*************3RD OFFICIAL THREAD SENATE FISA LAW****

[gateley]

[davidwparker]

1. I called Jim Webb's office. Warner's office never answered the phone. n/t

[gateley]

6. Excellent!

What did Webb's office say?

Can't threaten Warner with not voting for him next time around (my favorite ploy), so probably no loss there.

[davidwparker]

14. The staff memember took down my message about not giving immunity to

those who broke the spying laws. He was nice.

[kelligesq]

49. good going n/t

/

[Muttocracy]

2. my internet connection just stopped working! they're coming after me!!!!

[gateley]

4. Nice knowing ya. Send postcards from GITMO. nt

[Muttocracy]

5. It's back. Maybe they just went after C-span's site for a bit n/t

[gateley]

31. Sure. My C-Span feed was just fine. Please don't call me again. nt

:tinfoilhat:

[kelligesq]

65. me too for about 1/2 hour- slow as molasses-wouldnt move-checked for

virus and found two "hacker" type things which I stopped

download free personal AVG antispyware and or free sygate - sygate is the one that tells you whose hacking- you fan trace them and stop them

whenI checked sygate and "stopped" minor threat...the computer speeded up

[gateley]

3. Kennedy rocked! DF is actually saying stuff I agree with. Who'da thunk? Nt

[MelissaB]

8. I missed it. :(

Had to get a little work done and closed out the CSPAN browser. aargh

[kelligesq]

11. I didnt understand a thing Feinstein was getting at.whatd she say?

.

[Muttocracy]

13. I think it was an amend. so president can't assume

power to override FISA w/out congressional approval in each case in the future (she referred to Bush doing that after Iraq)

[Muttocracy]

7. DF: have to have new legisl. to override FISA in future (I think) n/t

[kelligesq]

9. TOLL FREE # TO CONGRESS

Toll Free Number


[phone]

we pay for that number and now they want us to pay legal fees and awards for
ATT wrong doing.


Ask them why they are destroying the Constitution.? politely

Called Bond's (R) office, she hung up on me

Called Hatch's office - silence from young man - (shock) then he said he'd give Hatch the message.

1st,2nd, 3rd, 4th amendment now gone.

Free speech, right to assemble, right to bear arms, right to habeus corpus, now right to privacy in home.

[Muttocracy]

10. Reid talking about Cheney on FISA yesterday, Bush today, timeline for decision n/t

[trashcanistanista]

12. Reid's trying to push it through.

Sez * wants it pushed through.

[Muttocracy]

15. so is Reid saying let us vote on these amendments...

and GOP please stop filibustering work on this? 'cause GOP wants to run out clock on the sunset people mentioned in last thread?

[kelligesq]

16. Thassa change.Feingold accused REid publicly of not working very hard for

no immunity.

Feingold must really be pissed...and all of a sudden Harry REid is saying nice things about him

We have to get REid out of that position.,

DODD FOR SENATE MAJORITY LEADER

[MelissaB]

18. He's not just being nice. He's piling it on.

[old guy]

54. All the more reason to not pass it.

Filibuster!

[TwilightGardener]

17. I'm baffled at what Reid is whining about--why can't Dem Senators

have votes on their amendments, at least cloture votes? Isn't he the Majority leader?

[Muttocracy]

20. do repubs threaten filibuster each time they want to vote on an amend?

I think it's the problem of having slim majority in Congress?

[TwilightGardener]

They didn't even have cloture votes, though--that takes the place

of the filibuster.

[kelligesq]

Harry told repugs to fillibuster- truth- again he's putting on show but

doesnt want it to pass. Making it look like the republicans are at fault

[kelligesq]

35. notice Harry doesnt hold "erant"dems voting with pugs in line. Why not?

he could threaten them with no pac money for re-election,
he could remove them from committees'
he doesnt do anything except let the admin and thugs have their way.
DLC

[MelissaB]

36. Is he a DLCer? n/t

[Muttocracy]

53. good point n/t

[kelligesq]

101. yep, he most certainly is. very few of dems are not anymore, I used to admire Durbin

but he's fallen right in line with the rest of the DLC - Conyers, Nadel,
Schumer, everybody it seems exept Feingold and Wexler.

[trashcanistanista]

22. Reid is not making a point.

He is babbling.

[truebrit71]

26. Didn't he say earlier that he was going to FORCE the rethuglicans to filibuster...

..not just threaten it?

What the fuck happened to that stance Harry?

