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lightningandsnow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 09:02 PM
Original message
Heterosexual Privilege Checklist.
Edited on Thu Jan-10-08 09:07 PM by AspieGrrl
From http://members.aol.com/ahotcupofjava/hetero.html:

If I am a Heterosexual:


1. I can go into a music store and find the language of my sexual orientation represented in the lyrics.

2. Television and movies reflect my relationships in widely diverse and nonstereotypical ways.

3. My children are given texts and information at school that validates my sexual orientation.

4. Society encourages me to marry and celebrates my commitment.

5. As a responsible and loving parent, I won't lose my children in a custody battle because of my sexual orientation.

6. I can easily buy postcards, books, greeting cards, and magazines featuring relationships like mine.

7. I don't have to worry about being fired or denied housing because of my sexual orientation.

8. I can be sure that if my spouse is in the hospital and incapacities, I can visit and will be consulted about any decisions that need to be made.

9. Insurance provided by my employer covers my spouse and my children.

10. Hand holding with my love is seen as acceptable and endearing.

11. I can serve my country in the military without lying or keeping silent about my family.

12. I can keep pictures of my loved one on my desk at work without fear or reprisal.

13. I will receive all of my deceased spouse's estate, tax-free.

14. I never need to change pronouns when describing the events of my life in order to protect my job, my family, or my friendships.

15. If I'm a teenager, I can enjoy dating, first loves, and all the social approval of learning to love appropriately.

16. If I'm called to work with children or to serve God (in most denominations). I don't have to violate my integrity and lie in order to keep my job.

17. As a responsible and loving adult, I can adopt without lying about my sexual orientation.

18. I feel welcomed and accepted in my church.

19. I can be certain that my children won't be harassed because of my sexual orientation.

20. I can count on my community of friends, strangers, and institutions to celebrate my love and my family, mourn my losses, and support my relationships.


I thought maybe I should post this in the GLBT forum... but I wanted people to see it here.

Edit: feel free to add your own.
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Kutjara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 09:09 PM
Response to Original message
1. A very powerful list and abundant food for thought.
Many of the items phrase familiar concepts (such as "don't ask/don't tell") in ways that clearly show how damaging such bigotry really is.

It also makes plain how comprehensively society demands people who are LGBT to sacrifice their ethics and integrity to "fit in."

This list should be distributed widely.
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Skinner ADMIN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 09:14 PM
Response to Original message
2. This reminds me of something we read way back in my college freshman English class.
It was like this list, except the subject was White privilege. I remember one of the items on the list was, "I can purchase bandages that match my skin color."

It's pretty amazing, really. The list had probably 50 or 100 items on it, most of them much more serious than bandage color. I have forgotten all the others. To this day, the item about bandage color is the only one I remember. In fact, I think about it with some regularity. It's so simple, but it really had a lasting affect on me.
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Berry Cool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. And the reason it stuck with you (so to speak) is because it was so small
but it was something you could relate to from childhood onward. You never had to think twice about the fact that if you went to a nearby store for a box of Band-Aids, they came in your skin color. Bingo. Of such things are awareness made.

I remember, when I was a kid, there was a color of Crayola crayon called "flesh."

It wasn't brown.

Today, it is called "peach."
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jmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. I think I've posted this story before but
when I was in first grade we had this big art project our teachers were hyping up where we were suppose to make a class mural and draw life-size self portraits. When the day finally came they brought in multicultural crayons for everyone to use. I didn't exactly live in the most diverse school district that year and while everybody was grabbing there supplies I stood looking around until I realized there were no crayons for me. I think in the mid-80's multicultural meant Eastern and Western Europe. They also threw a white and a black crayon in the box and when I complained I was told to use those. One of my friends yelled, "Jessie's not gray" and pretty soon nobody drew until they gave up the portrait idea.

I know it's improved somewhat since then but I was in a crafts store a month ago and they had a package of flesh toned food dyes but apparently nobody is darker than "tanned."

