Homeless Study Looks at 'Housing First'

[G_j]

The Wall Street Journal

Homeless Study Looks at 'Housing First'
Shifting Policies to Get Chronically Ill in Homes May Save Lives, Money
By JOE BARRETT
March 6, 2008; Page A10

A four-year study of homeless people with chronic medical problems in Chicago offers fresh evidence that efforts to move the homeless into permanent housing quickly can improve their lives and save taxpayer money. The study was put together by a coalition of hospitals and housing groups seeking hard evidence supporting this approach to dealing with homelessness. Results of the study, which was financed by housing grants from the federal Housing and Urban Development Department and private charities, will be presented today at the National Housing and HIV/AIDS Research Summit in Baltimore.

The study, called the Chicago Housing for Health Partnership, or CHHP, is among the first to use a scientific approach in a housing study of homeless people with problems other than mental illness, according to Dennis Culhane, a professor at the University of Pennsylvania and leading researcher in the field who has followed the study's progress. One group of homeless people that received housing and intensive follow-up by a case manager consumed fewer public resources than a separate group that received "usual care" -- the piecemeal system of emergency shelters, family and recovery programs -- according to a preliminary review of data by the researchers.

Members of the study group, such as Claude Ousley, a 60-year-old with congestive heart failure who had been homeless about five years, spent half as many days in hospitals and nursing homes and went to emergency rooms half as often as the usual-care group over 18 months. The savings more than made up for the $12,000-per-person annual cost of providing housing and a case manager, according to the preliminary findings.

(snip)



URL for this article:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB120477350786615859.html (subscription)

[bobbolink]

1. "is among the first to use a scientific approach in a housing study of homeless people "

Isn't it interesting... so many studies on so many things, so many of them totally useless, but it takes THIS LONG to get an actual study of homelessness?

Thanks for posting this!!

:hug:

[G_j]

2. I suppose

people choose to avoid studying things that they are afraid to know too much about.

[bobbolink]

17. Maybe that .. and... that quote from Galbraith about choosing the

solution first, then building the reasoning around it.

This country is very good at that.

[TahitiNut]

3. It's sad that a KSOTO is so rare ... and it takes "science" to surface it?

KSOTO = Keen Sense Of The Obvious

:shrug:

It is a truly bankrupt nation that has both a surfeit of empty houses and a population of homeless that are also shelterless.
The exploitation of human suffering in service to a system of greed is morally appalling.

[bobbolink]

11. Yes, this is a truly MORALLY bankrupt nation.

It's hard to find the words anymore.

When Moyers had HousingFirst! on over a year ago, I was cheering, again for the obvious.

Enough of this "shelter" crap -- HOUSING FOR ALL!!

And, yes, that is KSOTO!!!

:hi:

[AngryOldDem]

23. Housing

>>It is a truly bankrupt nation that has both a surfeit of empty houses and a population of homeless that are also shelterless.>>

True enough.

However, what kind of shape are those empty houses in? How many people can they safely house? How much will it cost to rehab housing, and how long will it take, and who will foot the bill? Are more public housing complexes (i.e., "projects") needed, and how will we avoid making the mistakes that have condemned many of them to the wrecking ball? If our urban centers are decaying, how do we convince those in outlying areas that the homeless are people, too, and not at all the dangerous stereotypes that many think when they hear the words "homeless person"?

How do we prepare the homeless, especially the chronically homeless -- to assume ownership of a room, an apartment, or a house? How long will it take to teach the basic life skills needed for an independent life outside of shelters? Some who have been on the streets for years have virtually no skills, and most often lose housing not soon after they get it because they just can't manage it.

Of course more housing is needed, but that's easier said than done, and will take a lot of work and commitment on the part of all of us in society to make that happen. For too long the homeless have been passed off as "somebody else's problem" -- well, no, they are human beings who deserve a chance at a stable, comfortable life just as the rest of us do. The problem is, not too many cities or community leaders want to assume the task of ensuring that. So it falls to already-overworked agencies who have to fight these leaders to find suitable, safe, and affordable housing for their clients.

I wish the issue of housing were as simple as some here think it is.

[caseycoon]

4. K&R I want to yell "WELL DUH!" I'm glad they did a study though!

I do wonder why the heck it wasn't completely obvious to everyone in the world.... but having this study to wave in their face is a good thing!
:hi:

[JDPriestly]

5. I worked in the field of assisting the homeless for eight years.

The only solution that works is to provide good, clean, single room or apartment occupancy housing for each homeless person in an environment in which other services are available including participation in making and enforcing rules that apply to all residents as well as lots of mental health services.

Providing housing for homeless people who have no money and no capacity or very little capacity for earning money is expensive, but our patchwork of hit and miss services for the homeless is even more costly. The presence of confused homeless people on our streets degrades our sense of community, our self-respect as a people and trust in each other. There will always be alcoholics or mentally ill people sleeping on park benches even if you do provide housing for all. That exists in every society. Some people become so confused that they can't or are afraid to go to their housing. But, most homeless people want a decent place to sleep, cook and eat and keep their possessions.

If you want to see how the problem of homelessness destroys respect for community life, come to Los Angeles. Here, homeless beggars are ubiquitous. They are OK. But their visible misery and our refusal to fulfill our basic human obligation to care for those in our society who cannot care for themselves degrades the quality of life of every one of us.

I'm not going to go into the pain of the homeless person him or herself because, although I care about that, too many people just don't care. I'm trying to explain why providing good housing for homeless people will help not just them but all of us. The quality of our community life will improve drastically if we take care of the unfortunate who, for whatever reason, cannot care for themselves.

By the way, I have two friends who are homeless. Neither of them drinks or abuses drugs. They both worked most of their lives, are in their 60s and have serious disabilities. They receive limited government benefits and have vouchers for Section 8 or other housing, but they cannot find housing no matter how hard they try. There just is not enough housing available for very poor people -- not in Los Angeles.

[G_j]

6. input

..their visible misery and our refusal to fulfill our basic human obligation to care for those in our society who cannot care for themselves degrades the quality of life of every one of us.

