Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

On corporate influence

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
Asgaya Dihi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 04:56 PM
Original message
On corporate influence
This is likely to be a longish post so skip to the next one if you don't want to wade through it.

I keep seeing references to corporations as if they are all good or all evil, the basis for our way of life/economy or the basis of our problems with no middle ground between them, so I figured it might be worth exploring what the real problem with them these days is. To me it isn't that they exist, it's that they have too much power and influence and that excess of power concentrated in too few hands hurts the rest of us. I'd feel the same if any small group had too much control over the rest of us, too much power in too few hands with little accountability is always going to lead to a bad result.

We need to go back to the idea of Corporate Personhood which ironically stemmed from the effort to assure the rights of freed slaves and other disenfranchised people, though the idea of business itself having most of the same rights as people existed before then it had little power so that gave them an "in" by law which they'd lacked before. Up until the 1970's the problem had been growing but was still containable but then things changed.

In 1976 the Supreme Court ruled in a case called Buckley v. Valeo, better known as money equals speech. This established a new precedent and one which has enabled everything since the 70s, the principle that we can no longer restrain many aspects of corporate actions including into the level of politics because it would be infringing on a "persons" "speech". We can't reform the whole system, elections included, in any meaningful way without infringing on that Supreme Court ruling, or without overturning it.

Corporations are not people. They are artificial entities which represent real people who already have voices and rights of their own, they don't need a second just because they can afford it and money is not speech. If he who has the most shouts the loudest drowning out the rest we end up with what we have today. The problem isn't that they exist, it's that they hold more power and influence than we do and that disparity is growing until we no longer seem to matter.

The results and costs of that excess influence aren't too hard to find if we look. In the 1950s Iran had a popular (to them) leadership which wanted to control their own oil resources so tried to nationalize and get out from under what they saw as unfair deals with foreign powers. The main threat was to oil company profits and to protect those we and the Brits took down that popular leadership and replaced it with the Shah of Iran. THAT sparked the Islamic extremist movement which had little historical power in the nation before then and that's what brought us the hostage crisis of the 70's as well as much of the extremism we've seen since. Blowback was to be expected according to the CIA itself at the time, and they were right. We're still dealing with the cost of the extremism it bred today and I don't see an end to the costs involved anytime soon.

To protect United Fruit Company, mining interests, and others of the sort we took down popular leaderships and/or encouraged dictatorships in Chile, Brazil, Nicaragua, and others. To protect oil company profits we've supported tyrants ranging from Saddam to the Shah and perhaps worse. We don't give a damned about the decades long abuses in the Congo or elsewhere but let a profit be put at risk and we'll care about that fast enough. A good case can be made that we support those abuses in the Congo and elsewhere, it's good for business with neither freedom, rights, nor democracy having a thing to do with it. As far as I can tell most of our enemies and conflicts over the last several decades were made in the name of profit.

They write their own laws and regulate their own industries through private meetings with our leaders or through organizations such as the American Legislative Exchange Council. Now they own the media too, thanks to media consolidation bills supported by both parties over the last few decades they now control the vast majority of everything we see, hear or read, all channeled through a small handful of corporate offices run by the same people who built the mess we're trying to fix these days. If anyone has ever been in an office under new ownership they should understand what that means fast enough. It doesn't take micromanagement or direct control, just an understanding of what it takes to be promoted or to even keep your job. Increase their profits. Good journalism is beside the point next to those profits and over a couple of decades of creeping consolidation most employed in the field are with the program these days out of simple self interest. Those who weren't no longer work there.

The problem is not that corporations exist. It is that they have become "people" under the law, laws which now read money as equal to speech so subject to free speech laws. Immortal, powerful, and rich people who no longer have to worry much about what we think because they control most means of our communications as well as too much of the electoral process. *If* we still have any chance to stop them it's a slim one and shrinking fast. The solution is not to destroy them, it's to reduce them back to a means of accomplishing work as they were intended to be in the first place rather than them being a tool of control and domination. The corporation as intended, as a means of joining forces to accomplish work, that could be a good thing. But, the form it takes today I think is one of the greatest threats we've ever faced as a nation and I don't think we're too far from losing the nation to them. Perhaps for good. Until we change this and make a corporation a means of accomplishing work instead of a tool of domination nothing can or will change.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 04:59 PM
Response to Original message
1. One tiny step: Please sign this so ACLU will file lawsuit against the corporate media
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Asgaya Dihi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Done
Though I don't know how much legal standing we'd have. In theory they just borrow the airwaves and are subject to their license renewal being rejected for not serving the public interests, but it almost never happens. If we can do it when the Government won't I don't know. It should happen one way or another though and if this could be a way to let them know we care it's worth a shot.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. It's worth the noise! And if it goes ahead, all the better! nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OneGrassRoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. There you are! (and a K&R)
I couldn't find the original post where you shared this link, but I've been inserting it elsewhere throughout the day today.