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mcscajun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. Seems at least some version of the list is still bouncing around.
1. I can if I wish arrange to be in the company of people of my race most of the time.

2. I can avoid spending time with people whom I was trained to mistrust and who have learned to mistrust my kind or me.

3. If I should need to move, I can be pretty sure of renting or purchasing housing in an area which I can afford and in which I would want to live.

4. I can be pretty sure that my neighbors in such a location will be neutral or pleasant to me.

5. I can go shopping alone most of the time, pretty well assured that I will not be followed or harassed.

6. I can turn on the television or open to the front page of the paper and see people of my race widely represented.

7. When I am told about our national heritage or about "civilization," I am shown that people of my color made it what it is.

8. I can be sure that my children will be given curricular materials that testify to the existence of their race.

9. If I want to, I can be pretty sure of finding a publisher for this piece on white privilege.

10. I can be pretty sure of having my voice heard in a group in which I am the only member of my race.

11. I can be casual about whether or not to listen to another person's voice in a group in which s/he is the only member of his/her race.

12. I can go into a music shop and count on finding the music of my race represented, into a supermarket and find the staple foods which fit with my cultural traditions, into a hairdresser's shop and find someone who can cut my hair.

13. Whether I use checks, credit cards or cash, I can count on my skin color not to work against the appearance of financial reliability.

14. I can arrange to protect my children most of the time from people who might not like them.

15. I do not have to educate my children to be aware of systemic racism for their own daily physical protection.

16. I can be pretty sure that my children's teachers and employers will tolerate them if they fit school and workplace norms; my chief worries about them do not concern others' attitudes toward their race.

17. I can talk with my mouth full and not have people put this down to my color.

18. I can swear, or dress in second hand clothes, or not answer letters, without having people attribute these choices to the bad morals, the poverty or the illiteracy of my race.

19. I can speak in public to a powerful male group without putting my race on trial.

20. I can do well in a challenging situation without being called a credit to my race.

21. I am never asked to speak for all the people of my racial group.

22. I can remain oblivious of the language and customs of persons of color who constitute the world's majority without feeling in my culture any penalty for such oblivion.

23. I can criticize our government and talk about how much I fear its policies and behavior without being seen as a cultural outsider.

24. I can be pretty sure that if I ask to talk to the "person in charge", I will be facing a person of my race.

25. If a traffic cop pulls me over or if the IRS audits my tax return, I can be sure I haven't been singled out because of my race.

26. I can easily buy posters, post-cards, picture books, greeting cards, dolls, toys and children's magazines featuring people of my race.

27. I can go home from most meetings of organizations I belong to feeling somewhat tied in, rather than isolated, out-of-place, outnumbered, unheard, held at a distance or feared.

28. I can be pretty sure that an argument with a colleague of another race is more likely to jeopardize her/his chances for advancement than to jeopardize mine.

29. I can be pretty sure that if I argue for the promotion of a person of another race, or a program centering on race, this is not likely to cost me heavily within my present setting, even if my colleagues disagree with me.

30. If I declare there is a racial issue at hand, or there isn't a racial issue at hand, my race will lend me more credibility for either position than a person of color will have.

31. I can choose to ignore developments in minority writing and minority activist programs, or disparage them, or learn from them, but in any case, I can find ways to be more or less protected from negative consequences of any of these choices.

32. My culture gives me little fear about ignoring the perspectives and powers of people of other races.

33. I am not made acutely aware that my shape, bearing or body odor will be taken as a reflection on my race.

34. I can worry about racism without being seen as self-interested or self-seeking.

35. I can take a job with an affirmative action employer without having my co-workers on the job suspect that I got it because of my race.

36. If my day, week or year is going badly, I need not ask of each negative episode or situation whether it had racial overtones.

37. I can be pretty sure of finding people who would be willing to talk with me and advise me about my next steps, professionally.

38. I can think over many options, social, political, imaginative or professional, without asking whether a person of my race would be accepted or allowed to do what I want to do.