[bobbolink]

10. I can care for myself in every way except having a decent place to live on disability.

Let us please not put everyone in the same bin... there are MANY like me.. some on this very forum.

[G_j]

12. I understand that

but within the system, it grows increasingly difficult and often even impossible for competent people to take care of their needs,
This is the way I see it.

[bobbolink]

13. and that means.... that I must suffer "mental health" shit?

Do you know what they do to people with that?

Pleasse... the article is about HOUSING FIRST.. and that's important for us all.

Enough of all this forcing us all into "treatment" for imagined mental health and alcholism! Really, this gets not only old, but really damaging. I wish you could know what this does to people...

I was excited about this article, and now... it's just the same old same old.

:cry:

[G_j]

15. I wasn't addressing that, sorry

I was thinking of sane, competent people who need housing.

[bobbolink]

16. here's the quotation:

"The only solution that works is to provide good, clean, single room or apartment occupancy housing for each homeless person in an environment in which other services are available including participation in making and enforcing rules that apply to all residents as well as lots of mental health services."

THAT is always the damned assumption, and it is DAMAGING.

It HURTS.

And I doubt seriously the poster will bother to take me seriously.

They always know so much better.

That's exactly why this article and study are important.. WE need to be heard.. not the damned "experts" who put their own spin on things.

[AngryOldDem]

21. Mental health is A BIG CAUSE of homelessness.

But I doubt you will take ME seriously, seeing as how I work with the homeless and see many, many mentally ill people on a daily basis.

It is imperative that we address this part of the homelessness equation because the mentally ill are not only a possible danger to others, but they are most definitely a danger to themselves. They need to be in a stable environment where they will be monitored for compliance with medications, as well as having available competent professionals who can help them gain some kind of independence and stability while they get treatment in a safe environment.

It is especially difficult to reach this population because of the massive deinstitutionalization and closures of mental health facilities and hospitals; also, most mentally ill homeless people have been neglected and out on the streets for so long that it is difficult if not almost impossible to reach out to them.

Just because the description does not apply to YOU, please do not minimalize the issue of the connection between mental health and homelessness.

And if you want to continue to scream HOUSING, HOUSING, HOUSING...I've got some answers to that, as well.

[bobbolink]

22. the figures are... maybe 22%, and maybe less than that.

It's time for the RAYGUN shit to end!

"And if you want to continue to scream HOUSING, HOUSING, HOUSING...I've got some answers to that, as well."

You'd rather we all just camp out in the city dump, I suppose...?

:crazy:

[AngryOldDem]

40. Really? It's that low?

Damn, could have fooled me.

http://mentalhealth.samhsa.gov/publications/allpubs/homelessness/#who

Snips from the SAMSHA report, most of this I see on any given night where I work. But I'm a heartless bitch full of shit, so what do I know?

<<Thirty-nine percent report some form of mental health problem, and 20 to 25 percent meet criteria for serious mental illnesses.

Why are so many people with serious mental illnesses homeless?

Their symptoms are often active and untreated, making it extremely difficult for them to meet basic needs for food, shelter, and safety.
These individuals are impoverished, and many are not receiving benefits for which they may be eligible.
Up to 50 percent have co-occurring mental illness and substance use disorders.
People with serious mental illnesses have greater difficulty exiting homelessness than others. They are homeless more often and for longer periods of time than other homeless populations. Many have been on the streets for years.<<

<<The majority of people with serious mental illnesses who are homeless had prior contact with the mental health system, either as an inpatient or outpatient. These experiences were not always positive; they may have been hospitalized involuntarily or given treatment services or medications that did not benefit them.

These individuals typically are long-term citizens of the communities in which they are homeless.
The social support and family networks of these individuals usually have unraveled. Those who are members of families often have lost regular contact with their relatives or are no longer equipped to be primary caregivers.

These individuals are twice as likely as other homeless people to be arrested or jailed, mostly for misdemeanors. They are often good candidates for diversion programs that enable them to go from jail to more appropriate treatment, support, and housing.>>>

This is pretty much what I see on any given night where I work. But what do I know?

And if you think I would prefer that you find housing in a dump...sorry if I've ever given you that impression mainly because I see the reality of the issues we face, and refuse to join the militant camp on this issue. I simply just don't see that as productive work or action.

[bobbolink]

88. LOWER-- 16%, according to National Coalition for the Homeless

http://www.nationalhomeless.org/publications/facts/Why.pdf

[bobbolink]

90. Contrast that to 20% in general population

"The current prevalence estimate is that about 20 percent of the U.S. population are affected by mental disorders during a given year. "

http://www.surgeongeneral.gov/library/mentalhealth/chapter2/sec2_1.html

[bobbolink]

91. So, now you, too, can get screened, diagnosed, and medicated

"A sweeping mental health initiative will be unveiled by President George W Bush in July. The plan promises to integrate mentally ill patients fully into the community by providing "services in the community, rather than institutions," according to a March 2004 progress report entitled New Freedom Initiative (www.whitehouse.gov/infocus/newfreedom/toc-2004.html). While some praise the plan's goals, others say it protects the profits of drug companies at the expense of the public. "

snip

"The president's commission found that "despite their prevalence, mental disorders often go undiagnosed" and recommended comprehensive mental health screening for "consumers of all ages," including preschool children. According to the commission, "Each year, young children are expelled from preschools and childcare facilities for severely disruptive behaviours and emotional disorders." Schools, wrote the commission, are in a "key position" to screen the 52 million students and 6 million adults who work at the schools.

The commission also recommended "Linkage with treatment and supports" including "state-of-the-art treatments" using "specific medications for specific conditions." The commission commended the Texas Medication Algorithm Project (TMAP) as a "model" medication treatment plan that "illustrates an evidence-based practice that results in better consumer outcomes."

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=39078

Enjoy it... since it seems to be what you like to see...

Russia are U.S.

[Two Americas]

24. nonsense

Our cruel and unjust system is a BIG cause of "mental illness."

[bobbolink]

25. .

:applause:

or, more properly, what's LABELED as mental illness.