[Muttocracy]

30. I think it's the sunset provision someone mentioned last thread? n/t

need to be done soon to be going back to old law?

[TwilightGardener]

33. I heard that--I don't know what he's doing.

[rodeodance]

19. and a 3rd REC

[kelligesq]

21. Harry putting on a show for us, but waiving the white flag-he surrenders - how unsurprising

:puke:

[gateley]

24. Reid is saying some really good stuff but honestly, is there ANYONE more boring? nt

[Muttocracy]

25. not majority leader material n/t

[rodeodance]

27. the man needs some PASSION--Movement. anything.

[gateley]

47. A heartbeat, bt

[MelissaB]

29. I agree wholeheartedly. He needs some fire in his belly.

Boring as hell.

[kelligesq]

43. dont be silly. He might win dem things he doesnt want to pass then.n/t

.

[rodeodance]

23. NEEDS one more REC

[kelligesq]

37. done n/t

.

[trashcanistanista]

Me to.

[trashcanistanista]

28. Ah Ha!

He wants to extend it for 30 more days!

[trashcanistanista]

32. To prevent it being voting on today.

[rodeodance]

34. Reid wants an extension--any extension

[trashcanistanista]

39. Rethugs want ammendments dropped

and vote to pass the bill today. Harry is trying to stall it.

[TwilightGardener]

41. And...doesn't Harry ultimately set the agenda? Why can't he do what he thinks best?

[Muttocracy]

38. take-home lesson - we need more dem senators n/t

[rodeodance]

40. oh oh-that Repug wants the imm bill passed TODAY

[iris5426]

42. I just called both of my senators...

It was actually made quite easy for my by the Edwards campaign, they just sent out an email encouraging their supporters to call their senators and gave the direct # to call for each (shameless Edwards plug :evilgrin:)

So I am in PA, called Casey's (D) office and left my thoughts with a really nice guy who seemed very enthusiastic about passing on the message to the Senator...then I called Spector's office, and even though he is a Repub I've felt like a lot of the time he does what is right rather than the party line...so that's what I told the guy that answered the phone and told him to ask the senator to oppose retroactive immunity and if necessary stand with the Dems and filibuster...I swear I actually heard Arlen's voice in the background, so maybe they really will give him the message...one can hope! :shrug:


This shit scares me, they'd better do something...

[rodeodance]

44. Mitchy wants to give the Pres another present!!

[Muttocracy]

45. McConnell says we (c-span watchers) too stupid to understand this n/t

[rodeodance]

46. what mean. what did I miss?

[Muttocracy]

50. him just being snide - I bet people watching are thoroughly..

confused by all this procedure.

We are slightly. But he said it in patronizing way. And I think we care about the outcome, not just having a quick and easy procedure. Argh! Stupid people DON'T watch C-SPAN!

[rodeodance]

58. he is cocky a lot--guess I just ignore it

[gateley]

56. Well he nailed me! I'm dazed. nt

[Muttocracy]

59. yeah, but I blame it on them, not us! :)

[PatSeg]

48. Wish they'd quit using the word "homeland"

[Muttocracy]

51. sounds like a fascist term to me - didn't the rest of our laws apply to this land not rest of world?

[PatSeg]

55. Exactly

Can't they used say "our country"?

[lyonn]

94. Each time someone uses Homeland I cringe

Right, "our country" is better/proper. When the Dems start running the show this phrase must be eliminated.

[kelligesq]

110. yeah , sounds like der fuehrers "fatherland" - and I dont think by mistake either nn/t

.

[rodeodance]

52. Mitch talks lots of 'PROTECTING THE HOMELAND"--NOTHING about following the Constitution

[TwilightGardener]

57. WTF? What just happened, with those 17 Repubs' names being read?

Was that just to get into the record that they want to get the FISA bill to a vote today without amendments?

[rodeodance]

60. no, it was a procedual delay--so they could have a pow-wow.

[Muttocracy]

61. poor Akaka - people always asking where he is :) n/t

[TwilightGardener]

64. "Mr. A-KAH-KAHHHH..."

[PatSeg]

66. Every time they say his name

I think they're saying Macaca!

[trashcanistanista]

62. I think it was to vote to invoke cloture on the Rockerfella

ammendment today so they could vote on that.

[gateley]

67. Didn't that rethug want to just basically accept the Rockefeller and Bond

amendments and have it be done with?

Reid is SUCH a WIMP!

