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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 05:57 AM
Original message
Voters: 'It's like we don't count' - Mich. primary fuels anger, apathy
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 06:09 AM by Breeze54
Voters: 'It's like we don't count'

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080107/NEWS06/801070333

Democratic ballot in Mich. primary fuels anger, apathy


January 7, 2008

BY CHRIS CHRISTOFF

FREE PRESS STAFF WRITER

It's NASCAR on bicycles, Halloween with no costumes and Miss America without swimsuits.

Michigan's Democratic presidential primary on Jan. 15 is a contest in name only, with just one major candidate -- Hillary Clinton -- on the ballot.


While Republicans look forward to choosing from a large field of candidates, Democratic voters are angry and confused.

"It's like we don't count," said Barbara Pegg, 61, a Brownstown Township Democrat.

She said she was excited by the prospects of an open primary at first, but now she doesn't plan to vote Jan. 15.

Her favorite candidate, John Edwards, won't be on the ballot. She said she would vote for Clinton in November if the former first lady were the Democratic nominee.

"I toyed with voting for Kucinich, just to make a statement," Pegg said, referring to Ohio Rep. Dennis Kucinich, who trails nationally in polls.

Edwards, Barack Obama and Bill Richardson decided not to participate in Michigan's primary because the state Democratic Party's decision to hold a primary before Feb. 5 violates national party rules. The Democratic National Committee has threatened to not seat Michigan's delegates at the national convention, though state party officials say that won't happen.

Clinton isn't campaigning in Michigan, in deference to the national party rules. The others on the Democratic ballot are also-rans: Kucinich and Mike Gravel, who are campaigning, and Chris Dodd, who's already withdrawn from the race.

On Jan. 15, supporters of Obama and Edwards can stay home, choose from one of the Democrats on the ballot, vote "uncommitted" (with no guarantee their preferred candidate will receive delegates at the national convention in August), or vote in the Republican primary.

Sharon Brown, 54, who manages a trailer park in Farmington Hills, said the lack of choice on the Democratic ballot is un-American and unfair.

She wanted to vote for Obama or Edwards, and doesn't trust that her vote for "uncommitted" will mean anything.

"Why did they have to move the primary up?" Brown said. "I would like my voice to be heard, and it's not.
When do we blue-collar people get a chance to be heard? They're taking away our right as Americans to have a choice."

No contest means no-shows


Not only will they have little choice on the ballot, they won't get to see their candidates in the flesh. That could come back to haunt Democratic candidates later if Michigan voters feel shunned and lose enthusiasm for the eventual nominee.

snip-->

That was news to Ed Coe, 66, of Bloomfield Township. He obtained an absentee ballot to vote in his first Democratic primary -- he usually votes Republican -- and said he's impressed with Obama.

"If a person doesn't want to vote for Hillary, they don't have much choice," Coe said, adding that he doesn't like any of the Republican candidates.

"I may not vote under these circumstances."

More....
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Greeby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:05 AM
Response to Original message
1. So vote for Dennis
If you wanna get back at the Democratic Establishment, seems like a no-brainer
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #1
16. I will ... but the "Dems" have flipped the bird at Michigan voters.
I see it as a struggle between the DLC and DNC ... and the RESULT will be a shift of about 2-4% of the votes to the right in the GE in November.

Michigan has suffered the most from the off-shoring and cheap labor policies of the GOP. Engler was a disaster. Smirk and Sneer are and abomination. Nonetheless, the dominionists and raygun-dems will smear and sneer and the state will give a big "fuck you" to a party that "Don't Care What You Think" by a reduced GOTV and "what's the use?" suppression of turnout in November.

