching his behavior after his wins, for example just today in Australia. See how generous he is in wanting to share the good feeling of winning with others like Nico Rosberg, who came in third today? The hug he threw on Rosberg after the race was sincere and, well, I've never seen newlyweds so happy on the church steps. Hamilton's happiness in winning is almost bizarrely unselfish. He'd be within rights to be snotty and selfish, but he isn't that way. Just compare Hamilton to his ex-teammate Alonso. Fernando Alonso is an arrogant, selfish jerk and not coincidentally, his brattish spoiling behavior is also a major reason -if not the main reason- why Hamilton didn't win the driver's Championship last year in his rookie season. It is surely hard to concentrate when you're worried that your "teammate" may just shunt you into a wall at 100mph. Lewis Hamilton is a prince among men, in a sport where pricks and prima donnas are more the rule.

Sure F1 is an elitist sport. So what? Any sport at that level is elite in nature, no matter how lowly its origins. It costs hundreds of millions of dollars to field a serious F1 team and they don't hand out driver's contracts to just anyone. The huge talent Lewis Hamilton has -or for that matter the huge talent that the jerk Fernando Alonso has- is rewarded just to the extent that advertisers and ticket buyers pump money into the till of F1-inc (which is a LOT). I don't see their profession as morally compromised just because it involves working with industrial giants and burning gas, and getting paid lots of money to drive for a couple of hours. Actually I burn a lot of gasoline myself; alas no one recognizes my mad skills as a wheelman. If people think F1 must be "elitist" because fewer people relate to it than one of the "-ball" sports that dominate American TV, well to each his own.

[tachyon]

19. Well, that kinda makes my point..."pricks and prima donnas rule..."

He's a wonderful exception (I'd do him in a New York Minute!!!!!!!!!!!) :D :D

But a lot of so-called 'progressives' rant and rail against auto racing IN GENERAL....(I do not)...but they're willing to suspend their outrage when one of their own does well. That's not a bad thing but it is borderline hypocritical. :-)

[Thurston Howell III]

16. Would anyone here turn down that money if they were that good?

:shrug:

[tachyon]

21. I wouldn't. Being an old whore...I'm easy!

:D

[Thurston Howell III]

22. Fore!!!

[alfredo]

24. You have to be very fit to drive F1 cars. You are subjected to G forces

your concentration has to be intense, and reflexes of a cat. You are plummeted by the wind, subjected to heat, and are jerked around by g forces and uneven surfaces. You need to be able to read the car and conditions. Then there's the other drivers.

Golf takes endurance just as the F1 drivers. Though golfers don't have to deal with speed and danger, they need extraordinary body sense, excellent eyesight, and intense concentration. The playing field is ever changing, you have to be able to read the course. Humidity, wind, time of day need to be read. It's a very intense intellectual sport.