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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:07 PM
Original message
Bushitler attacks Air Force and makes a history first.
"The California Air National Guard said this is first time in history that a single state's fighter wing is providing coverage for an entire coast."


F-15 grounding strains U.S. air defenses By SCOTT LINDLAW, Associated Press Writer
Wed Dec 26, 4:00 PM ET



FRESNO, Calif. - The grounding of hundreds of F-15s because of dangerous structural defects is straining the nation's air defense network, forcing some states to rely on their neighbors' fighter jets for protection, and Alaska to depend on the Canadian military.

The F-15 is the sole fighter at many of the 16 or so "alert" sites around the country, where planes and pilots stand ready to take off at a moment's notice to intercept hijacked airliners, Cessnas that wander into protected airspace, and other threats.

The Air Force grounded about 450 F-15s after one of the fighters began to break apart in the air and crashed Nov. 2 in Missouri. An Air Force investigation found "possible fleet-wide airworthiness problems" because of defects in the metal rails that hold the fuselage together. It is not clear when the F-15s will be allowed to fly again.

Compounding the problem created by the grounding, another fighter jet used for homeland defense, the F-16, is in high demand for Iraq operations. And the next-generation fighter, the F-22 Raptor, is only slowly replacing the aging F-15.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071226/ap_on_re_us/grounded_f15s
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
1. the air force has been taken over by christofascists - doing god's work with fewer planes nt
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:11 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. With no fucking planes.
:rofl:
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Thothmes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:14 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. No, 2 squdrons of F-22s are operational at Langley AFB
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:29 PM
Response to Original message
4. Remember what a breathless scandal it was?
At the 2000 Republican National Convention when then-candidate Geroge W. Bush said that two whole divisions of the Army would have to report "Not ready for duty, sir." Oh my! It was a scandal! And George W. Bush was going to set it all to right, by golly.

And now the West Coast, the only portion of our country to have ever sustained a foreign attack, is down to being defended by a single fighter wing. And we spend over a billion dollars a day, every day, on the defense budget. Thanks ever so much, Republicans, Supreme Court, George W. Bush, and our nation's selectively outraged media.
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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #4
13. The West Coast, the only portion to have ever sustained a foreign attack????
Pearl Harbor in NOT on the West Coast, neither is Dutch Harbor, Attu or Kiska (All in Alaska). All were attacked during the early days of US involvement in WWII.

You did NOT restrict your claim to the West coast, so we have to Include the Attacks on the City of Baltimore, Washington and New Orleans in the last year of the War of 1812 (And lets us not forget the British attack to take Detroit in the early years of that War AND the British attack across the Niagara River into upper New York State). If we go back to the Revolution the whole east Coast came under British attack (And don't give that we were a British Colony, by 1700 we were viewed as a separate country, with just strong ties with England, not controlled by England). If we go back to the French and Indian wars, the French attacked Pittsburgh, and various towns in right in now the Appalachian Mountains.

My point is except for maybe the Mississippi Valley (and even that came under attack during the Revolution by the British, but they attack were mostly along the Ohio), most of the US has been subject to a possible attack (lets us NOT forget Villa raid across the Border into the Southwest).

Now realistically, why do we need to have air protection on the West Coast? Soviet Aircraft must be flying along that coast just waiting to make a secret attack (Very Secret since the Soviet Union DIED in 1989). Is Mexico (or Canada) going to launch some sort of Secret Attack from the Pacific (so to confuse us that the Plane did not come from Canada or Mexico)? Will some Central American canoes sneak up along the Mexican seacoast to launch an attack on California? I doubt it, and even if they did would it NOT be cheaper to leaver them do it and retaliate against them if and when they did it? My point is the Countries that can attack us on the West Coast will lose more than they will gain by any such attack so why have ANY planes up? It is just a waste of taxpayers dollars.

Remember 9/11? The Planes used in that attack were NOT attacked by US Jets for the reasons the fighters Jets, when they heard of the attack, went on they pre-planned defense maneuver, out to sea to intercept non-existing Soviet Bombers. The threat that did hit us, was internal and even if the Passenger Planes were located by the Fighters, what could the Fighters have done? Until the First Passenger plane hit the Building no one knew what the plan of the Hijackers were. in the past Hijackers landed the plane and demanded some sort of ransom. Thus no order to shoot them down would have occurred, even if the Fighters were near the Passenger Planes (Which they were NOT). The better policy would be to leave the passengers try to take over the plane as what happen on the last plane flying.