As you pointed out later, the rapicious greed and manipulation and just plain ugliness in this society is condoned, while the more sensitive who are hurt by it are LABELED.

:crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy:

[dajoki]

59. You are absolutely correct...

I personally know a man in his 60's who has suffered with very serious mental health problems for at least 30 years or more. He has been institutionalized quite a few times, but that seems to be the only time that he recieves any so-called "care" at all. Once he is released he is forced to fend for himself, he gets his prescriptions and is sent on his way, no follow-ups, because the county is too "busy" and doesn't have the "resources" to worry about ONE individual. BULLSHIT!! Another excuse of which I am sick of hearing already. The system completely failed this man.

[caseycoon]

29. What are your answers for HOUSING HOUSING HOUSING?

There are increasing numbers of homeless people who are not mentally ill & so don't need to be monitored. They just need housing. In fact many of them have lost their homes due to the sub prime mortgage fiasco. Others have lost their jobs to outsourcing & as the economy slumps further & further they they can't afford their mortgage payments. If you have solutions I would love to hear them. Maybe it would help some of my friends who are on the edge.
Thanks. :)

[AngryOldDem]

36. The current supply does not meet the demand. Period.

See my post above to TahitiNut.

In my city the average waiting list for public housing ranges from six months to up to a year. Some agencies such as mine and the Red Cross offer transitional housing or supportive housing, but people can stay there only for a year or two.

The answer lies in making homelessness a priority for both the public and private sectors. Cities must make it a priority to house the poorest in their communities by assessing the availability of such housing and ensuring that it is decent, safe, and livable. (The location of these houses is also a factor.) Cities must offer incentives to private business to invest in and manage properties that need to be rehabbed, and also offer incentives for those in the private sector to house low-imcome people. Rents must somehow be kept at affordable levels. And, if housing is to be located outside of the city center, efforts must be made to convince the community to accept lower-income individuals.

In short, affordable housing is an issue cities must take a more active role in addressing, other than just leaving it to the agencies to navigate. We cannot do it alone.

There are more people in society other than those who live in the upscale downtown condos and gated communities. And that population is growing.

My point is: I don't know of anyone who doesn't agree that the answer to homelessness is more housing. But the issue is more complex than that. It takes time. This is a problem that has been growing for decades, and has been largely ignored, and it won't go away tomorrow because decent, affordable housing will not be available that fast.

And, I also have to make this observation, as I also made above to TahitiNut. Some people, especially homeless people, often have no, or very few, life skills critical to home or apartment ownership. They cannot manage money, they cannot follow the terms of their lease, and they have untreated or undertreated problems that eventually make home ownership difficult or impossible. They need assistance in getting those skills before any attempt at housing placement can be made. Otherwise, there is no point in placing them and puts them in jeopardy of never being considered for housing if they repeatedly show they cannot manage it. Secondly, jobs must pay a living wage. If people can afford a place on their own, the chances of them keeping it are much higher. But they have to have the income to do so.

These posts imply that nobody is doing anything to place people into homes. That is so not true, and is so frustrating and demeaning to those of us who are trying to do just that on a daily basis. But we want to find people situations in which they will succeed. Sorry if we're not working fast enough or hard enough for you, but we have to work within a system that has the deck stacked against us much in the same way it is stacked against those we're trying to place.

[Two Americas]

44. question

These posts imply that nobody is doing anything to place people into homes. That is so not true, and is so frustrating and demeaning to those of us who are trying to do just that on a daily basis. But we want to find people situations in which they will succeed. Sorry if we're not working fast enough or hard enough for you, but we have to work within a system that has the deck stacked against us much in the same way it is stacked against those we're trying to place.

So if we are on the same side, share the same goals, and are meeting with the same frustrations, and are up against the same obstacles, why take the posts personally or see them as an attack on anyone?

[caseycoon]

45. I think it's just total frustration...

that there are so many who are homeless & it's increasing so rapidly. It's frightening & frustrating that more isn't being done & I'm sure you know how many folks don't even want to see it. Even here on DU there are many who refuse to see what a terrible problem it has become.
I am thankful there ARE people like you who do care & are doing what they can for folks who are homeless. My frustration is that there are not enough of you & so little available money to improve things. So of course it's not being done fast enough to suit me. The system sucks big time.

[dajoki]

60. That is what I'm talking about...

SO MANY reasons why people end up homeless or in poverty. Not the same old, same old excuse of "mental health". I also would LOVE to hear the solutions!!

[JDPriestly]

63. You probably don't need mental health services, but fact it,

lots of people do. Most of the people who need mental health services are not homeless. But if a person needs mental health services and is also homeless, the homelessness can cause serious depression. After all, a healthy person who is homeless is likely to have moments of depression. Any normal person would.

[bobbolink]

84. the issue is being FORCED!!!!!

And that's exactly what your proposal leads to.

Put yourself in my shoes onthat....

I know many homeless women around here, and all we need is a decent place to live, not somebody making us feel worse, and trying to push drugs on us!!

[dajoki]

57. HOUSING FIRST...

I read about this being done somewhere else with great success, I'll look for a link because right now I can't remember the exact story. I also read an article about a new law passed in VA. which calls for drug testing before allowing people in housing. As a compassionate human being I am completely appalled by the VA Legislature for even considering this.

I am also excited about the OP, especially since I know it was done other places successfully. Maybe this could start a groundswell, these stories NEED to be seen and UNDERSTOOD by as many people as possible in order for it to have a chance to "snowball". I believe it could work, I have said many times that EVERYONE has their own personal story of what caused them to get where they are. There is not one simple, "one size fits all" answer, as many believe. To me, that is why Housing First is very important.

As for VA, no good can come of this type of operating, "suspected" drug users will be singled out for testing. Well who makes the decision that they suspect someone? When laws like this are passed it sooner or later tends to group EVERYBODY into one lump, in other words "guilty until proven innocent".

K&R:hug:

[bobbolink]

86. WE need to get the word out! LTTEs, writing/calling Reps, etc.

It's up to us... we certainly know we can't depend on the corporate media.

Drug testing for little old ladies.. what, every week? Every day?

HOW demeaning !!!