Thanks again. :)

Thank you to the OP for this information; I shall come back to read later when I can have time to absorb. :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Thanks so much! nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
2. corporations are the gangrenous rotting pustules on the open sore of capitalism
Edited on Thu Jan-31-08 05:03 PM by leftofthedial
they are the tools of the oligarchs who have used capitalism to subvert democracy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. Amen to that! nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 09:14 PM
Response to Original message
8. I can't believe I'm only the 5th Rec. on this excellent post.
This is such a clear-eyed summary of the fix we are in today, and how we got here. Thank you very much!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Asgaya Dihi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Thank you, annabanana
I don't tend to collect a lot of recs most of the time, I'd guess because they don't get a lot of responses so don't get topped much. Maybe I need to be more controversial ;) The one that did the best a couple of other members took an interest in and promoted, never have been comfortable with topping them myself but they liked it so did that part which was good of them. Old drug war related thread a few weeks ago.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. (You probably just need to "punch up" the subject line). . .
"You Owe your Soul to the Company. . . "

"Why do YOU play it the "Company Way"?

"Corporations, the KINGS of the WORLD"
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Asgaya Dihi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-02-08 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. I'll consider that
I rarely post in partisan forums so most of the way I deal with things is based around how to deal with the general public. There it's too easy to be accused of being on one side or the other of issues which makes it easy for the "other side" to just ignore us. Over the years the way I've dealt with that best is to just be as matter of fact as possible, explain the way things actually work as far as I can tell with emotion and preference playing little part in it. If I can be accused of playing an issue up or overstating it that just hurts the cause in those places, it's best if it's just like I told them it is or even understated rather than overstated.

Maybe here I do need to do it different. I do tend to get good responses here when anyone does respond, just more along the lines of 'well said' or 'nice post' rather than a real debate that goes farther and keeps it topped. More or less along the lines of the one I mentioned earlier, if someone hadn't taken an interest in that thread it would have died too but it did well with their help. Seems that' a weak way to do it here though since if it doesn't draw a bunch of help the thread just dies so maybe I'll try to figure out how to go from what I've been doing to a better approach.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-02-08 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. The fact may be simply that you've stated something so well,
Edited on Sat Feb-02-08 05:36 PM by annabanana
and your views are in such agreement with most here, that there is "nothing to add".. and that is why the posts don't generate a great deal of attention.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-02-08 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
13. Some solutions:
Edited on Sat Feb-02-08 06:23 PM by TheGoldenRule
There are no easy paths to restore power to the people. But here are three strategies worth considering.

First, the real power of the masses is as consumers, not as voters, workers, activists, or Internet users. Weakened unions, globalization, technology, and illegal immigration have sapped the power of workers. National economies, especially the US, depend on consumers. Suspensions in discretionary consumer spending used as a political weapon could force reforms. But curbing personal spending and saving money has become a rare form of civil disobedience. Consumers buy stuff when they want it, not when they can afford it. Rulers have replaced chains with debt and no political leader in a very long time has championed economic rebellion.

Second, because they are more a tool of tyranny than rebellion, the masses should stop giving credibility and legitimacy to faux democracies by boycotting elections. Plutocrats cleverly equate patriotism and good citizenship with voting while at the same time ensuring that no genuine change agents can succeed even if elected. All election results can be subverted by the forces of corruption. Those promising change, like Barack Obama, do not pose a lethal threat to forces of evil and corruption. Sadly, refusing to vote in corrupt political systems is another worthy but unpopular form of civil disobedience. The compulsion to vote is a political narcotic that sustains democratic tyranny.

Third, people must seek forms of direct democracy that give them political power. National ballot measures and initiatives are needed to make laws, impose spending mandates and recall elected officials. A most important tool is constitutional conventions outside the control of status quo preservationists to obtain systemic reforms that governments will never provide, as explained for the US at www.foavc.org . No greater example of ruling class power exists than the absence of massive public demands for using what the Founders gave Americans in Article V: the convention option to circumvent and fix the federal government that – amazingly – has never been used, and that no presidential candidate has supported, including constitutional champion Ron Raul.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sun May 05th 2024, 07:00 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC