Are a majority of die-hard pro-War folks Racists?

[patrice]

Call it qualitative research:

From our street corner, near a pro-football game today, lots of traffic before the game, from all over the state, moving pretty slowley sometimes, with mostly non-hostile responses and even some support, but of those expressing pro-War sentiments, those sentiments were nearly 100% statements such as "Kill all Iraqis".

Maybe it's just the football's testosterone culture and beer, but it does make one wonder.

[Mythsaje]

1. Probably...

There are sure a lot more racists around than I thought.

Was discussing it with my dad the other day.

[mahina]

2. Sure. Can you imagine any circumstance under which

our country could support a war that killed a million white folks? The war itself is racist. Casually watching the bombs drop on urban Bagdad, with no care for the human beings we killed, was evidence of racism.

Sadly.

[balantz]

27. Killing other white folk could happen

if one is white and not a fundamentalist christian, or not a die-hard nationalist. Or perhaps openly gay. Or maybe just poor and hungry when there's not much food around.

[MikeNearMcChord]

3. And I bet most of them never put on a uniform.

[Bobbieo]

4. The few pro-war people I know are not only anti-Muslim, they are anti-immigration.

Guess it goes hand in hand.

[mahina]

6. Maybe they just have a high tolerance for propaganda.

Would explain both.

[Aristus]

5. Yes.

Racism is the entire reason we went to war in Iraq. Racism, the reason, oil the goal. The Iraqi people are, by and large, brown-skinned Muslims.

If they had been white-skinned Christians, the war never would have happened...

[HowHasItComeToThis]

8. BINGO FOR YOU, REMEMBER THEY CREATED BUSH I THEIR IMAGE

[L0oniX]

7. IMO and experience they are mostly southern red necks

[LibertarianAtheist]

11. good job of generalizing

in my experience the most fervent voices in support of the actual governmental policy which created and continues the war in iraq are northeastern ivy league educated neoconservatives. There is a difference between southerners (who tend to make up the majority of our armed forces) supporting a policy because they don't wish to believe their children, friends, relatives, etc. are fighting in vain, and a difference between people who support the invasion policy and the policy of pre-emption based on theoretical threats to America.

[L0oniX]

14. I live in Florida. Those that are die hard pro war here are red necks.

[LibertarianAtheist]

17. let me ask for a clarification to your point then

are you saying that it is solely on your experience that pro-war folks are rednecks and your point solely represents those you come in contact with, or are you using your sample to describe anyone who supports the war in iraq?

[L0oniX]

23. Quote you: northeastern ivy league educated neoconservatives

I was only pointing out that -where I am- they are mostly red necks. I also know about your northeastern ivy league educated neoconservatives. I hope this helps you understand what I said a little better.

[Karenina]

16. Southerners who signed up frothing at the mouth

to kick some raghead butt. (Never mind those "butts" NEVER DID ANYTHING to them. They're slightly darker skinned, that's good enough). KICK THEIR ASS, TAKE THEIR GAS.

[LibertarianAtheist]

18. would you desparage those who enlisted to fight against the empire of japan

as frothing at the mouth racists who wish to kill some Jap butt, despite many of those who enlisted after Pearl Harbor had "nothing" done to them? Remember this, prior to our invasion there was plenty and plenty of information being fed to Americans that Iraq was tied to the fight against the Taliban and al Qaeda, and many were under the impression that this war was a part of the response to September 11th. People didn't all of a sudden go "Hell yes, we're going to kick some Iraqi Camel Jockey ass" and there was this massive spike in enlistment. The vast majority of those fighting signed up to fight in the War on Terror, which stupidly includes our misadventure in Iraq.

I would like you to name a single soldier who enlisted so we could get their oil (and I'm talking about US Soldiers, not Blackwater security personel).

[rug]

21. The most ardent war supporters are not in the military.

And what does Japan have to do with this?

[LibertarianAtheist]

24. well Karl

my point was in reference to the dumbshit assertion by the poster that the southerners who enlisted wanted to kick some raghead butt despite the "ragheads" not doing anything to them, so i pointed to the high enlistment the military saw after pearl harbor though i imagine many didn't have anyone hurt by the attack.

Fucking amazing how you missed what I was saying.

[rug]

25. well, Gaston, your manners aside, your post lacks logic

and facts.