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cyclezealot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:13 AM
Response to Original message
2. My candidate Dennis Kucinich is coming to Mich.
Any doubt this nominating process is a flawed process. O'Bama has already spent 100 million and we have only surpassed Iowa. It used to take 100 million for all the primaries. Its not a political campaign Its a pr campaign. Don't worry Mi. The candidates think Michigan unimportant. They spent all of their piggy bank in Iowa and New Hampshire. They have no cash to splurge on Michigan Democrats. Gotta save those buck for the big enchinilada, California. One way or the other, Michigan gets screwed. Might as well be a rogue state, since its unimportant anyway.
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:19 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. The rest aren't going due to the DNC Rhulez!!!
I think it sucks! They have a choice between Clinton or Kucinich.

I know what'd I do but they should have a choice anyway!

Their primary is in 8 days!! Jan. 15th!
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cyclezealot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:36 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. So much emphasis is placed on so few states.
We need rogue states to say enough is enough. Why should Iowa get 50 million dollars dumped on its media while Michigan is and will be given zilch in future years. Take pride in yourselves Michigan Democras, maybe your rebelious nature will make the nominating process more democratic in future years. I think Kucinich's coming to Michigan is in support of its being the most ravaged by Nafta and technically he is coming to Michigan to speak to issues and not 'campaign.' Even if he were to come to campaign, good for him. The press' treatment of him. Screw em all.
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adadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:00 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. Exactly
After Iowa the two candidates I supported are out.
My choices are limited now...to the point I don't feeling like bothering to vote in the Michigan primary.

I'll volunteer on that day for our local Dem party as I always do but I'm not really sure if I'll vote.

By voting uncommitted I'm turning my vote over to a unknown delegate.
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:04 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Vote for Kucinich!!
;)

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ClintonTyree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:31 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Maybe they should have played by the rules that they agreed to?
Same as Florida. They agree to the rules about the primaries but then get their panties in a bunch when they break those rules and are sanctioned for it. Democratic State party officials have no one to blame but themselves for this fiasco.

I'm in complete agreement with many other Democrats that Iowa and New Hampshire should not be given the first primaries (caucuses) every Presidential election cycle. But they agreed to the rules, as everyone else did, and now want to change those rules on the fly and not pay any penalty for it. That's complete bullshit. Without rules we have chaos, and chaos doesn't get Democrats elected. Get the rules changed, but don't ignore and break them, then cry about it and tell everyone how badly they're being treated.

Just sayin'.
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:36 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. A necessary evil says Sen. Carl Levin & Debbie Dingell
A necessary evil

Michigan Democratic Party Chairman Mark Brewer said this year's presidential primary is a painful but necessary tribulation to bring national attention to the unfairness of the primary process.

Michigan Democrats, led by U.S. Sen. Carl Levin and national committee woman Debbie Dingell, have long complained of a warped nominating process in which Iowa and New Hampshire -- small, non-industrial states -- set the tone for the presidential election every four years.

Michigan Democrats attempted to schedule their primary ahead of both Iowa and New Hampshire, but those states moved their voting even earlier in response. The national Democratic Party ruled that Michigan would lose its delegates to the national convention for violating the rules.

"Other states are now saying what we've been saying for some time, that it's unfair they always get to go first," Brewer said. "We've attracted a lot of attention to the system. It's short-term pain for what we hope will be long-term reform."

The national Republican Party also penalized the Michigan GOP for moving its primary to Jan. 15, reducing the state's national convention delegates by half. But the candidates have not been pressured to avoid the state.
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Tyler Durden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:55 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. MAYBE it just shows the irrelavence of the modern political party.
Perhaps it's time for the death of the modern political party as we know it.