39. I can be late to a meeting without having the lateness reflect on my race.

40. I can choose public accommodation without fearing that people of my race cannot get in or will be mistreated in the places I have chosen.

41. I can be sure that if I need legal or medical help, my race will not work against me.

42. I can arrange my activities so that I will never have to experience feelings of rejection owing to my race.

43. If I have low credibility as a leader I can be sure that my race is not the problem.

44. I can easily find academic courses and institutions which give attention only to people of my race.

45. I can expect figurative language and imagery in all of the arts to testify to experiences of my race.

46. I can chose blemish cover or bandages in "flesh" color and have them more or less match my skin.

47. I can travel alone or with my spouse without expecting embarrassment or hostility in those who deal with us.

48. I have no difficulty finding neighborhoods where people approve of our household.

49. My children are given texts and classes which implicitly support our kind of family unit and do not turn them against my choice of domestic partnership.

50. I will feel welcomed and "normal" in the usual walks of public life, institutional and social.

http://seamonkey.ed.asu.edu/~mcisaac/emc598ge/Unpacking.html
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FlyingSquirrel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #2
16. I noticed that one day while watching baseball...
Then Mariners centerfielder Mike Cameron had to put a band-aid on his face and it stuck out like a sore thumb, and I realized how sucky it must be to have to put on a bandaid that didn't match your skin color. Since then whenever I'm buying band-aids I look to see if anyone has thought to make them in any other colors.... so far, nope.

Hmmmm maybe I'll just delete this post and start my own band-aid company.
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #16
39. Much like ALL pens and pencils are oriented...
Much like ALL pens and pencils are oriented for right-handed people only.
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jakem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:52 PM
Response to Reply #39
47. really? i always end up with the left-handed pencils...
:wtf:
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 03:38 AM
Response to Reply #2
19. dupe (i found the peggy mcintosh list of 50 but i see it is already posted) n/t
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 03:43 AM by orleans
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ismnotwasm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 09:20 PM
Response to Original message
3. K&R
Awesome post

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ismnotwasm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 09:32 PM
Response to Original message
4. And another kick
Because it's important
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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 09:44 PM
Response to Original message
6. I have the chance to nail Heather Locklear
Not a great chance, mind you. But still within the realm of statistical probability.

Unless she sees me naked and then I'd be lucky to be doing the wild thing with Ernest Borgnine.
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knitter4democracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
7. I can go to a bar and hang out with friends without fear.
That's something I've thought about ever since talking with a couple of guys in my salon. They wanted to get all nice to go out but were having to drive to a bigger city so that they could hang out at a bar more safely than here where they'd be recognized. They're just young kids trying to find love, like so many others, but it's that much harder. Sad.
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
10. Excellent!
;)

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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
11. 21. Nobody will try to convince me to "pray the straight away"
Most excellent list. :thumbsup:






Queer Gear
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Whisp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 11:25 PM
Response to Original message
12. great post. thanks.
recommended.
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CorpGovActivist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 11:27 PM
Response to Original message
13. K&R n/t
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Hoof Hearted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 11:48 PM
Response to Original message
14. I don't have to deal with scientific articles trying to justify my orientation through genetics
as though I had a terrible disease.
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mondo joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 11:58 PM
Response to Original message
15. 22. I never have to consciously choose when to conversationally "out" myself.
I think the gay posters will know what I mean.
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libnnc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #15
56. yep
agreed
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Chovexani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #15
57. All too well.
:(
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donheld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 03:09 AM
Response to Original message
17. Kicked, Recommended, and bookmarked
Thanks for posting. :yourock:
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ihavenobias Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 03:14 AM
Response to Original message
18. Rec + Excellent points! (there is one big downside though)
and that's potential (unplanned) pregnancy.