[LibertarianAtheist]

30. Well here's the fact my Marxist friend

US Military Enlistment Cards 1941: about 1.1 million
US Military Enlistment Cards 1942: about 3.0 million

what happened December 7, 1941? Pear Harbor. What do you think is the reason the enlistment cards for the US Military nearly tripling in a year? It couldn't have been that Imperial Japan attacked us

Now his point was that the people who signed up did so to kick some raghead butt, despite the ragheads never doing anything to them. Am I to assume that the three million enlistments in the US Military in 1942 had NOTHING to do with Pearl Harbor?

Please point out where my logic is crap.

[rug]

34. For starters, WW2 was a war.

The national mobilization after Pearl Harbor, two years into a global war, has little relation to the aftermath of the WTC.

Second, it's not too hard to identify Japan as an agressor, but impossible to identify Iraq as one.

Third, this thread asks if the remaining pro-war poulace is also likely to be racist, not if enlisted soldiers are. You assume people who joined the army also support this war.

Your illogic is in trying to create a different argument altogether.

[LibertarianAtheist]

36. Oh for fuck's sake

If this was a reply to the original poster you might have a point. However I'm replying to someone else's statement.

But let me talk about your points:

1. Many in this country viewed 9/11 as another Pearl Harbor. We were not involved in said global war when Pearl Harbor happened.
2. Many of the enlisted who did so in the aftermath of 9/11 didn't enlist to fight Iraq, they enlisted to fight terrorism, and the powers that be decided to include a non-aggressor (Iraq) into this war against the real agressor (the Taliban and al Qaeda).
3. I answered this before points one and two

[rug]

40. You're unfamiliar with the Lend/Lease Act and are assuming facts in #2.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

45. Yes, they were racist

The appeals to get people to sign up to fight in the Pacific were full of racist caricatures, and it certainly was racist to round up and imprison all Japanese-Americans when German-Americans and Italian-Americans actually had to DO something to get arrested.

And if you don't remember the racist acts and sentiments against Arab-Americans (including on DU!) after 9/11, then you have a short memory.

[Aristus]

50. Hang on a second. Japan attacked US. Iraq didn't.

The racism towards the Japanese was a secondary trait of the war we fought against them. Iraq didn't attack us, so the administration used the racists' fears of the "other" to get us into a war.

[brmdp3123]

38. Can you cite a source

that Southerners tend to make up the majority of our armed forces?

[noamnety]

47. here's a source for you

"Southerners have close ties to the military, from enlisting a disproportionate share of troops to serving as headquarters for major U.S. military bases." http://southernstudies.org/facingsouth/2006/11/election-watch-referendum-on-iraq.asp

Their attitudes about the war are now shifting, and I imagine Katrina opened their eyes a lot, but originally, they disproportionately also supported the war.

"Despite strong early support for the Iraq war in the South, the region’s opposition to the war now matches national levels"
http://southernstudies.org/facingsouth/2006/10/new-report-poll-finds-opposition-to.asp

[patrice]

42. I think this is a very good point about people not wanting to believe

in "the Matrix". We should be careful to make this distinction when interacting with others.

There must also be at least a significant minority of Southerners who oppose King George.

The dominant meme I hear from those how don't completely support the war, but aren't against it either, is "They're fighting for y/our freedom." That's either ignorance or a convenient support for something else which is quite possibly either racial or religious bigotry.

[liberalmuse]

9. Yes, they are racist.

Racism is the justification the willfully ignorant use to condone their crimes. Anyone who supports the mass slaughter of human beings by human beings is evil, period. I won't even attempt to excuse these despicable people. Because they choose to be assholes, there will always be a Hitler or a Pol Pot or a George W. Bush.

[L0oniX]

28. Indeed. Hollywood and other media have vilified Arabs, Japanese, Africans, Germans and Martians.

It is easier to kill those that have been vilified or dehumanized. Rock huggers, sand niggers, gooks, savages, etc are some of the terms used to help vilify and dehumanize those that are to be killed. It is sick and it is racism.

[Buzz Clik]

10. I don't think Iraqi is a race.

[whistle]

12. Indeed they are

[Alexander]

13. Hell yes. Racism isn't unique and some DUers have shown themselves to be racist...

Of course, names will not be named, because I don't want to be banned.

But any enterprising DUer with the Search function can easily see who I'm talking about.

[noamnety]

15. Have we had a lot of wars

that weren't about racism, in the public's mind?