Has another 9/11 occurred? No, has it even been attended? No. Would it work today? No, the passengers would revolt to save themselves, which is better policy than shooting down the planes.

My point even in 9/11 our Fighter Defense is worthless. It is set up for a non-existing threat (The old Soviet Air Force). It is right up there with me keeping an elephant gun lock and loaded, in case an elephant attacks me in the inner city. Could it happen? yes, will it happen? I am 99.99% sure it will NOT. Will our fighters prevent an attack from outside the US? NO, it is to thin (and that was known in Cold War Days) to stop most possible attacks, and the possibility of an attack it can defeat is so small it would be better for the US to take the possible hit, it would be cheaper in the long run.

Now the Gulf of Mexico is different, we have an anti-American Country known as Cuba. It has the ability to launch some sort of Air Attack against US targets, but again why would it? As soon as the Attack would start, the US would retaliate and do ten times the damage. Cubans may like Castro, but even the Cubans would view such an attack as stupid (as would Castro).

The US controls Iceland and the Azores, so any attack from across the Atlantic will either be by Carriers or in ln-flight refueled bombers. Britain and France could do this, both have Carriers and both have in-flight refueling Capability. What would ether gain? Nothing, and thus no such attack will occur. Russia has a very limited ability to do this, and will have a rough time getting back to what the old Soviet Union could have done before it went broke (You can NOT spend 30% of your GDP on Defense without going broke, which is what the Soviet Union did). Can the Russian launch such an attack? Maybe. Will it? Why? Russia better weapon is cut off fuel to Europe and force Europe to ask American to stop whatever is making the Russians mad AND drive up the price of Oil, do to Europe's greater ability to outbid the US for what other oil is being pumped in the world.

My point is I can just drop ALL Air Defense flights and Patrols. We gain very little safety from them and a huge cost in Planes, men and oil. Just drop them and rely on the Coast Guard to watch to drug Smugglers and other REAL threats to the US.
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:33 PM
Response to Original message
5. Well they can't keep NORAD open or pay people to mow the lawn.
Edited on Wed Dec-26-07 09:33 PM by Rex
They can't tell you when NK detonates their first nuke. They have no idea what to do with Bush or his boss, Dick Cheney.

You can only close down so much to save money, to send money to Iraq. And Bush always wants more money.

Not one military person can say Bush is a criminal or traitor. To busy trying to stay alive in Iraq/Afghanistan.

:mad:
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. 555 billion
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. They should have stopped this shit back when army hammers were 20 dollars
under Reagan. This is a direct result of the Military Industrial Complex collaborating with key Politicos and the ultra wealthy.

What could you do with 555 billion dollars if spent on domestic issues? One can only guess.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
7. They are slowly shutting down the air defense mechanism to set up another
"terrorist attack" on our Country. Little does the complicit media know, but they are being set up also. Once this "attack" happens, they'll be able to point to internet, newspaper and TV accounts of the grounded planes and say that "that's how information was gathered by the terrorists to plan their attack" and they'll shut down the internet and all but their own handpicked, Carlyle Group owned media conglomerates.

Yeah, I have my tinfoil hat on....

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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Had the same chilly affect on me too.
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Cessna Invesco Palin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 10:11 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. You guys say that EVERY SINGLE TIME...
...there's a grounding or any other kind of problem in the Air Force. Put down the bong.
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Nailzberg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
8. First time in history that a single state's fighter wing is providing coverage for an entire coast
Edited on Wed Dec-26-07 09:47 PM by Nailzberg
Maybe, but how much of that coast does CA take up? California can manage it until the eagles get cleared to fly again. (I thought they already cleared them, shows what I know)

edit: I was partially correct, the F15e has been returned to service.
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Hekate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-26-07 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
11. Just out of curiosity, are they still being serviced in the US?
Or has this job been outsourced to the lowest bidder overseas as well?

This is not good.

Hekate

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