I realize there's birth control but hey, accidents happen. Granted, they don't happen THAT often if contraception is used correctly, but they do happen, and there is the risk that people get carried away in the moment (a bad idea but the point is the possibility only exists for straight people).
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goodgd_yall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:02 AM
Response to Original message
20. If I were Hetero
at work I could talk about my weekend without fear of fellow workers treating me differently because they just learned who I hang out with and who I love.
Fellow heteros would be interested in my relationship and relate to me when I talked about my significant other.
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:02 AM
Response to Original message
21. here's a couple more for the list
* i never had the crap beat out of me because of my sexual orientation

* i never feared for my life because of my sexual orientation




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goodgd_yall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:10 AM
Response to Reply #21
22. You made me think of another
My heart wouldn't pound in my chest when someone in the office

a)is making a joke about Harvey Milk's murder
b)is making a joke about AIDS
c)is making any joke about gay men
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:25 AM
Response to Original message
23. that seems to be inaccurate
Considering that a good number of those "privileges" are only available to heterosexuals who have either spouses or significant others. Not to mention desks.

"12. I can keep pictures of my loved one on my desk at work without fear or reprisal."

Heterosexuals are supposed to get desks? Where he heck is my desk then? How am I supposed to exercise this privilege if I have neither a loved one nor a desk?
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Sapphocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:12 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. What a shitty thing to say.
What a shitty, dismissive thing to say, dismissing my nonexistent rights like that.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:15 AM
Response to Reply #25
28. Oh, get over yourself
Not being able to get any is far worse than being denied equal civil rights. :sarcasm:
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Sapphocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:37 AM
Response to Reply #28
29. With each passing day...
...I believe more and more that that is at the root of some people's desire to keep us at the bottom of the pile.
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IronLionZion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 03:18 PM
Response to Reply #29
35. It is
especially among sexually repressed republicans. It's a power trip for them and they get off on it. They need to keep SOMEBODY down. You can't be exclusive unless you exclude someone.
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:11 AM
Response to Reply #23
27. I am sure there must be a clue market near you
take a dollar there and buy a clue.
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mondo joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:39 AM
Response to Reply #23
31. That you don't have a desk or a loved one comes as little surprise, given your post.
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IronLionZion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #23
37. I use to be similarly bitter towards the gays back when I was single
because in spite of all their whining, at least they had somebody who loves them and I didn't. But I was just feeling negative in general then.

Things got a million times better once I got a girlfriend...and met her impressively large number of gay friends. We do have it good. We have so much better than the GLBT folks. Hell I don't have many of those things but that doesn't matter. We still have the privileges whether we exercise it or not. We still have the right to. The GLBT folks don't even have the choice.

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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #37
46. was that bitter?
I suppose, but I also think it is illogical to make a list of "heterosexual privileges" when it is pretty clear that the 'privileges' do not apply to all heterosexuals. However, it is kinda hard to compare one group to another group too. If you did that, wouldn't most people agree that a) people with loving partners are better off than b) people with no partners and c) people with abusive partners. Secondly, if you made some other groupings such as a) people with good jobs (perhaps even including a desk, but I think I make better money than some cube-rats for whatever that is worth.) are better off than b) people with bad jobs and c) people with no jobs. It depends on the groupings and most people probably belong to more than one group.

Even worse in this society are some of the ideologies. "You don't have a good job because you are a loser/lazy/stupid". "You don't have an SO because you are unloveable."

That sounds like a personal problem, a student said to me once, talking about herself. I quipped back, in America, everything is a personal problem because nobody helps anybody else. That's not true, of course, but we do seem to be a society with a major shortage of love and understanding.
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libnnc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #23
52. Interesting how you never miss an opportunity
to piss all over a meaningful post regarding Lesbian/Gay civil rights and visibility.