That's exactly what would kill this.

*I* sure wouldnt' do that.... I've had enough demeaning treatment, that's for sure!

[JDPriestly]

62. You are so right. HOUSING FIRST -- that's the answer.

Everyone should have the right to decent housing. We should not be bringing in immigrants, legal or illegal until we can provide affordable, truly affordable housing for every American.

[Gormy Cuss]

65. Unfortunately, the results of this study won't be use to support housing for you.

The study findings are positive specifically because the population served were people with chronic and often acute medical conditions such as AIDS and congestive heart failure. Stable housing reduced costs associated with their health care --- in other words, housing first was cheaper than hospitalization. Since you don't need that care, the financial equation would be different and it may not be a cost savings to the government to do what is necessary to make housing first a priority for you and others like you.

Unless and until the country makes the decision that housing is a basic human right rather than a trade-off in terms of costs for one program or another the issue will not be addressed adequately for people in your situation.

IMHO, HUD needs to reassert its mission to provide decent affordable housing directly through public housing and stop pretending that privately owned, subsidized housing programs such as Section 8 are adequate substitutes.

[bobbolink]

9. I am homeless, and I am neither mentally ill, nor confused.

PLEASE, stop the tarring of everyone with the same damned brush!

Do you know how much this damned stereotype hurts people like me?

ALL WE NEED IS HOUSING, DAMMIT!

[JanMichael]

39. Bobbolink

they aren't. Calm down.

We (my wife and I) personally know G_J. He is trying to address an issue that he found worthy of posting about.

Obviously, this is a major issue for you; my wife has followed your posts, and we do understand your situation.

However, you aren't an "expert" on homelessness either, just because you have experienced it. Sorry, but you aren't. There it is.

The "experts" DO tend to focus on the mentally ill, true. However, we understand that not everyone who is homeless has those problems---that just happens to be what the OP article is focusing upon.

[Two Americas]

47. calm down?

Can you see how condescending and demeaning your post sounds?

How does one become an "expert" on this? Why does one need to be an expert?

Bobbolink is talking about human compassion and the political will to attack the social conditions - the dog-eat-dog greed and competitiveness that are the root cause of social problems. That is a political issue. We are talking politics.

Can you not see that a person who happens to be homeless, and has the courage to reveal that, would resent becoming the "problem" and being analyzed and patted on the head, rather than having her political opinions - merely buttressed and reinforced by her courageous willingness to reveal her own personal circumstances - taken seriously and addressed as political opinions? You speak as though she were a child with a disease, with you as the wise and benevolent doctor. You would resent being treated that way - anyone would.

[JanMichael]

49. yeah. you read it right. calm down. you too, for that matter

there are many people on DU that have a clue as to homelessness issues---whether the homeless have disabilities or not.

[Two Americas]

56. I am perfectly calm

I can assure you that I am perfectly calm.

To discuss how we avoid being in a war does not invalidate the work of battlefield doctors or medics, nor does their expertise at treating battlefield casualties give them expertise on how to prevent war.

[mondo joe]

52. There is no single model of homelessness.

Homelessness describes an array of situations in which many different people live for many different reasons.

It's not a one-size-fits-all situation. One homeless person's experience isn't the same as every other's.

[JanMichael]

54. yep

it's a helluva problem in this country; it's hard to tell what each person needs...and to make sure they have the roof, and the tools to thrive. It's been made even harder by the Republican horseshit propagated by St. Ronnie and his Living Followers.

[bobbolink]

80. "You would resent being treated that way - anyone would."

Excellent! It's true, but people who badger others with this will never admit to it.

I was just reading in Barbara Ehrenreich's book, Nickel And Dimedabout this very phrase... when she is talking with a bullying boss, and he says that to her, she says "Everyone who says that to someone KNOWS that phrase incites anger."

She's right, and that is the very reason they use it.

[undergroundpanther]

72. Experts I have found

tend to be some of the most oblivious and stupid people on earth. I say this because I have dealt with plenty of them, I have been an activist and survivor for mentally ill for around ten years and these dumb asses in the meetings with power point presentations of lame ass ideas that sound good to themselves are LIGHT YEARS behind the understanding the needs and sanity of psych survivors.

Still psychology is hung up on blaming the individual for hurting,demanding they find a way to be happy in this sickening crazy-making culture. They are in DENIAL. AS is psychiatry it is still over focused on the individual,as is the idiocy called bio psychiatry. Bio psych is hung up on drugging people who have"symptoms" to make it appear to observers made uncomfortable by people that have symptoms, giving an illusion they have been helped, by suppressing the individuals symptoms rather than addressing some of the SOCIAL and PARENTING causes.
One study HAS looked at this..Kudos to them!!
http://www.cavalcadeproductions.com/ace-study.html

Bottom line is too many "experts" in these fields really bother to address the socially sick games our culture is infested with,they bow to who pays..like everyone else and who pays likes the inequality just as it is..The wealthy WANT the idiotic pecking order bullshit, and the just world hypothesis and want us sayiong shit about who'deserves'what, and wants us to tolerate chronic bullying, all this dysfunction hurting us to be accepted as if it was normal.

