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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:18 AM
Original message
Lakota Indians secede from US
X-post from Native American Group

Treaties 'merely worthless words on paper.' No longer US citizens.
http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Descendants_of_Sitting_Bull_Crazy_Horse_1220.html

Descendants of Sitting Bull, Crazy Horse break away from US

The Lakota Indians, who gave the world legendary warriors Sitting Bull and Crazy Horse, have withdrawn from treaties with the United States, leaders said Wednesday.

"We are no longer citizens of the United States of America and all those who live in the five-state area that encompasses our country are free to join us," long-time Indian rights activist Russell Means told a handful of reporters and a delegation from the Bolivian embassy, gathered in a church in a run-down neighborhood of Washington for a news conference.

A delegation of Lakota leaders delivered a message to the State Department on Monday, announcing they were unilaterally withdrawing from treaties they signed with the federal government of the United States, some of them more than 150 years old.

They also visited the Bolivian, Chilean, South African and Venezuelan embassies, and will continue on their diplomatic mission and take it overseas in the coming weeks and months, they told the news conference.

Lakota country includes parts of the states of Nebraska, South Dakota, North Dakota, Montana and Wyoming.

The new country would issue its own passports and driving licences, and living there would be tax-free -- provided residents renounce their US citizenship, Means said.

The treaties signed with the United States are merely "worthless words on worthless paper," the Lakota freedom activists say on their website.

The treaties have been "repeatedly violated in order to steal our culture, our land and our ability to maintain our way of life," the reborn freedom movement says.

Withdrawing from the treaties was entirely legal, Means said.

"This is according to the laws of the United States, specifically article six of the constitution," which states that treaties are the supreme law of the land, he said.

"It is also within the laws on treaties passed at the Vienna Convention and put into effect by the US and the rest of the international community in 1980. We are legally within our rights to be free and independent," said Means.

The Lakota relaunched their journey to freedom in 1974, when they drafted a declaration of continuing independence -- an overt play on the title of the United States' Declaration of Independence from England.

Thirty-three years have elapsed since then because "it takes critical mass to combat colonialism and we wanted to make sure that all our ducks were in a row," Means said.

One duck moved into place in September, when the United Nations adopted a non-binding declaration on the rights of indigenous peoples -- despite opposition from the United States, which said it clashed with its own laws.

"We have 33 treaties with the United States that they have not lived by. They continue to take our land, our water, our children," Phyllis Young, who helped organize the first international conference on indigenous rights in Geneva in 1977, told the news conference.

The US "annexation" of native American land has resulted in once proud tribes such as the Lakota becoming mere "facsimiles of white people," said Means.

Oppression at the hands of the US government has taken its toll on the Lakota, whose men have one of the shortest life expectancies -- less than 44 years -- in the world.

Lakota teen suicides are 150 percent above the norm for the United States; infant mortality is five times higher than the US average; and unemployment is rife, according to the Lakota freedom movement's website.

"Our people want to live, not just survive or crawl and be mascots," said Young.

"We are not trying to embarrass the United States. We are here to continue the struggle for our children and grandchildren," she said, predicting that the battle would not be won in her lifetime.
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glowing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
1. So, what are going to do?
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Elspeth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
2. How much casino money are the state governments demanding from them?
?
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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. it has nothing to do with casinos. It has everything to do with failure to live up to 150 years...
of treaties that are constantly broken to this very day.
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skooooo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. But in reality what does it mean?

Sure its symbolic, but do they have some kind of plan of what they will do?
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Goblinmonger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. I doubt
they just hopped in their car and drove to DC without at least thinking this through a little bit.
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skooooo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Well....

...more power to them. I don't blame them a bit.
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Goblinmonger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. they should now take the case of Leonard Peltier to the UN
I was seriously pissed that Clinton didn't pardon him give the load of crappy pardons he issued on his way out.
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stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #9
15. I can't believe he's still in the slammer.
Some justice system we have.
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pscot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #4
11. It may be symbolic
but it's not so different from the Basques or the Kurds demanding autonomy. Ideas have consequences and irridentism is a powerful idea.
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skooooo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. hadn't thought of it that way!

I wonder if other tribes will follow suit?? Interesting.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #4
30. This might help.
http://www.rapidcityjournal.com/articles/2007/12/20/news/top/doc476a99630633e335271152.txt
...The move to form an independent nation will focus on property rights in a five-state area where the treaties in question were drawn up. The states include South Dakota, North Dakota, Nebraska, Wyoming and Montana – areas that the group say have been illegally homesteaded for years despite knowledge of Lakota as the historic owners.

If the U.S. government does not immediately enter into diplomatic negotiations, the group said in a news release, liens will be filed on real-estate transactions across the region -- an action it says could cloud title issues over thousands of square miles of land and property....
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Goblinmonger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. I might be taking this the wrong way
but that kind of smacks of bigotry.

Have you been to the Lakota reservations in ND and SD? It ain't pretty and the government isn't helping it one bit. They've been screwed pretty badly.
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demnan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:42 AM
Response to Original message
5. Can I join?
I'm ready to leave and I'm tired of paying taxes for Bush's corporate wars. Good for them for setting up their own autonomous state.
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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:54 AM
Response to Reply #5
12. I would like to join as well....nt
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #5
27. ...
:thumbsup:
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
10. Who can blame them?
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ORDagnabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
14. AWESOME!!! now get the other native nations and vermont!!!!
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #14
32. It is AWESOME!
I always relate to the Indians/Native Americans and now this! YAY!
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
16. any guess at how the Bushies will respond to this?
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Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #16
31. Bet they call 'em terrorists before this goes too far
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-21-07 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #16
47. since most of them vote Dem in SD
Bush will probably be all for it.
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 12:10 PM
Response to Original message
17. Sadly, this comes too late to save "Mt. Rushmore" from the desecration by the invaders.
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MorningGlow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
18. Will they allow immigrants?
I have skills! Pick me! Pick me! :hi:
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #18
29. I bet they don't, and they've just given Bushco an excuse
to exclude them from the rest of the U.S.