Asshole post if I ever saw one.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #52
64. I am sure I miss some opportunities
but it was an interesting thread title this time and I kinda strongly disagreed with the OP's assumption that "every heterosexual is married and has children" (#2 my children, #5 as a parent, #8 my spouse, #9 my spouse and my children, #10 my love, #11 my family, #12 my loved one, #13 my deceased spouse, #17 I can adopt (yeah, just try it as a single person, particularly as a single man. I bet I can adopt.) #19 my children). So, yeah, the OP rubbed me the wrong way because I am not married with children. And yes, again, I am typically more progressive on economic issues than social ones
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/hfojvt/67

but I did not mean to deliberately insult anybody. I responded from my own personal point of view. Some people think my POV am wrong. Others seem to think that I am wrong/invalid/subhuman.
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FreeState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:32 AM
Response to Original message
24. Here are some more... family related
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 04:38 AM by FreeState
I never have to worry my family will disown me over whom I love

I never have to tell my parents Im different not perverted

My family will always treat my spouse as more than a "friend"

My church will never pit my family against me because of who I am

My family will never automatically worry over getting HIV/AIDS because of my sexual orientation


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Smith_3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:09 AM
Response to Original message
26. An advantage of being male homo: it is much much easier to get easy sex than for a hetero.
;-)
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Froward69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:36 AM
Response to Original message
30. number 7 is partially false
"7. I don't have to worry about being fired or denied housing because of my sexual orientation."

As a small time landlord, I can state that insofar as myself and most of my colleagues. Gay men are PREFERRED. that is they...
1) pay rent on time
2) Improve the unit and property (shelves, smell better on leaving, artistic paint, pull weeds etc.)
3) are largely self sufficient. (don't call over the smallest thing)
4) friendly
5) tend to stay put (fulfill the whole lease)
6) give positive advise insofar as making the property better, or more appealing.
7) (depending on the location) enhance rent value.
8) Quiet
9) never into others business
10) (aside from regular relationship issues) tend to have less drama.

now lesbian Women are next on the preferred scale. then married couples. and then finally singles, (male or female)

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Chovexani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #30
58. You're missing the point.
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 09:02 PM by Chovexani
Whether or not you personally choose to discriminate is irrelevant. The point is, in many places, LGBT can be denied housing and have no legal recourse.
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northofdenali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 02:04 PM
Response to Original message
32. If I am heterosexual -
I don't have to be afraid at a biker rally.
I don't feel that inviting GLBT friends over for Thanksgiving will reflect, personnally, on me.





My cats will like me.



Great points. To all my GLBT friends (and I have many) - I DIDN'T REALIZE SOME OF THIS. Now, our State and our University system (thanks to my good friend, a local attorney, who fought for years and won) has decided that ALL members of a committed relationship are entitled to insurance coverage. But that doesn't apply to most in my sadly Republican state.

Fear sucks. And it seems the right wing has many, many, many, many fears.

Goddess be with you, Aspie.

NoD
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
33. recommend
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Atman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
34. I kinda have a problem with this list...
First of all, I'm bi. I know this is frowned upon by gays, but what can I say? "Love the one your with" is my motto. I have some boyfriends I absolutely adore and I have some girlfriends I absolutely adore...why should I have to pick one just so I fit into a convenient demographic?

Anyway, that controversy aside, here's my prob with the list...why is it so difficult to accept that as a gay American, bi American, transgendered American, whatever, that we are simply NOT in the majority. Not by a long shot. Face it, heterosexuality is the norm and therefore our popular culture reflects that.

I think anyone should have the full legal right to marry anyone they choose (except maybe their mom or sister...I dunno...that's just me!). I think every American should have the right to fully express their love for their fellow Americans in any way they see fit (again, within reason). But hell, looking at your list...I can't be certain, for instance, that my own hetero kids will not be harassed because of their sexual orientation, or for anything else for that matter.

You make some great points; the picture of a loved one on your desk, for example, is particularly poignant. Then there are the legal issues, like death benefits. But here is my issue, sorry if it causes trouble for some...

As a GBLT American, you/we are simply NOT even remotely in the majority. To take this to an extreme which some may dislike, I'm a snowboarder. I love the sport. But not everyone snowboards. I don't want laws passed to protect my right to shred. I accept the fact that the rest of the world simply isn't like me. Please, PLEASE, don't zero in on this one example as if it is the only point of my post (I know some still will...this is DU, after all). I'm not trying to equate snowboarding with being gay. I'm just trying to make the point that in any society there is going to be a majority and that majority will effectively set the tone.

