Polk County, Florida: "Shaping children's minds to meet the demands of the 19th century."

[madfloridian]

Polk County, Florida: "Shaping children's minds to meet the demands of the 19th century."

That is a great sentence from a letter to the editor about what is going on in Florida. Here is more from that letter.

Now that in a majority sampling of the Polk County School Board has indicated that a biblical explanation or creation should be taught along with evolution in science classes, I would like to humbly suggest a few other minor changes in the county. First, let's change all the road signs coming into the county to read, 'Welcome to Polk County — turn your clocks back 100 years.' Second, let's have the school motto changed to say: 'Shaping children's minds to meet the demands of the 19th century.'

One has to wonder what has happened to the constitutional provision for the separation of church and state. I suppose the School Board will have to edit that out of civics classes just to be on the safe side.

Evolutionary change

I have been fascinated by the ongoing letters to the editors about the Florida Board of Education's decision to teach evolution, by that name, and not side by side with Creationism. The most stunning thing was finding out that the Polk County School Board in Central Florida, is NOT in favor of teaching evolution. This was covered well by The Ledger.

Central Florida School Board says don't teach evolution alone.

LAKELAND | A majority of Polk County School Board members say they support teaching intelligent design in addition to evolution in public schools.

Board members Tim Harris, Margaret Lofton and Hazel Sellers said they oppose proposed science standards for Florida schools that lists evolution and biological diversity as one of the "big ideas" that students need to know for a well-grounded science education.
Board member Kay Fields said last week she wants intelligent design, which is promoted by some Christian groups, taught in science classes in addition to evolution.

"If it ever comes to the board for a vote, I will vote against the teaching of evolution as part of the science curriculum," Lofton said. "If (evolution) is taught, I would want to balance it with the fact that we may live in a universe created by a supreme being as well."

Board members Frank O'Reilly and Brenda Reddout said they were unwilling to endorse intelligent design over evolution. Board member Lori Cunningham said she hasn't made up her mind.

Most of the letters have been supporting Intelligent Design, it seems. However the ones who are seeing the dangers have been getting their words in as well. Here is another who sees the dangers in turning the schools into a place to push religious doctrine.

Creation Theory = Dark Ages

In order to ban evolution from the classroom, creationists would have to ban all science. They would also have to live with the realization that they would thereby relegate our children to ignoramuses compared with students in other countries.

There was a time when scientists such as Galileo were considered heretics and were threatened with death for daring to assert, for example, that Earth moves around the sun. This black mark on our civilization is called the Dark Ages, and civilization did not pull out of it until the Enlightenment when scientific inquiry was again allowed free rein.

Creationists would take us back to those dark times by invoking religious authority to ban the promulgation of scientific discoveries. Heaven help us if they succeed.

We knew there would be battles, but I just assumed most people would understand the importance of not teaching religious concepts in public schools. I am learning differently.

I know some of the people who have been writing the letters against teaching evolution, and it really is a shock. They are educated enough to know the implications of this issue, but they are very supportive of a school board that is willing to take education backwards.

You know how the Bush administration accuses others of the very things they are doing in an effort to deflect blame from themselves? The anti-evolution people are doing the same thing.

They call the teaching of evolution a form of "indoctrination.". It is just like the group of creationists shown in HBO's video called Road Trip: Friends of God.

[BlueJazz]

1. I'm all for shipping these people off to a Mental Institution. I'm Serious.

These Folks are as Dangerous to Society (and it's well being) as a serial killer.

No Sarcasm here...I'm Serious...These are the very people that put this "Earth Destroying" administration into power.
They have absolutely no logical thinking in their lives... and go merrily on their way wreaking damage to this country.

[madfloridian]

2. It's embarrassing.

It really is. There is not much else to say about it. The school superintent is right there with them...she has been allowing the side by side teaching since she came here.

"Polk school Superintendent Gail McKinzie said she thinks evolution is a theory and intelligent design a belief.

The district, McKinzie said, will be forced to accept the new standards if the state Board of Education adopts them unless board members "want to make a court case out of it."

FORCED??

[Sancho]

3. Science isn't taught in Florida anyway!

Because of the FCAT, the time and $'s spent on anything except for drilling and practice testing for Florida Writes and reading and math is minimal. The number of certified science teachers has been a crisis for decades. The curriculum doesn't matter much.

They could vote to teach Hebrew with about as much effect.

[Sancho]

4. Links to my post for example...this is enough

Teachers Currently Teaching Out of Field. In 2001, overall 7 percent of foreign language teachers, 9 percent of math and science teachers, 12 percent of reading teachers, 13 percent of the ESE teachers, 25 percent of the industrial arts/technology education teachers, and 33 percent of ESOL teachers (English for Speakers of Other Languages) were teaching out of field.

http://www.fldoe.org/evaluation/pdf/teachingtrends.pdf

HOW Florida K-12 SCIENCE & MATHEMATICS EDUCATION COMPARES: Florida ranked 35th in the nation on the 2005 NAEP
scores for mathematics with a score of 274 (national average was 278). In 2004, Florida did not report on the percentage of middle
school math teachers certified in math (national average was 49%) nor did it report on the percentage of middle school science teachers
certified in science (national average was 54%).

http://www.agiweb.org/gap/cvd/CVD06STEMFlorida.pdf

FSU and UF match wits on science shortfall
Florida needs math and science teachers.
By RON MATUS, Times Staff Writer
Published November 15, 2007

http://www.sptimes.com/2007/11/15/State/FSU_and_UF_match_wits.shtml

[madfloridian]

5. Do they count elementary teachers in the "out of field" category?

I know in elementary school we had to teach all the subjects unless we were team teaching.