[Muttocracy]

63. Maria Cantwell on stimulus while other procedural goings-on n/t

[kelligesq]

68. TOLL FREE # To Congress

Toll Free Number


[phone]

we pay for that number and now they want us to pay legal fees and awards for
ATT wrong doing.


Ask them why they are destroying the Constitution.? politely

Called Bond's (R) office, she hung up on me

Called Hatch's office - silence from young man - (shock) then he said he'd give Hatch the message.

1st,2nd, 3rd, 4th amendment now gone.

Free speech, right to assemble, right to bear arms, right to habeus corpus, now right to privacy in home.

[kelligesq]

69. Think I'l;l call McConnell worst of the worst rethugs & ask why

he's destroying our rights under the Constitution?

[gateley]

74. Really, they don't care about our rights, they don't care about the Constitution -

they care about getting votes.

[trashcanistanista]

70. Reid interrupted her.

Cloture vote set for Mon 1/28 at 4:30PM.

[TwilightGardener]

72. But they're going to pretend it took place at 12 noon. For some reason.

[Muttocracy]

75. I didn't get that one either - even time is fudgable in Congress??? n/t

[trashcanistanista]

81. Correct.

They start at 4:30PM but they must make believe it was 12:00.

[Muttocracy]

73. it sucks that economy is tanking now and they want to work on

stimulus package (a little late) right when this is about to expire. Wish they could have had a shorter winter vacation!!!! grrrr

[gateley]

71. Are we done for the day? Can somebody tell me what happened? Thanks!

[Muttocracy]

76. Durbin doing good explanation of GOP tactics n/t

[gateley]

78. Yeah, I'm just hearing that now. Good job - I like what he's saying. nt

[trashcanistanista]

77. Not really, Durbin is now

slamming the rethugs for stalling the bill.

[PatSeg]

79. Yep, "it's their way or the highway"

Won't give an inch.

[TwilightGardener]

84. Since when do Rethugs control the Senate? Are they the majority now? I swear to

God, there's something about this that smells funny--like this is all theater. Reid and Durbin will say, "it's out of our hands, the Repubs are making us vote on this without amendments and without extensions", and the Repubs agree to take the blame so that both parties can give Chimpy what he wants--immunity. I don't understand why Reid can't demand that Dem amendments on FISA be brought for debate and cloture, or why an extension can't be brought for debate and cloture--I thought he set the agenda. I must be mistaken.

[gateley]

86. I thought the Reps were the majority in the Senate, the Dems in the House -

do I have it all wrong?

[PatSeg]

88. It just feels that way

Dems 51 and Reps 49 - not a very big majority.

[gateley]

95. Well then where the fuck were all the other Dems today? If the Reps only have

49, and two didn't vote (McCain and Graham), that means THIRTEEN Dems voted for it!

Edit to say thanks! :hi:

[kelligesq]

105. 51 dems, 17 went with the rethugs-or were absent-we need to check names

who voted on Bill S2248

If they voted Nay they were good dems

If they voted Aye like Evan Bayh they're right wing

[kelligesq]

108. actually i wish the right wing dems would get the hell out so we could replace them with

real dems....LEFT of CENTER

[Muttocracy]

109. does that count Lieberman and Sanders as D? n/t

[TwilightGardener]

89. No--We're the majority in the Senate--that's why Reid is Majority Leader. He's the boss.

[gateley]

98. Reid. Majority Leader.

:banghead:

I cause myself concern at times....

Thanks!

[kelligesq]

91. Now you get it. One party. DLC IS republican - one party but a lot of acting

going on to make it look like two.

like has been said. They system is broken

somehow we ought to get them all out of there...

[TwilightGardener]

100. Sure, I'll bet Harry Reid's "hands are tied", and conveniently

the time has run out on FISA, and conveniently, the Repubs "won't allow" the extension. Harry scheduled this issue for January, back in October/November, and in December, he decided to give the Senate an extra week off, pushing FISA even closer to the deadline, yet they're SOOOOO busy. Sounds like he wanted to wait and put this off until the deadline, and then say, "whoops! Too late, the Repubs will get their way--damn you, all-powerful Republicans! Guess we'll just have to give Bush waht he wants, no pesky anti-immunity amendments after all"--telling you, this smells to high heaven, and what happened with Dodd filibustering?

[Muttocracy]

80. I'll say again - takehome is we need more Dems in Senate

to stop cloture/filibuster.

[gateley]

87. That's what Joe said once --

"you want things to pass in the Senate? Send us 50 more Democrats."