I could make myself "normal" by being stupid and watching American Idol and eating at McDonalds. But I don't do those things, either, because they're not me, I'm not trying to be "normal."

There are many excellent points to your list, as I've said. But to expect that the rest of the population is going to change to accept our out-of-the-mainstream lifestyles is not realistic. There will always be exceptions to the "norm."

We have to fight for full -- FULL -- parity in terms of legal rights for GBLT Americans. But I think it's as unrealistic to think the entire country should bend to our will as it is to expect that we'll all just become a nation of snowboarders.





Something tells me I'm not stating my case as clearly as I'd hoped to. I know some will be upset with this, but I genuinely believe it. I accept that my sexuality is not "normal," and while I hate "normalcy," one has to be realistic about how societies work. One faction is going to dominate, always. That's the way it is.

And yes, it sucks.

.
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FreeState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #34
41. Thats what Heterosexual privilege is
its the things that come because your in the majority. I don't think anyone is saying GLBT folks should be seen as the norm, but rather society causes harm to individuals when it assumes everyone is heterosexual rather than acknowledging there are people that are not the majority.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:18 PM
Response to Reply #34
42. Maybe you aren't stating your case as clearly as you'd hoped to
But I think it's as unrealistic to think the entire country should bend to our will as it is to expect that we'll all just become a nation of snowboarders.



We don't expect that the country should bend to our will. We don't want the entire country to become a nation of LGBTs. The only that wants to "recruit" and make the entire country into what they are is RRRW evangelical Christians.


What we want is equal rights and protections under the law. We want federal protection from hate crimes. People already enjoy such protection for religion, race, nation origin, etc. We want equal marriage rights. We want to be free from discrimination. People can think what they want (this is still not 1984's Oceania), but they can't treat us like sh*t without repercussions. I don't think this is too much to ask.




I accept that my sexuality is not "normal," and while I hate "normalcy," one has to be realistic about how societies work. One faction is going to dominate, always. That's the way it is.


Your sexuality is as normal as anybody elses. Just because something isn't in the majority doesn't make it abnormal. Only 7-10% of the US population is left-handed but left-handedness is not "abnormal". 1.8% of the US considers itself Episcopalian, but being Episcopalian is not "abnormal". 0.8% of the US is American Indian/Alaskan Native but they certainly aren't "abnormal".

Being part of a minority does not make one abnormal. Don't buy the RRRW lies.



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Chovexani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 09:03 PM
Response to Reply #42
59. I really wish this dude would get out of my orientation
He never misses an opportunity to be ignorant.
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IronLionZion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #34
44. A gay person told me "monogamy is for straight people"
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 05:07 PM by IronLionZion
and that gays are supposed to act differently and be promiscuous. I told him he was an idiot, and that is nothing to do with his being gay. There are gays who are very much against all the things in that list, but they should still have the choice. It doesn't matter what you actually do, you should at least have the right to make that choice.

To jump on your snowboarding analogy like a good DUer, there was a time when snowboarders were not welcome in many resorts. That has changed and it's in the Olympics now. There is an industry of snowboarding clothes/gear and whatever. And snowboarders tend to keep their own culture of smoking weed and whatever to be different from the skiers. There's room for everyone at the ski resort, except maybe those wankers on the mini-skis. I hate those fuckers.

on edit: spelling/grammar sorry my brain is sleeping today.
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Atman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #44
45. LOL! Great post.
A genuine laugh-out-loud! I hate those fuckers on the mini-skis, too! Great post. Thanks.