[tsakshaug]

7. Usually no

Subject area is not considered (except special ed) in most states until 6th or 7th grade, some states 9th grade

[Sancho]

23. not usually...but that is a different but equally difficult issue..

elementary certification requirements for "content" (math, science, etc.) has been a serious battle lately. What is a "highly qualified" teacher in elementary school? Right now, Florida is moving to a new teacher certification test with a large increase in material from content subjects (requiring more content courses). Many elementary students are having trouble passing the new test without taking more courses...but Florida restricts BA degrees to 120 hours so there is no place to put in the necessary courses: catch 22.

There is no easy solution. One option is to go to "5-year" degrees for elementary teachers that equal 150 credit hours.

[madfloridian]

24. They were talking of doing it when I retired.

I was teaching 2nd grade at that time....think I could have handled it. By 5th or 6th grade I think extra training might be needed for regular classroom teachers. Not 1st 2nd or 3rd.

[flordehinojos]

6. polk county ... a regressive county where only the bigots in the boys' club rule and the people,

the people, and openness get stomped on and pushed around. the boys in the boys' club (who are as small as the *ss sitting in the white house) get their kicks the same way W does ... keeping down those who are not members of the boys' club.

[mlevans]

8. Florida...

isn't that where children are taught to read using the pet goat story?

[tsakshaug]

9. Having taught..

Having taught science in NC, we had a bit in the state curriculum about teacher other theories of the origin of life. I managed this by saying "other people have other views, but this is the dominate scientific version"
That worked well for 12 years with only one problem from a preacher's kid. I told him that I was not preaching, just presenting the current scientific explanation, and he was welcome to teach his child as he saw fit, but he would be tested on the material in my class.

[rAVES]

10. WOW...

If (evolution) is taught, I would want to balance it with the fact that we may live in a universe created by a supreme being as well..

that is just fucking outrageous in this day and age...

[Tekla West]

11. We might also live

on a giant doughnut for all these people know. Hard to imagine this nonsense in an age of science, but the barbarians are not just at the gate, they have taken over the castle.

[izquierdista]

25. I think it's pretty well established

that we live on a giant teacup. The donut theory went out of vogue when scientists realized that the donut has no place to hold all the water of the oceans and the teacup does. The teacup theory is only a refinement of the donut theory though, because after all, the teacup is topologically equivalent to the donut. :donut:

[yardwork]

16. What I don't understand is why she sees those two things as being opposed.

Most reasonable people understand that one can believe in a deity AND learn about the universe, both at the same time.

It's obvious that right-wingers brainwash one another into thinking that evolution is the same as atheism. It's bizarre that they believe this.

[truth2power]

31. fact that we MAY??? Uh.....sure. n/t

[DCKit]

12. Only the 19th century? The author was being far too generous.

They call it "intelligent design" for the sole purpose of giving it some level of scientific (sounding) credibility. Otherwise it's purely religious dogma and has no place in schools or any other public venue outside of a church.

If the good people of Florida are so intent that their children not learn these controversial subjects, they need to home school, open some fundamentalist Xtian madrassas, herd their children to church as often as they feel necessary to complete the indoctrination and leave the rest of us alone with our Darwinism, gravity, global warming and every other scientific theory they chose to ignore.

**Good luck with that gravity thing, by the way. Better hold on to something.**

It would be simple enough if they were to read and understand the Constitution, but that is asking far too much. If they were capable of critical thinking * would never have been elected and everything else would be falling into place to make our planet a better place for everyone's children. Being close-minded, hysteric, emotional reactionaries however, leaves them no other place to go other than the far right, that dark place beyond reason and sanity.

I hear there's some fine land in Guyana where the spaceships visit regularly, manna falls from heaven and Jesus appears every afternoon at exactly 4:20.

[AuntPatsy]

13. Never had a desire to visit Florida, strange state....

[davepdx]

14. I grew up in Polk County (Auburndale)

in the 50's and 60's. At that time science and math were stressed heavily. By the end of 6th grade we knew what science was about and how valuable it is to our society.

When I read about this school board issue a couple days ago, initially I really didn't want to believe that this was happening where I grew up. Then I thought about why I had absolutely no problem leaving Fla. in 1985: it was because of the deep seated racism, the the all too frequent disregard for the environment (by the state government and the people in general) and the consistent lack of monetary support for the school system. Certainly not everyone there had a negative value system like this but way too many people did in my experience.

I can now see how (using Stephen Colbert's term) the "backwash" group is influencing the public school system. Time and time again while I was growing up I observed the extreme hypocrisy of so many people that vocally claimed to be religious. They tended to stay in the immediate area. Many of the young adults that I knew that had high expectations for their lives and/or were college educated never returned to live there.