Or require visas (which will be denied).

They could exclude Americans but they might need to allow visitors to come into the casinos.

So while it's only symbolic, they must know that, or it would hurt their own interests to actually live by it.
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stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
19. When I read the 5th paragraph of the rawstory article
I got an earworm of ". . .Movin' to Montana soon. . ."

Then it occurred to me that it could be construed that Cheney would be under their jurisdiction.

Now that would truly qualify as revenge of the quails.
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B Calm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 12:18 PM
Response to Original message
20. Does this mean the US government will declare war against them?
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Orwellian_Ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. The war
has never stopped.

K&R
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K Gardner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #21
28. Exactly.. its a long and bloody history of genocide against an entire race of people.
Just not so much blood now. They've found easier ways to marginalize and destroy the Indian culture.
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IDemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:34 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. They are occupying an energy rich region, so.... n/t
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
22. From Rapid City (SD) interesting bit about liens and WHAT they are planning.
Edited on Thu Dec-20-07 01:15 PM by uppityperson
http://www.rapidcityjournal.com/articles/2007/12/20/news/top/doc476a99630633e335271152.txt
...The move to form an independent nation will focus on property rights in a five-state area where the treaties in question were drawn up. The states include South Dakota, North Dakota, Nebraska, Wyoming and Montana – areas that the group say have been illegally homesteaded for years despite knowledge of Lakota as the historic owners.

If the U.S. government does not immediately enter into diplomatic negotiations, the group said in a news release, liens will be filed on real-estate transactions across the region -- an action it says could cloud title issues over thousands of square miles of land and property....
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #22
34. That might start some
wars, right there.
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IA_Seth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
23. Now is the time for this!
I hope this takes hold.
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greyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:35 PM
Response to Original message
25. I love it. Too bad it had to come to this. nt
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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
26. May the Wind lift their wings...
The American Indians of all tribes should have been treated as the sovereign nations they are.

They have been patient for too long.

I'm in full support of my Brothers and Sisters!
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Didereaux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 01:58 PM
Response to Original message
33. Russell Means is the Jesse Jackson of Indians ...a leech, nothing more
that bastard has been stealing from his own 'people' his entire life...that is his career. Do not be suckered into this crap. If you seriously are concerned with the American Indians plight contact the various tribal councils DIRECTLY! And for christs sake don't go quoting anything Means has said, you'll likely trigger PTSD in one or more and get your hair trimmed below skin level.

experience speaking here folks, listen up!
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Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. Cute: "and get your hair trimmed below skin level"
I'm not defending Means, although he's not more of a demogogue than the majority of politicians in Washington who he's railing against. But the suggestion that Indians who get mad at you will scalp you is a bit tacky. I think we've all should've evolved a bit over the past couple of centuries. Besides, as long as there aren't any Redcoats or French fur traders around paying anyone for scalps, I think we might just be able to have a discussion without exposing our skullcaps.
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Didereaux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #35
40. don't have to many American Indian friends around do you?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:57 PM
Response to Reply #33
45. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
frogmarch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
36. Russell Means is a rabble-rousing piece of shit.
Those here who think he's a worthy hero for Native Americans, the Lakota in particular, need to do some research and learn the truth about this lying, self-aggrandizing, mysogynistic, "the white-eyes are evil!" fuckwad.

As for Leonard Peltier, his ass is right where it belongs. He murdered two FBI agents and then ran away like a chicken-shit coward. He's never owned up to the murders, but when confronted with the evidence against him, he admitted shooting "at" the agents. Scumbag. I feel sorry for the families of these young agents, not for Peltier. The agents did not deserve to be riddled with bullets. They did not deserve to die.

Blaming the federal government for everything wrong on the Pine Ridge res, or any other NA res, is ridiculous. Much of what's wrong on reservations concerns corruption at the local level. The government handouts the Lakota receive are appreciated and put to good use by many Lakotans. Others prefer to join Means and fight against the white-eyes, which is like cutting off their own noses to spite their faces.

History is full of tales of the vanquished, but as far as I know, none but the Lakota have ever received, or continue to receive, recompensation for the sins of the vanquishers.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. yeah yeah yeah. And there were WMDs in Iraq.
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SpiralHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. And Christopher Columbus really did discover a new trade route to India
Just like he said he would...
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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #36
44. Reactionary garbage.
i don't even think it's worthy of the recycle bin.
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Kucinich4America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-21-07 12:02 AM
Response to Reply #36
46. Where the FUCK do you get your info from? FAUX Noize??
Leonard Peltier didn't murder anybody. What part of THE FUCKING BULLETS DIDN'T MATCH HIS GUN don't you understand??

I suppose you think Don Seigelman is guilty too?
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librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
38. yay, ya ta hey for my people!
Thank You!

Now where do I get an I-9?
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 05:39 PM
Response to Original message
41. All their accusations are true
Edited on Thu Dec-20-07 05:41 PM by malaise
Thou shall not steal should be deleted from the imperialist Xtians commandments. They don't only steal, but they've been stealing in the name of their god for eons.

Sp.
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SalmonChantedEvening Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 07:05 PM
Response to Original message
42. Time to stop all occupations, this oldest and worst 1st n/t
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-20-07 07:25 PM
Response to Original message
43. Will they take their joint and tendon drugs with them?
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