(The powers that be may have had capitalist goals, but aren't they almost always marketed to racists?)

[LibertarianAtheist]

20. because all people who believe in capitalism are racists

lots of stupid generalizations in here.

[noamnety]

29. You may want to reread my post. (nt)

[LibertarianAtheist]

32. The powers that be may have had capitalist goals, but aren't they almost always marketed to racists

well if the people who have capitalist goals are marketing their views to people and it's working, that means the people being marketed to are capitalists. these people also are racists according to your post.

Here's your sentence with the transitive property:

People who are marketed to with capitalist goals = capitalists
People who are marketed to with capitalist goals = racists

Capitalists = Racists, according to your sentence.

[rug]

35. ?

[LibertarianAtheist]

37. well let me explain it

but I don't want to be too in depth because your commune's equally shared bandwidth may end up not being equal.

He said capitalists are marketing the war to racists. People receptive to marketing from capitalists are probably capitalists (I have a hard time thinking capitalist marketing would be effective if those being marketed to were socialists and marxists). Since the people who are receptive to the marketing are capitalists and also racists, his generalization was basically that capitalists are racists.

Whew, I hope your internet connection didn't crap out, there are literally hundreds of characters in this reply...

[rug]

39. You don't ever have to worry about being too in depth.

Before you use any more of your hard earned characters, maybe you should learn about the relationship of capitalism to racism. Capital aggregates by removing the surplus value from labor. It does that most successfully when labor is divided by, oh let's say, racism.

Now why don't you take your Ron Paul pamphlet out of your ass and stick it in the trash with your sophomoric attempt at sarcasm.

BTW, a common misunderstanding, which you embrace, is that communes are based on equality. They are based on meeting needs.

[noamnety]

41. Try again.

Powers that be who are war mongers - capitalists wanting to wage war for capitalist reasons

poor schmucks who support the war - racists, who the capitalists know they can appeal to through racist marketing

Throughout history, some of the powers that be have been kings, presidents, explorers, etc. and they waged war for profit.
and some of the poor schmucks who fought those wars didn't think much one way or another about economic systems, they didn't profit from those wars, they just knew those other people are evil/less than fully human, etc.

You made some logical errors, but that's no big deal.

[patrice]

48. That's a questionable interpretation of Iwfern's post.

I don't think s/he said all people who are marketed to by means of capitalism are capitalists.

Are you sure that you aren't just over-reacting to the presence of a Marx-avatar in the thread?

[Basileus Basileon]

19. Some, certainly. Majority? Maybe. I don't really know,

and if they are, I don't know if the two positions are linked at all.

[fenriswolf]

22. pro war to a point

they only want war with someone who has a differnet skin color or religious beliefs.

[xchrom]

26. racism is america's favorite past time.

[XemaSab]

31. The person I know who is STILL pro-war says it's an anti-racist statement.

He thinks liberals don't think Arabs are capable of democratic self-government.

He served in 'Nam and is married to a Chinese woman, FWIW.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

44. Remind him that Iraqis are Persian, not Arab

Then ask him why we're still in Iraq when most of the people there want us to leave.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

46. IRANIANS are Persian; Iraqis are Arabs

Technically, an Arab is anyone whose native language is Arabic.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

49. You are correct. My bad. nt

[Skittles]

33. pro-war = repuke = racist

absolutely

[mrreowwr_kittty]

43. Does a bear shit in the woods?

Doesn't take long for their true colors to show once you puncture their claims that "things are going GREAT over there!" and "we're bringing them Freedom!" After that it devolves pretty quickly into "let's nuke those camel jockeys into glass!"

[Thothmes]

51. Dont see it as racism

The Iraqis are primarily Arabs. It would be no different than some american saying kill all Germans or Japanese during WWII. Now if the statement was to kill all arabs, would consider that racist.

[MrMickeysMom]

52. Qualitatively weighing in...

I've always found the people who scream "we want war" when seeing our peace bumper sticker look like they'd kick ass and use these names to distinguish themselves from-

"fags, towel heads, camel jockeys, ho's, boys, and lesbos"

Guess that makes them more likely in my book to be-

"Mentally, cognatively, emotionally and socially PATHETIC racists and homophobic fucking assholes"...

But, that's just my take. which, with a quarter, will buy you a phone call :hi: ..."hello!"