.
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Le Taz Hot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 03:20 PM
Response to Original message
36. Excellent!
K & R. Sort of puts a lot of things that we take for granted into perspective, doesn't it?
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NastyDiaper Donating Member (806 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
38. My straight wife would probably disagree w/ #6.
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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:08 PM
Response to Original message
40. I must be very lucky...
Or, more importantly, the GLBT folk in my town are. Everyone should go to Long Beach, CA, once in their lives. During Gay Pride Week would be best. Cruise down Ocean Blvd. and see all the houses decorated in rainbows, go to the parade and see all manner of silliness and seriousness, go to the festival and be yourself regardless of who you are or who you see yourself becoming. Then go down Second Street and Broadway, and you'll find so many wonderful shops... gay owned and operated... with cards, posters, anything you can think of that says gay pride.

There are a few things on the list that remain as hideous reminders, but we've come a very long way. And as a straight female, I strongly support the diversity of my community and I welcome future changes!
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Chovexani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 09:08 PM
Response to Reply #40
60. Your heart's in the right place but you don't really understand
The fact that there are gayborhoods does not imply that we've come a long way. Understand why gayborhoods sprung up in the first place, and you'll begin to see.

Don't get me wrong, we have come a long way as a society but we have much, much further to go. I don't like when straight people bring up Pride parades and gayborhoods as proof things are hunky dory. People have been bashed right on Christopher St. in front of the Stonewall Inn, in 2007.
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Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:27 PM
Response to Original message
43. Nice post, AspieGrrl!
Has anyone told you lately that you're kinda AWESOME?

Just in case the answer to that is "no", let me say this:

AspieGrrl is pretty fricking AWESOME!

You are kind, caring, well-informed...and just smart as all get-out!



I recommended this thread.
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sam kane Donating Member (326 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 07:03 PM
Response to Original message
48. Recommend. LOL at #2, though.
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 07:05 PM by sam kane
"2. Television and movies reflect my relationships in widely diverse and nonstereotypical ways."

Is this a joke? If not, I would suggest changing this one, or at least moving it down. It will lose a lot of feminists, media critics, gender studies people who would tell you that 99% of TV and movies show heterosexual relationships in *stereotypical* and *uniform* ways.

Maybe something like:

"2. Television and movies reflect my relationships as widely positive and extremely significant."
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cabraverde Donating Member (234 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 07:09 PM
Response to Original message
49. I have a question about #10 and #15
How do these get changed? would it be prudent to outlaw laughing, snide remarks....or the rolling of eyes?
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FreeState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #49
62. Education and people standing up to stop it n/t
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cabraverde Donating Member (234 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #62
63. well.....how do they stand up and stop it?
do they use force? i live in upstate NY, we have some people here who will have no problem calling a black person a N*****, a lesbian a bull d*** or a gay man a pretty little f*****. There is no amount of education that will chance their opinion, they only way they will change is by ruthless aggression or a constitutional amendment.
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:04 PM
Response to Original message
50. Perfectly acceptable to post here
And your point #14 is particularly poignant to me.

I can't say that your points are completely untrue in Canada, but at least they're not codified in law here.

Thanks for posting this. It may open a few eyes.

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fortyfeetunder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:09 PM
Response to Original message
51. this made me start to cry
reminded me of the estate fiasco after someone I knew passed. Though the deceased had a will, the deceased parents overruled their child's wishes..the partner had to fight.

If Leona Helmsley can leave millions of dollars to her dog, then I don't see what's the problem with estate planning for GLBT famiies...

yes, this is sorely needed. Thank you for posting
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Sabriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:49 PM
Response to Original message
53. My sexual orientation is never a matter of national debate
And I don't have to worry about a candidate "supporting" me and thereby losing the support of others.

And I never have to consider emigrating because of opportunities available to others of my sexual orientation in other countries.

And most importantly of all, I can choose to ignore the inequities, because of my supreme power position in this society (just as my white, middle class status also privileges me to do the same thing).
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Chovexani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:55 PM
Response to Original message
54. K&R
And thank you for posting it here, where the people who need to see it can read and think about it.
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GOPBasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:57 PM
Response to Original message
55. All very true. No one can argue with any of those points. n/t
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Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
61. amen!
thank you and I support this thread 100%.
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