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The Straight Story Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 02:17 PM
Original message
What I learned from DU this year.....
We are all suspects and people want to control us.

(Add your own please cause I know I missed a bunch)

Police getting fingerprints from people for traffic violations/etc
Surveillance of your phone calls
and emails
and postings/credit card transactions/etc

Piss off someone, onto no fly list
or they search you a lot more at least

Habeas Corpus - we knew thee well

What you eat, smoke, how you live can factor into whether or not you keep your job or get one (remember the Scott's company telling people they would fire them for smoking at home, et al?)

I could go on all day - add your own.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
1. I learned that Blackwater is the perfect expression of the Bush presidency
and H20 Man helped me figure that out. :)
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Perry Logan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
2. Our rights now exist at the discretion of various Federal officials.
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no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
3. * may have been right: If not protected, the Constitution is nothing more
than a "god damned piece of paper".
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
4. That the excuse of 'corporate personhood' that has been used to undermine
our country is no more that a myth. DU put me onto this.

<snip>
Far more remarkable, however, is that the doctrine of corporate personhood, which subsequently became a cornerstone of corporate law, was introduced into this 1886 decision without argument. According to the official case record, Supreme Court Justice Morrison Remick Waite simply pronounced before the beginning of arguement in the case of Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad Company that

The court does not wish to hear argument on the question whether the provision in the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution, which forbids a State to deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws, applies to these corporations. We are all of opinion that it does.
The court reporter duly entered into the summary record of the Court's findings that
The defendant Corporations are persons within the intent of the clause in section 1 of the Fourteen Amendment to the Constitution of the United States, which forbids a State to deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
Thus it was that a two-sentence assertion by a single judge elevated corporations to the status of persons under the law, prepared the way for the rise of global corporate rule, and thereby changed the course of history.
The doctrine of corporate personhood creates an interesting legal contradiction. The corporation is owned by its shareholders and is therefore their property. If it is also a legal person, then it is a person owned by others and thus exists in a condition of slavery -- a status explicitly forbidden by the Thirteenth Amendment to the Constitution. So is a corporation a person illegally held in servitude by its shareholders? Or is it a person who enjoys the rights of personhood that take precedence over the presumed ownership rights of its shareholders? So far as I have been able to determine, this contradiction has not been directly addressed by the courts.
This file is mirrored from: http://laws.findlaw.com/us/118/394.html

http://www.ratical.org/corporations/SCvSPR1886.html


<snip>

Editor's notes: There has been much misunderstanding about this Court decision. Despite the issue being raised in arguments, the Justices offered no written opinion on the question of whether corporations should be considered "persons" and enjoy the protections of the 14th Amendment. The Court reporter's notes, however, quoted Chief Justice Waite declaring that, "We all are of the opinion" that the 14th Amendement applies to corporations.
Many people (rightfully) are outraged that a Court reporter could turn the Bill of Rights and 14th Amendment on their heads, which effectively is what occured once Santa Clara was cited as precedent in subsequent cases. However, the fact that the Justices never issued an opinion on "corporate personhood" lost its legal significance once they cited the case.
Court reporter's notes:
The defendant Corporations are persons within the intent of the clause in Section 1 of the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States, which forbids a State to deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Under the constitution and laws of California, relating to taxation, fences created upon the line between the roadway of a railroad and the land of coterminous proprietors are not part of "the roadway," to be included by the State Board in its valuation of the property of the corporation, but are "improvements" assessable by the local authorities of the proper county.

An assessment of a tax is invalid, and will not support an action for the recovery of the tax, if, being laid upon different kinds of property as a unit, it includes property not legally assessable, and if the part of the tax assessed upon the latter property cannot be separated from the other part of it.

The State Board of Equalization of California were required by law, to assess the franchise, roadway, &c., of all railroads operated in more than one county and apportion the same to the different counties in proportion to the number of miles of railway in each. They made such assessment of the Southern Pacific Railroad, improperly including therein the fences between the roadway and the coterminous proprietor, and apportioned it and returned it as required to the different counties. In a suit by one of the counties to recover its proportion of the tax levied in accordance with such apportionment and return, the court below, at the trial, found that "said fences were valued at $800 per mile," which was the only finding on the subject; and it did not appear that the county, plaintiff, offered to take judgment for a sum excluding the rate on the value of the fences within the county at that valuation.