That the critical thinking skills of the citizens of Polk County have devolved to this level makes me really sad. Hopefully I am wrong in my conclusions and the citizens recall the jackasses that have made this asinine decision.

[madfloridian]

15. Interesting race going on now...

in part of this county. You know how big the Dockery name is? Well, Justin Troller, running against him for city commission...beat him 43% to 35%. Run-off of course is necessary. Justin is running a grassroots campaign. He makes the calls himself, no big campaign staff.

The Republicans are just fuming.

It is interesting to see this happening. I think the regular comfortable faces who have dominated for too long are going to have to sit up and stand for something.

[davepdx]

18. Oh man, it looks like an interesting race

I do remember the name Dockery for sure. I was curious and I googled "Justin Troller Florida" and got the Florida Progressive Blog with the headline "Justin Troller - Opponent Called out on Illegal Campaigning." It looks like the the Repub, Brian Dockery, doesn't care for the law either (like Bush).

I sure hope you are right in that the old guard is starting to crumble due to their arrogance.

I try to read the Lakeland Ledger from time to time but its been a while. I really like Lakeland. I have mixed feelings about the lake draining (Scott Lake) due to a sinkhole last year. I used to go fishing with a buddy on Scott Lake when I was in my teens. The fact that public access was eliminated due to the wealthy homeowners that claimed that they "owned the lake" really pissed me off.

[madfloridian]

21. We are pulling for Justin.

He has really worked his butt off. He teaches school and then campaigns.

Scott Lake, oh do not get me started. Broke my father's heart when they could not longer launch their boat to fish there. He and mom had their favorite fishing spots.

They are still trying to figure how to use the Florida aquifer to fill the lake again. Too many are watching now to let them work with SWIFTMUD to do it again.

[madfloridian]

32. Well, we just found out Justin Troller won by a lot. Beat a Dockery.

It was just a city commission election, but the implications are huge. People are tired of the same old same old.

[lpbk2713]

33. Thanks for the post

I voted for him just to keep the "D" dynasty from taking hold any further than they already have.

[madfloridian]

35. It really shocked the Dockerys.

This is their territory. They are actually after all pretty decent Republicans, as Republicans go here....they are not too bad. Not so extreme.

But it was good to see someone win who just decided to run again because he cared.

[lpbk2713]

37. I feel pretty good about this.

By the Ledger's count Dockery only won one precinct out of twenty-seven. Link.

My precinct voted against him 3 to 1.

And that is quite an accomplishment in Polk County. And a good sign.

I'm starting to think people here are getting fed up with rethuglicans.

[madfloridian]

38. Troller had 4,343 votes to 2,777 for Dockery.

That's amazing.

[yardwork]

17. Thank you for that insight - please post more often!

I grew up in a very isolated rural county in Ohio. I saw the same pattern you describe. The bright people got out, never to return.

[davepdx]

20. I still have a number of friends there that are quite nice people.

It's just that they don't have the drive to do anything about their situation in Polk County. For example the lack of good jobs and the fairly minimal chances to get an education post high school. I haven't been able to determine if this is from lack of intellectual curiosity or whether they just won't exert any energy to make any change.

An example is my nephew (my brothers son) who is 29 years old. He is quite bright but has no drive. He is back living with his parents and is quite happy working in jobs that involve minimal skills (working at the phosphate mines, Home Depot, etc.). I think he suffers from both lack of intellectual curiosity and drive. It's really sad for me as his father (my brother) has done absolutely nothing to encourage him to go to school at all, ever.

I can think of 6 or 7 people that graduated with me from high school that are the sons of business owners. They didn't leave because of their family business interests which I understand and is fine by me. Unfortunately, their values have changed little from their parents values and the word progressive is not in their vocabulary.

I think that there are still quite a few very good people that live there, both those that look backward and the progressives. It's just that the progressives seem to be (as I see it from a distance now) fairly frustrated. I know that I would be.

[wizstars]

19. I suppose they want us all down on our knees in the church of their choice....

Being beaten with a stupid stick is surely a pre-requisite to being a right-winger. How else can you explain it???
:shrug:

[Flabbergasted]

22. Is Evolution an intelligent design.

[rAVES]

26. Probably not..

[Quantess]

36. Maybe, but that's not Science class material.

That can be discussed at church or at sunday school.

[NastyDiaper]

27. I'm in Polk. It's embarassing.

On the upside, my daughters will have less competition come time to apply for College.

[nikto]

28. Teaching Evolution goes against God...

...I mean, it really pisses ZEUS off, bigtime.

And don't get me started about Apollo...

[FloridaJudy]

34. And the Flying Spaghetti Monster

Needs equal time as well.

[AX10]

29. One of the few benefits of global warming is that...

Florida will be drowned in the sea. Unfortunately, the sea will become that much more polluted.

[proud2BlibKansan]

30. Been there, done that. I live in Kansas

and you have my sympathy. These people are out of their ever lovin minds.

If you need any support, you know where to find me. ::