"An Unreasonable Man" on PBS now. Ralph Nader doc.

[Guaranteed]

Should be interesting.

[Occam Bandage]

1. That's putting it mildly.

[JeffR]

2. It was very good

and somehow a close-up portrait like this underscores just what an enigma Nader is.

[proud2BlibKansan]

3. Very interesting film

I watch Independent Lens every week and am never disappointed.

[babylonsister]

4. Watching here now. nt

[European Socialist]

5. Good show. I hope Edwards can get Nader back for the Dems.

[babylonsister]

6. Very informative as I wasn't paying attention so much in 2000,

though I knew who I didn't like. And I watched the votes from early November til December, and did feel like something was lost.

[Hidden Stillness]

7. A Great Documentary

This was a fabulous documentary; a very long range telling of Nader's career and great accomplishments, and the profoundly changing political and social country that eventually made it impossible for Nader's organized activism to even work. There was enough time given--with fabulous old film--to the auto safety/General Motors/Nader's Raiders/Congressional hearings era, so that you either remembered how much Nader has done, or will be taught a little about the huge accomplishments that went on for about a generation. Then the bleak Reagan years, when everything stopped, things were rolled back, there was no progress at all for anybody, there were lies, secret deals, think tanks arranging smear campaigns and obfuscation of issues, and the beginning of lobbyists, deregulation and strangling Government to death. Then the phony Clinton/"D"LC years, as corporate and retrograde as the Reagan dark age. This made the case for why Nader ended up so frustrated and at wits' end; remember what a corporate phony Al Gore was at that time, who refused to even meet with Nader to discuss issues. Nader eventually ended up with what might have seemed the only course available anymore, since there were no longer any Federal contacts, unlike the Carter years, helping consumer rights and all the rest along. The first run that most people remember, 2000, (remembering that Nader actually ran a largely ignored 1996 campaign), supported by such later hypocritical phonies as Michael ("Michigan? Where's Michigan?") Moore, and since.

This documentary was a great and very moving life story, from childhood, with great personal, and sometimes not very nice, revelations by Nader proteges such as Joan Claybrook--very evenhanded treatment of things, and great comments by Phil Donahue, etc. I did not vote for Nader, but will never criticize this great American and public servant. If Democrats had fought Republicans and corporate corruption, and done what the American people have been crying for, for a generation now, there never would have been a Third Party threat, from anywhere. They brought it on themselves, by their own corporate corruption, and their shutting everyone else out, like they were now "D"LC, Inc., and we are their distant but always reliable and servile "fans." Very moving documentary of a hugely complicated and important person, who has done so much for us all. Remember what Al "NAFTA" Gore was actually like then--not thrilling--and remember that Gore actually won the election by final count and had it stolen by Republican/Supreme Court plan, and return to a truer appreciation of Ralph Nader.

[burrowowl]

8. Good Show!

And had a Senator signed on the request by the Black Caucus (I cried as I watched on C-Span (I hoped Kennedy would sign), and if Gore (Liebermann so DLCer why?) had demanded a real recount (he did win in Florida) and if Kerry had demanded a real recount (Ohio), etc. Why were they such cravens or I hope to God not, corporate shills?

[Rageneau]

9. Regardless of his accomplishments, in the end Nader hurt America more than he helped.

People got on their knees and begged Nader to abandon his selfish, egotistic attempt to stir up the 2000 election. He stayed in the race, long after it became apparent he was hurting Gore bigtime.

Back then, Ralph insisted there was no difference between Bush and Gore.

Which is why I'll always believe that there is no difference between Bush and Nader.

[goodgd_yall]

11. Baloney

I think the documentary showed otherwise.

[Guaranteed]

12. I think there are pretty obvious differences between Bush and Nader.

Don't know if you watched the doc or not, but it was pretty damned good. Very balanced, gave strong arguments on all sides.