Held, (1) That the finding was too vague and indefinite to serve as a basis for estimating the aggregate valuation of the fences included in the assessment, or the amount thereof apportioned to the respective counties; (9) That, under the circumstances, the court could not assume that the State Board included the fences in their assessment at the rate of $800 per mile for every mile of the railroad within the State, counting one or both sides of the roadway; and could no"., after eliminating that amount from the assessment, give judgment for the balance of the tax, if any.

These actions, which were argued together, were brought to recover unpaid' taxes assessed against the several railroad corporations, defendants, under the laws of the State of California. The main - almost the only - questions discussed by counsel in the elaborate arguments related to the constitutionality of the taxes. This court, in its opinion passed by these questions, and decided the cases upon the questions whether under the constitution and laws of California, the fences on the line of the railroads should have been valued and assessed, if at all, by the local officers, or by the State Board of Equalization; whether, on the record, the assessments and. taxation upon the fences are separable from the rest of the assessment and taxation; and what was the effect of the record upon the rights of the State and the county.

One of the points made and discussed at length in the brief of counsel for defendants in error was that "Corporations are persons within the meaning of the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States." Before argument

MR. CHIEF JUSTICE WAITE said: The court does not wish to hear argument on the question whether the provision in the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution, which forbids a State to deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws, applies to these corporations. We are all of opinion that it does.

http://reclaimdemocracy.org/personhood/santa_clara_vs_s...

<snip>

The provision of the laws of the Constitution and the laws of California…are in violation of the Fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution, in so far as they require the assessment of their property at its full money value, without making deduction as in the case of railroads that are operated in only one county, and of other corporations, and of natural persons, for the value of the mortgages…

The Court found for the railroad. The Supreme Court Reporter, J. C. Bancroft Davis, wrote in the headnotes the following:

The defendant Corporations are persons within the intent of the clause in section I of the Fourteenth amendment to the Constitution of the United States which forbids a state to deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the law.the main – and almost only – questions discussed by counsel in the elaborate arguments related to the constitutionality of the taxes. This court, in its opinion passed by these questions, and decided the cases on the questions whether under the constitution and the laws of California, the fences on the line of the railroads should have been valued and assessed, if at all, by the local officers or by the State Board of Equalization…. One of the points made and discussed at length in the brief of counsel for defendants in error was that ‘Corporations are persons within the meaning of the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States.’

The actual decision delivered by Justice Harlan begins by stating explicitly that the Supreme Court is not, in this case, ruling on the Constitutional question of corporate personhood under the Fourteenth Amendment or any other amendment.

http://www.authorsden.com/visit/viewarticle.asp?id=2912...

<snip>

That, however, wasn't the end of it. Corporations had a lot of money and a lot at stake, and they took case after case to court. In 1886, corporations gained a victory. Before the Supreme Court session to announce the decision in the case Santa Clara v. Southern Pacific Railroad, Chief Justice Waite said that the court wouldn't hear arguments on whether the Fourteenth Amendment clause on equal protection applied to corporations; they all believed that it did.

The case was decided on other grounds. But, the principle that corporations have Fourteenth Amendment rights was inserted by the Supreme Court reporter in a header in the published report of the case. A couple of years later, in the case Minneapolis & St. Louis Railroad v. Beckwith (1889), the Court cited the Santa Clara case as the precedent for corporations having due process and equal protection under the Fourteenth Amendment. With that, corporations became legal persons in the United States, and gained the ability to challenge in federal court regulatory actions at the state level.

http://multinationalmonitor.org/mm2002/02oct-nov/oct-no...





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warren pease Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 02:40 PM
Response to Original message
5. The iron fist is showing through the velvet glove...
When HR 1955/SB 1959 is signed into law, I expect "them" to start rounding up the usual suspects.

This one is the final brick in the wall that was built starting with the patriot acts, the MCA, various executive orders and presidential directives, total domestic surveillance -- including retargeting spy satellites to snoop on Americans, hiring a bunch of new TSA "behavior detection officers" to spot those who don't "look quite right," various watch lists, alleged detention camps courtesy of Halliburton, all this wonderful new stuff the DHS has in store for us... all that and rendition and torture, too. Oh my.