[cal04]

82. Durbin their way or the highway

well isn't that the way it's always been
I hope you don't cave this time

[rodeodance]

83. dems already LOST the immunity vote bill. now I think they are trying for

some amendments

[gateley]

90. Yeah, but like Durbin said, and even Reid made the point (painfully) that

the R's aren't willing to compromise at all. They are willing to let the current law expire rather than make ANY concessions.

Is the retroactive immunity the ONLY point of contention, anybody know?

[wtmusic]

102. Is letting the current extension expire a bad thing?

Then we revert to FISA, 1978 vintage.

Under that law Bush is guilty as hell of spying without warrants. This whole exercise impresses me as a way to exonerate him under the guise of a wholly unnecessary "update" to FISA.

And I'm not totally convinced that some Dems aren't being swayed by the telecom lobby in their own states to push anything through that lets them off the hook. We're talking about billions of dollars, after all.

[gateley]

104. That's what I was wondering -- sounds good to me!

Money talks -- always, and like you say, there's BIG money at stake here. Thirteen Dems voted to table it today. Even if every Dem had been there, the turncoats would have ensured the R victory.

[Muttocracy]

106. given BushCo don't follow laws regardless, who knows... n/t

[kelligesq]

85. The cloture vote will be on Monday at 4:30 - rethugs won.pls

use that free 800 number and call your senators and the thugs.

Tell them whether you will ever vote republican again after what they have done with this Fisa bill and destroying the consititution.

I detest that McConnell

Spector milder but no better

and Grassley covered up all boooosh was doing in the intelligence committee

and finally Rockefeller really surprised me. Stealth mole.

[gateley]

92. I think there were about 10 dems who voted to table it -- so I'm calling them,

too, and telling them they lost my vote as a result of this.

I hope they don't take note of my area code when I call :7.

[kelligesq]

97. use the 800 # goes to operator switchboard - then to who you ask for -wont see yr area code

:mad:

[gateley]

99. Thanks -- didn't even think of it!

[karynnj]

114. Here's the list - Mikulski and Inouye really surprised me

YEAs ---60
Alexander (R-TN)
Allard (R-CO)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Bayh (D-IN)
Bennett (R-UT)
Bond (R-MO)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burr (R-NC)
Carper (D-DE)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Coleman (R-MN)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
Dole (R-NC)
Domenici (R-NM)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Inouye (D-HI)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lieberman (ID-CT)
Lugar (R-IN)
Martinez (R-FL)
McCaskill (D-MO)
McConnell (R-KY)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Pryor (D-AR)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Salazar (D-CO)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Sununu (R-NH)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)
Wicker (R-MS)
NAYs ---36
Akaka (D-HI)
Baucus (D-MT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Boxer (D-CA)
Brown (D-OH)
Byrd (D-WV)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Cardin (D-MD)
Casey (D-PA)
Conrad (D-ND)
Dodd (D-CT)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Harkin (D-IA)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Kerry (D-MA)
Klobuchar (D-MN)
Kohl (D-WI)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Menendez (D-NJ)
Murray (D-WA)
Reed (D-RI)
Reid (D-NV)
Sanders (I-VT)
Schumer (D-NY)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Tester (D-MT)
Webb (D-VA)
Whitehouse (D-RI)
Wyden (D-OR)
Not Voting - 4
Clinton (D-NY)
Graham (R-SC)
McCain (R-AZ)
Obama (D-IL)

[VP505]

93. I wrongly

though that when Rockefeller replaced Roberts as chair that things would change, should have known better, its business as usual. Different Name same crap!

[PatSeg]

96. Its only January

This is going to be a damn LONG year.

[kelligesq]

103. Cheney exalting about FISA on C-Span now....more fear mongering

:puke:

[gateley]

107. Yeah - I just turned it off when I heard him mention "chemical and biological

weapons." Probably just dusted off his Saddam speech.

[wtmusic]

111. It's encouraging that Cheney's getting in the act

they want this fucker passed and they want it now. I say let it expire, and file charges against the lot of 'em.

The moral thing to do is always throw your support proportionately AGAINST anything that the Che-devil is pushing.

[pdxmom]

112. Let it expire. Obviously, the safety of the telecoms is more important

to the Repugs than the safety of the people.

[rhett o rick]

113. Help me I am lost. On Monday they will be voting for cloture for what? Is Dodd filibustering? nm

[Inuca]

115. Voting for cloture on the intel version

Reid said he will vote against cloture, for whatever it's worth