I don't seem to see where the DLC represents THE PEOPLE who actually make up the party anymore, especially in Michigan.
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 07:54 AM
Response to Original message
8. The entire electoral process
is leading many people to feel left out and apathetic. It sucks.
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book_worm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:08 AM
Response to Original message
11. turnout will be lousy and uncommitted will probably win
too bad. I think it's a shame and could hurt dems in November in Michigan.
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 10:23 AM
Response to Original message
12. I am voting UNCOMMITED
if Hillary can't win a state when she is the only frontrunner on the ballot, that would send a nice message.
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radfringe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-08-08 06:29 AM
Response to Reply #12
24. from The GreenPapers:
The 12 December 2007 Voter Guide published by the Democratic Party states:

"A vote for "uncommitted" is a vote to send delegates to the Democratic National Convention who are not committed or pledged to any candidate. Those delegates can vote for any candidate they choose at the Convention. Supporters of Joe Biden, John Edwards, Barack Obama and Bill Richardson are urged to vote "uncommitted" instead of writing in their candidates' names because write-in votes for those candidates will not be counted.
from The GreenPapers: http://www.thegreenpapers.com/P08/MI-D.phtml
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Iggo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
13. I'm wondering what else is on the ballot.
I know here in California, and I assume elsewhere, there are propositions and initiatives to be voted upon, not just the party primaries. I'm wondering who wins, and what do they win, if the Democratic voters stay home on election day?

Just curious.
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Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
14. Is it too late to reschedule?
Seems to me a later primary with good results would be better than an early one that's meaningless.

It's NASCAR on bicycles, Halloween with no costumes and Miss America without swimsuits.

Actually, Miss America without swimsuits sounds appealing. :rofl:

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Greeby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Don't they do those down in Jamaica?
;)
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #14
21. That opening line cracked me up too!
:P

I like it!!
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
17. Smart move by Hillary, she's got one state locked up!
:eyes:
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. Funny 'bout that, huh? A state that's RIPE for Obama ... and Hillary is the sole "major" name.
Senator Hillary Clinton - a DLC Democrat. Governor Jennifer Granholm - a DLC Democrat. Senator Debbie Stabenow - a DLC Democrat.

Just WHO does anyone suppose the metro Detroit Democrats (represented by Dingell, Cheeks-Kilpatrick, and Conyers) would have voted for??

The rest of the Downriver and Macomb County Democrats would have turned out primarily for Edwards ... for sure, I think.

Southfield, Farmington Hills, Birminghanm/Bloomfield ... the Democrats there are mostly Clintonistas. But there ain't enough of them to take the primary. So ... we don't get one.

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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. Hi Tahiti!
How's everything? Sorry you are marginalized in MI, but then again, so are most of the rest of us. :eyes:

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blogslut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:56 AM
Response to Original message
19. Maybe Dennis will win this one
Wouldn't that be a hoot? :)
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. That's what everyone in Michigan should do!! - Vote for Kucinich! He'll be there in a few days!
Thursday, January 10, 2008

Westland, MI - Lunch With Dennis Kucinich (1:00PM - 2:30PM)

Troy, MI - Talk And Q&A With Dennis (7:00PM - 9:00PM)


Friday, January 11, 2008

Detroit, MI -Presentation And Rally With Kucinich And Conyers (7:00PM - 8:30PM)


Sunday, January 13, 2008

Livonia, MI - Dennis At Justice Caucus Fund Raising Dinner (6:00PM - 7:00PM)


Monday, January 14, 2008

Ann Arbor, MI - Rally And Presentation With Congressman Kucinich (2:30PM - 4:00PM)

Harper Woods, MI - Talk And Q&A With Dennis (7:00PM - 9:00PM)


Thursday, January 24, 2008

South Carolina - Details TBA - Dennis In Congressional Black Caucus Democratic Debate (7:00PM)


Tuesday, January 29, 2008

New York, NY - Amy Goodman Interviews Dennis (8:00PM - 8:45PM)

http://www.dennis4president.com/index.php?option=com_jcalpro&Itemid=36&extmode=week&date=2008-01-27

http://www.dennis4president.com/home/

Kucinich the Surprise Winner in Virginia Dems Poll
http://www.dennis4president.com/go/homepage-items/kucinich-the-surprise-winner-in-virginia-dems-poll/

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cyclezealot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-08-08 06:10 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. want a fair interview seek out Amy Goodman
In depth. Not fluff like everywhere else. Hope the Kucinich / Goodman interview will be broadcast nationally.
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