If you read nothing else above, have a look at that final link to a DHS news release proclaiming that a great new era of domestic surveillance has arrived. And don't forget: NINE ELEVEN CHANGED EVERYTHING...

Either we're sitting right on the cusp of some very, very bad times, or I've become one of those raving paranoid loons I used to laugh at. Personally, I think the evidence is overwhelming that all the infrastructure is in place for a massive crack-down. It simply hasn't been activated yet.


wp
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. And this is how the French Resistance came into being.....
If we are ever able to stop the bullshit....We MUST...We are OBLIGATED to pursue and prosecute the * admninstration and all that were in on 9/11 and the War Profiteering for Treason......

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warren pease Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. I'd prefer it didn't get that far...
I'd rather squash the criminal bastards before the national security state is fully operational, rather than have to fight them as an underground resistance movement. Which is why I'm so goddamn pissed at this faux opposition party and its craven/complicit/corrupt alliances with the white house, to the detriment of the people, the republic and the Constitution.

I hope I never see Pelosi floating another lame excuse for the inexcusable, or Reid fighting his own party so he can cave once again to the white house, or Hoyer trying to kill Kucinich's articles of impeachment, or Conyers burying HR 333 under a pile of paper, or Clinton parroting the business party line taught to her by the $90 million in corporate bribes she's taken since the first of the year. Sadly, I expect to see and hear this same old garbage until every single alleged democratic leader, along with every single blue dog DINO taking up much needed space in congress.

And this is why I detest this particular pack of compromised democratic "leaders" above all their predecessors. They're obvious collaborators; simple as that. As a party badly in need of credibility, they had nothing to lose and much to gain by impeaching, sitting on war funding bills, cutting BushCo off at the wallet, contesting every single thing the bastards pulled and then shouting their reasons at the top of their lungs.

Instead, we get Reid fighting for telecom immunity, zero accountability for any of BushCo's made men, near unanimous passage of every single domestic repression bill that slithers its way from the white house, and a bottomless treasure chest of borrowed money to support BushCo's imperialist blood lust.

All this only makes sense if they're all in it together, if they're all members of the same exclusive club and if they've all been completely corrupted by corporate bribery. I suggest the evidence for that view is pretty strong. Like all great cons, you'll never be able to actually prove it. But what's been happening doesn't pass the smell test unless you expand the parameters of acceptable analysis.


wp
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. I agree with you I want to stop it before it gets that far..
Here is the interesting thing...

What is the one thing that set us along this path of the "Imperial King" bullshit.

We can point to one moment in American History...the lack of prosecution of Nixon, Cheney, Rumsfeld and all of the others that were involved in the Watergate fiasco. Think about it...all of the major players that were there are now involved in what's happening to our country.

When it comes down to it we the American people cannot let Congress (our Democratic Congress) punk out and say well it's best for the nation if we don't prosecute. (That's how we got into this mess in the first place)

No it's the exact opposite it is in the best interest of America to prosecute these Treasonous bastards to show Americans and the world that we will not stand for this tyranny foisted upon our country.
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theredpen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
8. The DU cynics "What I have learned"
I learned that I am stupid and evil for following the teachings of someone whose main rule for life is "love one another as you love yourselves." Apparently, "science" has proven that "love one another as you love yourselves" is "superstitious nonsense." I'm having difficulty understanding this, because — as I've learned — I know nothing about science. I'm on the verge of asking MIT to refund all the money I spent on that degree.

I learned that I'm a homophobe because I don't hate Barack Obama. This is ironic because I'm a racist for not hating Ron Paul.

I learned that not finding anything wrong with pornography means that I hate women, even if I were to like pornography with no women in it. Again, I don't understand this, but I suspect it's because I'm stupid — and sexist.

I really didn't expect to find people on DU who were homophobic, racist, sexist and stupid, but I was even more surprised to find that I was one of those people. Worse yet, most of us seem to have at least one of these shortcomings, at least according to others.

Merry Christmas.
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rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-24-07 05:29 PM
Response to Original message
9. I learned Guitar Hero II sucks.
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