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Washington DC is 57% Black, the DC Libby Trial Jury 16% Black

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usregimechange Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 12:55 AM
Original message
Washington DC is 57% Black, the DC Libby Trial Jury 16% Black
Edited on Thu Feb-22-07 12:56 AM by usregimechange
"Although most District residents are African American, the jury includes six white women, four white men and two black women."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/21/AR2007022100963.html?sub=AR

District of Columbia
Black or African American
56.8%
http://factfinder.census.gov/servlet/ACSSAFFFacts?_event=Search&geo_id=&_geoContext=&_street=&_county=&_cityTown=&_state=04000US11&_zip=&_lang=en&_sse=on&pctxt=fph&pgsl=010

Explain...
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Kagemusha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 12:57 AM
Response to Original message
1. You are aware the defense can get jurors tossed, right?
Like say ones that tend to be Democrats, who might be biased against the Bush administration, who might have strong feelings about urban neglect, the war in Iraq, etc etc?

There's your explanation.
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usregimechange Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:02 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Does the prosecution get the same opportunity?
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Kagemusha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:04 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. To a degree but in this case the prosecution was very restrained
whereas the defense used its opportunities aggressively to get a less black jury for Libby. Hardly claiming race is the only factor; only for the first time today did I read that the lead attorney for Libby, is black. (And an expert of emotional manipulation of juries. Usually good at it even.) But I imagine blacks trended Democratic and displeased with Libby's boss.
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Perky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 05:51 AM
Response to Reply #3
19. YES!!!!!
both sides get an equal number of strikes.
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Hosnon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:00 AM
Response to Original message
2. Juries do not have to racially mirror the population of the jurisdiction in which
the trial is held.
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usregimechange Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:04 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Especially in the south, just ask Myrlie Evers.
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Hosnon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:06 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Especially in the South?
Juries everywhere do not have to racially mirror the jurisdiction.

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usregimechange Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. I don't want a quota, but I think Blacks make good jurors as well.
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Hosnon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. I do too. It's simply not required that the percentages match up. Does
every jury have to have the same percentage of women, minorities, homosexuals, seniors, wealthy, poor, blond, etc. as the population of the jurisdiction? And don't forget that the jury has to be "impartial".

The legal system would grind to a halt were these the requirements.
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usregimechange Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. Again, I don't expect a quota but the Black folks seem to be...
under-represented as WP noted.
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Hosnon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:35 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. I agree.
However, it doesn't seem to be an indicator either way that there is something amiss.

If Libby were poor, black and female and the jury consisted of 12 rich, white men then I'd be right there with you.
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karlrschneider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:16 AM
Response to Original message
8. What is your point? Are you perhaps suggesting the jury is prejudiced?
Sorry, I don't understand. Jury selection is probably the least politically-influenced process in civic affairs.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:25 AM
Response to Original message
10. What a surprise. n/t
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Psephos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:28 AM
Response to Original message
11. You would also need to know the pool from which jurors are selected
Edited on Thu Feb-22-07 01:30 AM by Psephos
The jury selection pool is always a subset of the general population. Usually it's drawn from a list of registered voters and holders of driver's licenses; it excludes those who haven't registered to vote or drive, those who have criminal records, the incarcerated, parolees, as well as anyone currently involved in a lawsuit or legal action. Minors are not included, nor are homeless, transients, people without verifiable addresses, people serving in the military overseas, illegal immigrants, on and on and on. Single mothers unable to obtain or afford child care usually get a deferment, too.

Many people blow jury duty off. Different socioeconomic classes respond at different rates to jury duty summonses.

And then, in the courtroom, jurors are questioned to determine their impartiality. Persons with distrust of the judicial system are often sorted out at this stage by their answers. Additionally, both the prosecution and the defense get to disqualify several jurors without having to say why.

Your assumptions need a bit of tweaking. :-) You may have a point, but the raw census figures won't help you much. You need to know how the various statistical categories listed above skew according to race.

In most jurisdictions, the rules for selection pools and criteria must be approved by the highest local judiciary (such as a State Supreme Court). They do a better job than many realize.

A defendant who believes he or she is unable to obtain a fair trial because a local jury is too racially homogenous (and presumably unsympathetic) may request to have the venue removed to a location where a fair jury may be easier to seat.

Peace.
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usregimechange Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. Good points.
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Hosnon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. I'd like to add that it always helps to look at each angle.
Keep up the good research...something good may very well come of it.
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GreenZoneLT Donating Member (805 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 01:42 AM
Response to Original message
16. Probably a factor of the defendant and misleading demographics
Couple things. Some number of black residents aren't eligible for jury duty, a larger number than of whites. Something like one-fourth to one-third of black men in DC are under the supervision of the court (in jail or on parole or probation). The bulk of those not actually behind bars aren't felons, so they can still serve, but that still probably drops the percentage. Also, blacks are younger on average, so a larger percentage of black DC residents are too young for jury duty. That 57 percent probably drops under 50 percent of eligible residents after including those factors.

Prosecutors tend to exclude blacks from criminal trial juries because they expect them to be sympathetic to the defense. Defense lawyers generally try to get them on juries for the same reason, but Libby's lawyers probably figure he's not a sympathetic figure. It's possible both the defense AND the prosecution were were using their strikes to eliminate blacks from the jury pool. They don't do it just because of racial or cultural stereotypes; demographics and class have more to do with it (low-income jurors favor defendants in criminal cases, and blacks are more likely to be poor).

When you have such a small sample (12), the individual quirks of the jury pool weigh most heavily; you'd need a larger sample to make much of a conclusion. It's like flipping coins -- it's unusual, but not THAT unusual to only get 2 heads out of 12 tosses; but it's astronomically unlikely to get 2,000 heads in 12,000 tosses.



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youngdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 04:48 AM
Response to Original message
17. Because they were allowed to exclude those with strong feelings about the administration
And since Bushco has an approval rating among blacks literally in the single digits, there was trouble finding any minorities to seat, I would imagine.
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Perky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-22-07 05:50 AM
Response to Original message
18. three issues at play here
Edited on Thu Feb-22-07 05:55 AM by Perky
1) this is federal court and the Hurry ppol is not limited to the the District (I don't think..but I could be wrong)
2) The key point of correalation is not the general population, it it the voter registration lists.

3) You have no idea what took place in voire dire (jury strikes)
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