This the suffering of many just to let pathological greed of the few drain the life out of everyone else who is not rich,and has a sensitive heart that desires justice to shut up, so all the heartless and successful authoritarians, narcissists and psychopaths that are drawn to becoming "experts" because they like to abuse power, get rich and be and get recognized as an expert in any social environment they can pull it off.All are taught to supress the terrible catch 22's we get fed as kids, from parents and culture and be well versed in the denial and lies one has to pretend are good and rational, so we all will be living in a culture of make believe such as our culture . Nobody really digs in and ask what happens to people to be forced to exist in this sick sad situation and ruthless competition and abuse . I think it is time for the experts to quit focussing on individuals and fixing them, no they need to go beyond and fix a social issue,a way we are cultured,admit they don't know what to do as much as they like to appear they know,admit they can't 'fix' everyones mental illness' because mental illness is not originated by the individual alone. Experts need to step aside for us who do know and can see those you call m4entally ill.Yes, I am crazy and I am MAD,I got a shitload of diagnosis, took every drug they could force into me, spent 18 months in solitary I was abused by"experts,and now I understand, they wanted me to forget..and play thier game and 'fuction' and'produce'. I am PROUD to be crazy because we are the canaries in the cultural coal mine we know this culture is destructive to the human consience,the economy is rigged against most of us and this planet is dying from the rapicious greed of a few and the massive lies people believe just to 'get along' in this sick sad mess. IT HURTS. In other words heal yourself before you go pontificating about others lives and"sanity, you so called "experts". Psychology and psychiatry has a DISMAL cure rate. That's the big secret the psych experts are failing EPICALLY.. because psychology is not even a true science it pretends to be one.In reality psychology/psychiatry is a tool of social control and it uses many of the same things a good freind can do, using a sympathetic ear, basic logic,and a loving partner or to be a bit more deep what a shaman or hypnotist can do, including the drugs. Hung up on what free will is they ignore how MITIGATED free will IS in reality.
So the victim is blamed over and over..
http://www.boingboing.net/2002/10/18/the-illusion-of-free.html

Normal is a LIE. Francis Galton the 'father of eugenics'made it up by playing plinko with pins,a box and marbles,The bean machine, also known as the quincunx or Galton box. That bullshit called the bell curve is what the norm is, and that is JUNK science.
http://www.mouthmag.com/issues/74/pp12-13no74.html
http://www.waragainsttheweak.com/
...And Maltheus the piece of shit, and a few other so called philosophers rationalize inequality..as if it was natural,truth is it isn't.And this I think is a big part of the insanity,we are not living in a society that is natural or supportive of our humanity.
http://www.wakeupfromyourslumber.com/node/3378\
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/02/science/02free.html
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn3248-democracy-beats-despotism-in-the-animal-world.html
http://www.debate.com/debates/Capitalism-is-a-failed-ideology-that-makes-human-life-worthless-healthcare-proves/1/
http://books.guardian.co.uk/reviews/politicsphilosophyandsociety/0,6121,1538844,00.html

[Hannah Bell]

85. yes. promoting failure; the mental health inustry grows & the number of

"mentally ill" just keep growing as well.

the same factors fertilize both.

[JDPriestly]

64. I would put it this way. bobbolink.

People are labeled as "homeless" because they don't have homes. People are labeled as "mentally ill" for other reasons. Most people who are mentally ill are not homeless. Most of them have families and housing. Most people who are homeless are not mentallly ill. Mental illness and homelessness are not synonymous.

The problem that you are rightfully addressing, bobbolink, is that there is a stereotype that if you are homeless you are necessarily mentally ill. I did not mean to suggest that when I stated that the housing for homeless people should have lots of mental health services available. If you are not mentally ill, you do not want to live in housing in which 20% of your neighbors are mentally ill and without convenient access to mental health services. Mental health services should be available to all. Middle class people tend to have better access to mental health services than do low income people. And homeless people who need mental health services need access to those services near where they live especially since many of them do not have a convenient form of transportation.

[bobbolink]

79. thank you for understanding my point about the stigma!

I will say again... ALL homeless people I've talked with at length have said two things:

1. They wanted to die.

2. The thing that hurt the most was the constant assumption they were mentally ill. You can't prove a negative, so they were just left to hurt from what is basically an accusation.

THAT MUST CHANGE! It's hard enough being homeless, without adding more shit to it.

As for your point about "treatment" being available.... as a person whose educational background is psychology, I would like to agree with you. I would like to think that the "professionals" would help to ease the stress that homeless people feel, and to help take the enormous burden off them that this society insists on dumping on homeless people, out of the damned conservative belief that it's our individual failure.. that wwe are to BLAME. If therapists would help to ease that damned blamming, then yes, they could be helpful.

BUT, and this is a huge BUT.. that is NOT what they do, for the most part. They just add another layer of crap to what is already hurting us.

You clearly have a bias in favor of "treatment"... I used to, also. However, real life experience and that of others points, sadly, in another direction. Yet, we are NOT HEARD on this!

I hope you read undergroundpanther's words.. now THERE is an EXPERT! One who knows where the truth lies....

[Two Americas]

19. "lots of mental health services"

The formula for causing suffering in others, and turning our backs on it - mental health = winner = legal = material well being = moral righteousness = not homeless.

If a person is "guilty" of any of those "crimes" - and they are seen as crimes and people are treated as criminals for them, sometimes figuratively, sometimes literally - they are suspect of being guilty of all of them.

We are avoiding two important things here. First, our idea of successful and healthy is seriously off, since they both depend on selfishness and exploiting others. Secondly, this is about homelessness, no about "the homeless" and the problem is with housing not those who don't have housing.

The price we pay for seeing homes as investments to be speculated upon, invested in, and traded wildly on the "free market" is the same problem we see in every social problem - profits over people. As Democrats, we should have no ambiguity about our stance on that.

How about some mental health services - lots and lots and lots of them - for real estate agents and developers and investors and speculators? I think we need to fix the inhumane, anti-social, and selfish mental illness we see all around us in those seen as "winners."

So long as we ignore the system, and ignore the greedy and rapacious ones who are best suited to thrive in the system, we are part of the problem no matter how enlightened we fancy ourselves to be.

[G_j]

26. absolutely

As an example, our 'system' promotes and generously rewards sociopaths.

[Two Americas]

28. watch the disruption

As always, as soon as we start to calmly discuss these issues, or to make - heaven forbid!! - an even slightly or moderately left wing political analysis of the situation, there will be some distraction introduced and hammered and hammered over and over again, until people are provoked to respond in anger, give up in frustration, or are so alienated by the vitriol that they leave and avoid the discussion.

[AngryOldDem]

42. I can attest to that.

And I have a question. Repeatedly here and elsewhere I have tried to present a realistic picture of why **immediate** housing for the homeless just isn't possible. Note, I did not say IMpossible. So, because some of us recognize that, does that make us:

1) Less sensitive to the problem?
2) Less sensitive to the plight of homeless people?
3) Imply that we are doing little or nothing to try to find such housing for low- or no-income people?