I think Nader understands the consequences of his actions very well. But I think Lawrence O'Donnell summed up where Nader is coming from the best: It is extremely difficult to change the Democratic Party from within the party. They won't listen to the "left" as long as the left has nowhere else to go. I think Nader understands this and, despite his understanding that he is really hurting the Democrats, and maybe even our country, is refusing to back down in the face of threats or bribes, or any other attacks against him because he sees his responsibility as going far beyond what might happen in the here and now. What he doesn't want to happen is to lose hope for future generations by giving the corporatists the opportunity to say, "Well, look at what happened to Nader before- we did such and such, and he went away. Let's not let our consciences worry us."

He IS unreasonable. He is rabid. He is far beyond thinking straight, it seems to me. But there is a reason for that- it is what he represents. He has to hold up that end up things, no matter the consequences- to him or to anyone. It's his responsibility.

Alterman called him a "Leninist" in that he comes from the perspective that things are going to have to get worse before they get better. I think Nader believes that. And things have certainly gone that way.

But I think things ARE going to get better- and they are.

[malaise]

14. Wow

I missed it. Hope they add the video here

http://www.pbs.org/independentlens/unreasonableman/?campaign=pbshomefeatures_3_independentlensbranunreasonableman_2007-12-19

[donheld]

13. Do you believe the 2000 and 2004 elections were stolen

or do you blame Ralphy?

[Richard Steele]

15. That's a fine point. Even with Nader in the race, Gore still won.

It was a narrow victory, but it was a victory.

The Supreme Court stole that election, not Nader.

[donheld]

16. You and I and a good share of DU know that but

It seems every time Nader is mentioned we shift the blame to him.

[TransitJohn]

17. yep

It's such a knee-jerk reaction, and really gets me.

[The Stranger]

19. Ralph Nader was right.

If Leiberman had been elected to Cheney's position, we would likely be in as bad (if not worse) a situation than we are now.

And with Pelosi with her back to the door holding back a tidal wave of the Democratic Base demanding accountability and that impeachment be taken off the table, and with the countless capitulations by the Democratic Congressional leadership to the GOP (wiretaps, war funding, torture, Mukasey, Iran, etc.), pulling the Democratic leadership ever farther away from their own political Base, it also appears Nader may have been right about other things as well.

That Nader is so hated by those with whom he shares a Progressive, Populist zeal (or at least they appear to share his Progressive, Populist zeal) is a fascinating story in itself.

[goodgd_yall]

10. Watching it now---very good source for recent political history

Really was good to be reminded of the good things Nader did. I had forgotten about his impact on auto safety.

Good overview of the change that happened beginning in the Reagan years.

[Stephanie]

18. I learned a lot of history from the film.

I had no idea about a lot of what Nader accomplished in those early years.

[Stephanie]

20. Eric Alterman is pissed off.

I can't believe he announces that he hasn't watched the film, then he proceeds to bitch about it >

http://mediamatters.org/altercation/200712180004

Thanks again, Ralph

I see the Ralph Nader documentary is being broadcast on PBS tonight. To be honest, I've never actually seen the thing. When it was screened at Sundance two years ago, it was about four hours long and when I got there, I did not think I could stand it, so I went back to my hotel room for two hours and came in for only the presidential races part. I used to admire what Ralph Nader had done for the country during his career as a consumer advocate, but I no longer do. One of the great mistakes liberals made in the 1970s was to try to win in the courts what they could not win at the ballot box -- thereby allowing their democratic muscles and instincts atrophy and helping to inspire a right-wing backlash against which they were defenseless -- and which now controls those same courts -- and Nader was the leader in this misbegotten movement.

[hiphopnation]

21. totally eye-opening

as a younger DUer there were things about the man that I never knew

this film has garnered a new respect for them an that i didn't know before. i admit, i was at one time one of the knee-jerk "blame nader first" crowd. it seemed like an easy way out to the other more difficult explanations of the 2000 election (election fraud, gore's poorly run campaign, etc.)

but wow, the guy is an admirable citizen and it's just amazing how fast people turned on him after 2000. the part about michael moore was particularly disturbing.

an excellent retrospective on the man that everyone should watch. enigma indeed

[AlCzervik]

22. i thought it was really good, flattering to Nader and unflattering to him.