If the answer to any or all of the above is "no," then why do I keep getting the impression otherwise? And, if you think we are not doing enough, please tell us what we need to do.

Thanks.

[Two Americas]

46. none of the above

Sorry, but you provoked this discussion, not the other way around. You "hear" some criticism of you that is not there - or at least that I didn't hear or even imagine being there - and then are offended and hurt and think you are being personally attacked. None of the rest of us have control over that reaction of yours.

Nothing in what I am saying, and nothing I can see in what Bobbie is saying is invalidating you or accusing you of being less sensitive to the problem, less sensitive to the plight of homeless people, nor implying that you are doing little or nothing to try to find such housing for low- or no-income people.

[bobbolink]

81. stating it that way points to exactly the one-up mentality of this nation.

Those in power aren't looked at as having any problems whatsoever.

It's those of us who SUFFER from that power over us who supposedly have the problems.

THat's gotta change, and right here at DU is a good place to start!

Thanks!

:hi:

[mondo joe]

32. Agreed. "Supportive Housing" is the thing. NT

[AngryOldDem]

38. It definitely is.

My agency operates two homes like this (four, actually, but I'll get to that in a moment), for men and women.

They are homes especially for those who have been classified as chronically homeless by the HUD definition (homeless at least three times in the past four years). Many of our guests are now staying there or have stayed there -- I want to say that occupancy of both homes is about 20. People have their own space there and are free to come and go. They are monitored and meet frequently with case management. These homes provide a much more stable and dignified environment than the streets or the shelter. (Most of the men and women who stay there have mental health issues.)

We also have a supportive housing program for families and singles, which are single-unit apartment buildings. They can stay there for two years, as long as they are working and are meeting with their case managers. My agency employs many current and former residents of supportive housing, and I cannot begin to tell you how gratifying it is to see someone who was once homeless now a co-worker. I work with about three current and former residents.

Finally, we have a facility for men only, those who have recently been released from jail or who have substance abuse issues. That is extremely successful as well.

Supportive housing provides a needed and safe bridge from the streets to productive society. Many people could not survive without it.

[mondo joe]

51. I wish people could understand that there is no single model of homelessness.

Homelessness is the result of a confluence of many factors, and those many factors are realized in homelessness.

What is helpful to one homeless person won't be helpful to another.

The most unifying factor I can think of is simply that homeless people share the same lack of access that many low income people have - to healthcare, to adequate food, and so on.

A home is critical - but it's not the entire solution.

[JDPriestly]

61. Thanks for your good work.

[undergroundpanther]

83. Question

What if what is required to be "productive" is intolerable to you?
I myself do NOT want to get involved in the job "market" because I can't stand corporate culture.It HURTS me. I don't want to produce for any corporation, I hate corporations. I hate bullies. And corporate culture is crazy- making and it is psychopathic.
http://www.earthisland.org/journal/corpru.html


What if a person just wants their own time for them self instead of feeding an insatiable capricious corporation that could care less if they live or die.


What if I want my time to contemplate this culture of make believe, heal at my own pace and create for my pleasure and health and live in peace,care for my friends and strangers,explore thew unknown to not be harangued by people trying to"fix" me, change me, telling to "be somebody" or "make it" as in a "success" story.
I can't take the stress..

To me the form of "success" you advocate for the people in those homes would kill me literally.I have had enough trauma and domination by assholes so now I detect and despise bullies and exploiters with an unquenchable hate.. So I openly say, I want NONE of the thing you call a job, or 'success'.I will resist it for my own sake. With every advance comes more work more labor more toil to maintain it. It never ends. Success is a soul sucking TRAP.

From a historical perspective, the cultural norm placing a positive moral value on doing a good job because work has intrinsic value for its own sake was a relatively recent development (Lipset, 1990). Work, for much of the ancient history of the human race, has been hard and degrading. Working hard--in the absence of compulsion--was not the norm for Hebrew, classical, or medieval cultures (Rose, 1985). It was not until the Protestant Reformation that physical labor became culturally acceptable for all persons, even the wealthy.

How come it's so evil for anyone to be so overwhelmed by the sick system they wish to NOT participate in it's abuses and exploitation? Why is it taboo to refuse to comply with all those disgusting corporate trappings?

Why is it intolerable for one to admit to having a stronger desire for ones own heath and happiness and to not "go for it" and get a job ?

I don't want to produce more shit for the very market driven process that is slowly killing us all on the inside out,as well as killing the earth we all depend on.
http://www.cavalcadeproductions.com/ace-study.html


What's so WRONG about that? As I see it work is crazy making and over production is toxic. We as a species do NOT need any more growth or production or success because these are the very things that are destroying us..and the lack of time to enrich ourselves has made us dependant upon this sick game of haves and have nots,and the corporate system to survive,It's tragic.
http://www.earthisland.org/journal/corpru.html

And it is about time we realized working more hours will not give us the things we really desire like,time to explore,learn, learn to survive,know our children,help others,develop empathy love and good relationships.

We traded the inhuman market and we gave away a humane community.
So we got shafted into a raw deal we think is rational or the only way and it has made so many suffer and we have learned to focus on the individual to avoid admitting we are all complicit in this mess. It is time humanity told the greedy corporates to fuck off and die, threw away their clocks, shared this earth, and confiscated the wealthiest 'families' land,resources and stolen assets and cleaned up the chemical and trash mess all their consumer crap ,sick ideologies ,grandiose schemes of civilization and greed for profits gone overboard that in a few thousand years has made too much of a wasteland of our of the world, us,and our lives and minds..

http://www.ratical.org/corporations/EndCorpGov.html

I just can't participate in the toxic corporate culture without being driven over the edge. At least I am aware of my limits and can admit it.Many people never do and when they crash and burn they never figure out why..
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9B0CEFDC1E3EE733A2575BC1A9609C946797D6CF
http://cultronix.eserver.org/martz/
http://www.whywork.org/rethinking/whywork/workplace.html


"Death is not the greatest loss in life. The greatest loss is what dies inside us while we live." Norman Cousins

[caseycoon]

33. Very well said JDPriestly!

Thank you! While it's true that there are drunks & mentally ill folks who are homeless, increasingly our homeless folks are neither of those. It's truly heartbreaking. Whole families, single moms with their children, men, elderly folks & disabled people. Even our veterans. America cannot or will not take care of her own. The attitudes toward all poor people must change.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

7. I have been volunteering at my church's food programs for the homeless for four years

During that time, I've seen increasing numbers of people who are obviously new to homelessness.

[nxylas]

8. That's sad

But not surprising.

[bobbolink]

14. What's sad is that you'll probably see the same ones for years...

because nobody seems to have the will to create housing!

[Lydia Leftcoast]

50. Oh, we do see the same people again and again

Many have their favorite table servers.

[bobbolink]

89. What I meant as sad is that they won't have a chance of finding housing

Like me.

Having favorite servers is a GOOD thing!

Building relationships--that's good!

[demgurl]

18. This is a refreshing viewpoint.

The poor and the homeless should be put first on our list of priorities and the very first thing that should be looked at is housing.

K&R

[trthnd4jstc]

20. With all this excess Housing, Why Not Help the Homeless?

Part of the truth of the matter is that there are more Housing Units than are needed. Why not move the homeless into these? Once the homeless People get a foot up, then maybe they can work to take over payment of some of the lower priced homes.

[NMMatt]

27. It's pretty sad that people would need a study to realize the obvious

How can anyone hold down a job, treat their mental or substance abuse problems or anything if they live on the streets?

[bobbolink]

30. Yet, that's what's been expected now since RAYGUN.

what you're leaving out is those of us on disability, and those too old to work.

How the heck are WE supposed to try to function, and care for ourselves?

Yet, that is the way the system is set up now.

9 million of us need low-income housing, and there are 6 million units available.

Even a first-grader can do *that* math...

:cry:

[AngryOldDem]

I thought it was "time to leave the RAYGUN shit" out of it....

...except when it meets one's own purposes, eh?

[Two Americas]

48. was that intentional?

Did you intentionally misrepresent what the poster said?

You must know that there is a difference between promoting and repeating Reagan talking points, and discussing the impact of Reagan talking points on our thinking and on social conditions. You must know that.

By your logic, since we reject the policies of the Bush administration, we should therefore never mention the Bush administration. What sort of sense does that make?

[AngryOldDem]

37. Self-delete, dupe post

[The Straight Story]

31. Kicking - about time we started spending more time on this subject

(as a society)

[crimsonblue]

34. Sadly, the likeliness of this occurance on any significant scale is likely nil.

The burden of the homeless falls mainly to cities and counties. Most of these entities are not immune to the recession we are in. I live in Lawrence, and we had a substantial budget gap (atleast for us) due to decreasing sales tax and property tax revenues. The first programs to get cut or reduced funding (effectively reneging on already promised and allocated money that make up to 60% of the funding for the shelters and other homeless assistance orgs. here) are always the social welfare programs. Throughout much of our modern history, Lawrence has prided itself on being a progressive community with compassion for others, and we consistently ranked high in homeless assistance rankings.

Now, Lawrence has been dubbed one of the worst places in America towards the homeless. My freshman year of college, I worked a couple times a week at a soup kitchen, and got to know many of the homeless that came through. For most of them, breakfast at 6am on Tuesdays and Fridays was the only meal they would eat that day, if not a couple of days.

Lawrence, once the proud liberal bastion surrounded by a sea of republicanism, has now abandoned the homeless. I've seen the mentality of Lawrencians change from compassion to contempt and outright hatred. During the same time that the city slashed funding, they gave the city manager a raise and gave him 2 assistants, each paid 80k per year. It makes me sad that this town that I used to love has become just another suburb. My little patch of freedom is no more...

[tishaLA]

43. especially because the current administration

has been working on a model to get only the most severe "offenders" into housing. Here in Los Angeles, that means 50 people--50 people!--get into the housing first model via the federal government. This leaves out the vast majority of homeless people, who are homeless for a short period, or sporadically, or are relatively new to homelessness.

The good news is that the housing first model does work to support the formerly homeless and that the results are excellent almost across the board.

[bobbolink]

77. We're so quick to blame * for everything. We don't look at how WE don't

promote ACTION on thse things.

How many DUers, reading this thread, will contact their representatives?

Will write a LTTE?

Will speak to their friends, neighbors and town hall meetings about it?

Like voting issues, and the rest... it's up to US.

[bobbolink]

76. "likeliness of this occurance on any significant scale is likely nil."

And will remain so as long as "activists" are content to let it be nil.

Why is it that DUers can get worked up and take action about all sorts of issues, but this one is an orphan????

[mntleo2]

35. Reminds Me Of another Headline About 10 Years Ago ....

in the NY Times, screaming:

POVERTY CAUSES HIGH STRESS!
NY University had spent $2 million dollars to find this out. 2 million dollars that could have gone a long way back then to END poverty.

Well I guess we could heave a big sigh of relief because, at least some "concerned" professors put it in their pockets with a smug sense of self satisfaction and the assurance they had worked SO much harder than those single moms that they interviewed, who labor for nothing in low paying McJobs.


I am *not* making this up unfortunately.

Cat In Seattle

[bobbolink]

78. Stress? What stress? I'm not STRESSED!!!

:argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh:

Just give me the $2mil, and I'll write an article, and I'll no longer be stressed.

:hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi:

[Jed Dilligan]

41. There was also a study showing

that homeless alcoholics have better, less costly outcomes if they are given a free ration of wine. That doesn't mean it will ever be implemented.

Of course housing first works better than the shit we have now--I am not swearing casually, it IS shit--but Americans are mostly sado-moralists who would rather hurt themselves than feel like they are giving someone else a free ride.

[apocalypsehow]

53. Focusing on this issue should be in the "Top 5" of either President Obama or Clinton.

It really is that important not only for the real victims of homelessness themselves, but for who we are as a society.

[saracat]

67. I agree. K and R!

[Solly Mack]

55. K&R

[KillCapitalism]

58. K&R

[pamela]

66. Great article. K&R

It's encouraging to see that the "Housing First" approach is possibly gaining traction. I've been seeing more articles related to this lately. Now, if we could just get our representatives to make this a priority...

Thanks for posting this.

[saltpoint]

68. Kick -- in hopes that many more will give this some attention.

It deserves some.

[caseycoon]

69. Kick so others can read this n/t

[blindpig]

70. There is no shortage of housing,

shit, don't ya'll read the papers? Thousands of houses sitting empty all over the place.....oh, they're in the burbs and they're too expensive. How is that? It's not for want of material or skill, it is the skewed priorities of our society, profits over people.

The construction worker gets the same whatever they're working on, it is those sitting on top of the Social Darwinists food chain who are getting fat and sassy selling housing to the well off and the wannabes. Profits greater than the government can or should provide casually reinforce suburban classism. Another detrimental effect of this insidious trend is that much productive farm and pasture land is permanently removed from production, land that used to provide food for the people, livelihoods for farmers.

Over the short term I would take advantage of the 'housing bubble', as these speculators belly up and their properties go to tax sale I'd have local governments take possession and see that there was housing for all. McMansions could be converted to apartments, absurd lawns converted to vegetable gardens. Public transport would be needed, is needed anyway, buses first, then rail. Ain't no rocket science, just a matter of priorities.

People over profits.

[LiveLiberally]

71. K& R and Thanks for Posting this!

What I find most encouraging was the evidence that housing the homeless utilized fewer resources than "usual care." Despite all the compelling moral arguments for eliminating homelessness, the system will persist until those in control realize that humane care and cost effectiveness go hand in hand.

Thanks again.

[bobbolink]

82. "system will persist until those in control realize that humane care and cost effectiveness go hand

in hand. "

And WE are the ones who MUST and are RESPONSIBLE for "making them realize"!!

Write an LTTE about this.

Contact your local, state and federal representatives about this, and ask your friends and other political activists to do the same.

Just saying until they realize continues the same mess.

WE are the ones we've been looking for!

[LiveLiberally]

87. You are absolutely right /nt

[undergroundpanther]

73. Hmmm

Got a study proposal..Anyone dare to tackle why is there no study on how the wealthy create poverty and how wealthy people and those who are comfortable use denial and the just world hypothesis to blame the unfortunate so they can feel secure in what they tell themselves they"deserve"? Study how wealthy and successful people set up roadblocks against people having decent homes and happiness? Any one DARE to study how the rich destroy the poor and how they are parasites upon the lives they exploit,and how 'experts justify this terrible inequality??

A few people have..too few..
http://www.g-r-e-e-d.com/GREED.htm
http://www.cipa-apex.org/toomuch/articlenew2008/Jan28a.html
http://www.greedandgood.org/



Powers without Obligation



If wealth is the only standard we use to judge, then we have to admit corporations are staggering successes and everything to venerate. They absorb people's lives. We consume their products daily, use their services hourly, rely on them for information. We are dependent. We compete to work in them.

What protects them is that we are taught the system is rational. We are also taught that the goodness of a society depends on how well its topmost members are doing, so the higher our topmost members, the more they are discussed with awe.

The natural foe of corporations is government. But international corporations are so wealthy they slide over governments. They have become like tourists in their own country. As they lose national loyalties, they come close to becoming powers without obligation. As the largest transnational corporations grow, they become sovereign and untouchable .
http://www.paecon.net/PAEReview/issue32/Edney32.htm

Hence the LACK of studies on social hierarchy and how the greedy prey upon the needy and make us all crazy as they destroy EVERYTHING and rely on a culture of make believe to ensure we are complicit,consciously or denied in our own destruction and misery, for misery makes money for the rich that have too much and no redeeming character or empathy, but love to get us to believe they do and they have a billion paid experts to cover their ass for them..

"I think about the relationship between economics and hatred and what it means?what it must feel like-to live in a society where more atrocities are committed in the name of economics than even in the name of hate." - Derrick Jensen

http://cultureofmakebelieve.tribe.net/

[blindpig]

74. Outstanding post n/t

[undergroundpanther]

75. Thanks.

See my post # 72.. You might like it, it goes into it deeper, in response to an "expert on the "mentally ill".

Purrs, Panth

[GreenPartyVoter]

93. Thanks for these links!

[GreenPartyVoter]

92. And the WSJ publishedd this story. That's kinda mind blowing to me. B ut I am glad they did

[Two Americas]

94. important observation

I have noticed this for years. The right wing propaganda does not represent an ideology, it is just a carefully crafted pack of lies for paralyzing and confusing the public. Those lies are aimed at us, but they are of no value to the wealthy and powerful who need to know the truth if they are going to be effective and successful at exploiting the rest of us. The wealthy and powerful have no problem with the truth, they have a problem with us knowing the truth. The WSJ provides the truth, because the rulers need to know the facts to oppress us efficiently. The MSM feeds us lies, not to promote an ideology, but rather to cripples us by jumbling up our minds with all sorts of false and misleading information. The supposedly "liberal" parts of this misinformation are as important in this effort as the "conservative" parts. In fact, if the rulers can balance the two sides - "liberal" and "conservative" - about equally, that keeps working people fighting with each other and protects the rulers from being the targets of our wrath.

The political battle is not about ideologies, let alone the preferences and prejudices and personal lifestyle choices that pass for "positions" on "issues" and that now dominate our political discussions. The political battle is about power and economics.

[GreenPartyVoter]

95. INteresting, but you are right. There are different news sources for the various classes

[undergroundpanther]

96. Psychopaths

Prefer social control stratification domination and abuse.
Financial abuse is a form of abuse.And it is practiced on this entire society except for the psychopaths who confuse and paralyze those who wish to help and change things..because "socialized" psychopaths thrive in this sort of society.
http://www.softpanorama.org/Social/Toxic_managers/psychopath_in_the_corner_office.shtml

[bobbolink]

98. "The political battle is about power and economics."

So true.. yet we scrap among ourselves rather than fight the REAL ISSUE!

:(

[Greyhound]

97. Too late to rec but here's a kick...

:kick: