Constitutional sage Robert Byrd on same sex marriage....

[IndianaJones]

"reflects a demand for political correctness that has gone berserk. We live in an era in which tolerance has progressed beyond a mere call for acceptance and crossed over to become a demand for the rest of us to give up beliefs that we revere and hold most dear in order to prove our collective purity. At some point, a line must be drawn by rational men and women who are willing to say, 'Enough!'"

[Ian David]

1. I fucking hate Byrd. n/t

[IndianaJones]

2. you and me both. nt.

[karlrschneider]

3. He went from young shithead to crazy old prick.

:grr:

[TechBear_Seattle]

4. I wonder how he felt about the 13th, 14th and 15th Amendments

After all, they too were the result of political correctness that had gone berserk. :eyes:

[IndianaJones]

5. he carries the Constitution in his pocket. nt.

[Occulus]

55. Well, since that's the case,

I think he ought to explain why the full faith and credit clause of the US Constitution doesn't seem to apply to all contracts these days.

I can get married in VT and MA. How is it that those contracts are only valid there?

[IndianaJones]

56. he was against the Iraq war. nt.

[joeybee12]

6. Yeah, he was vocal against the war from the start, but most of

his "beliefs" are pretty right-wing. I kept my mouth shut when people were cannonizing him over his war stance, knowing there's a lot more history to this guy than that one issue could make up for. I especially love that he uses the word rational, as if fighting for equality is somehow irrational.

[Maven]

7. He's always been a bigoted POS

It's the focus of his (public) bigotry that has changed.

[IndianaJones]

8. Still a massive racist as well as homophobe. nt.

[jonnyblitz]

9. yup. I remember him clutching his bible and railing about the

evil homosexuals on C-SPAN during the DOMA debates in the 90's. I do believe DU sent him flowers once. I guess he gives a damn good anti-war speech. We should send flowers to Ron Paul, too, I suppose.snicker.

[bigtree]

10. Such class to rub this in on his 90th birthday

. . . ignoring the good he's done for other causes equally as important as that idiotic vote.

[IndianaJones]

12. which causes? nt.

[bigtree]

19. opposing and ending the Iraq occupation

opposing Bush's planned aggression against Iran

[IndianaJones]

20. certainly doesn't excuse his bigotry. nt.

[bigtree]

23. no, but that particular bigotry hardly defines him

. . . or is even a reasonable or fair measure of his worth, to Americans or to our party.

[IndianaJones]

24. I guess it depends on whats important to you. nt.

[bigtree]

27. Byrd's vote (or views) on that legislation are of no actual consequence

his leadership against Bush's militarism has been more significant.

[Maven]

26. Spare us. nt

[bigtree]

29. no. one dissenting view pointing out his birthday shouldn't hurt much

this post popped up right after the op's response to my birthday wish thread.

Spare me.

[Maven]

30. Aw, you couldn't celebrate a bigot in peace.

Poor thing.

Let me know when your Strom Thurmond retrospective is posted.

[IndianaJones]

31. Being a raging bigot doesn't define who he is. nt.

[bigtree]

39. no. although it may describe some of his actions, the definition doesn't fit the man

but, what the hell . . . name-calling is FUN!

[bigtree]

34. cute. That's a good measure of your own bigotry

but, you can't be a bigot . . . can you? I mean, not after having been victimized as you've obviously been by Byrd's bigotry.

I forgive your baseless attack on my character, and your rudeness. Poor thing.

[IndianaJones]

35. all else aside, can we at least agree that Byrd is a racist and homophobe? nt.

[Maven]

36. My own bigotry of what? Bigots? Or their apologists?

Yes, you're right. I've been caught.

I'm thoroughly intolerant of bigots and their apologists.

[bigtree]

40. you need to find someone who has apologized for his bigotry and insult them

not me, stranger

[La Lioness Priyanka]

44. pointing out homophobia and condemning it is class. defending it is not.

[bigtree]

47. you need to find someone who has 'defended' his 'homophobia'

and jump on them. Posting this thread with these old quotes just because I posted the birthday wish to Byrd is classless and unnecessary.

Using me (and my complaint to the op) to leverage your complaints about those comments (and his vote?) is equally classless. Sometime I think folks believe that only them and their particular concern or person can be a victim of bigotry.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

49. as a foreigner, a person of color, a woman, and a gay person

i fully understand multiple oppressors. :eyes:

[bigtree]

51. and, you feel 'oppressed' by Byrd's views and votes?

how very sad

[La Lioness Priyanka]

52. did i say i feel oppressed by him? i said i understand multiple oppressors.

i find his statement homophobic. that is all.

[bigtree]

54. oh, he's definitely afraid

My father was as well. He was a good man though . . . did a great deal of good which I think outstripped his bias(es). Those folks he helped remember him for those good deeds (and recall his bigotry right along with those). Just an example of my thinking. He was a senior executive at EEOC (EOC) for years. But, he had a curious (and sometimes consuming, I think) fear of gays and a dislike of many individuals of his own race. But, those faults didn't really define what became the totality of his life.

[ThomWV]

11. Thought not on this subject I happen to agree with his statement to a large degree.

[DefenseLawyer]

13. Where is that quote from?

Not doubting that he said it, but it kind of reminds me of the right wing rant emails falsely attributed to George Carlin or Andy Rooney or whomever that float around cyberspace.

[IndianaJones]

14. Congressional record...proceedings and debates regarding DOMA, 1996. nt.

[DefenseLawyer]

18. Of course Bill Clinton signed that into law

as I recall, but I guess this is a Byrd bashing thread and not a Great Triangulator bashing thread. Byrd was dead wrong on this issue, but so were a lot of people, mostly on purely political grounds, e.g. Mr. Clinton, reflecting the general consensus of the country (which was also wrong on the issue). Looking it up, I see that it passed the Senate 85-14. Rather than go back to 1996, I would rather focus on how far we have come on the issue since then. Quite a ways if you ask me.

[stirlingsliver]

15. Bigot!

What a fucking bigot.

He is a disgrace.

But he does bring home the "pork" for the people of West Virginia.

[CorpGovActivist]

16. Constitutional Sage HRC on This Topic: (1) "This has not been a long-term struggle yet."

(2) Discrimination against LGBT equality is not enshrined in the Constitution, merely because it's not mentioned.

And yes, there's actual video:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=2312726&mesg_id=2312726

- Dave

[gollygee]

17. How dare there be a demand for equal rights!!!

And here, in America of all places!!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

21. LEAVE STROM ALONE!

Wait... who?

[BuyingThyme]

22. I support him in his beliefs.

But his votes should reflect his oath to defend our Constitution, not his beliefs. It's all right there in black and... a kind of textured yellow-orangish.

[Maven]

25. Well, I don't support his beliefs.

I support his right to express them, but my support ends there.

[BuyingThyme]

28. I don't support anybody's beliefs.

[book_worm]

32. well at least on the war, Byrd was right from the start, and Hillary was wrong.

Also where does Hillary stand on gay marriage?

I ask this because it's a Hillary supporter who posted this about Byrd. I don't condone his views on gay marriage,but at age 90 I'd doubt he will change them. At least, though, he was not duped by Bush on Iraq and Iran.

[Maven]

33. So was Pat Buchanan.

Should we celebrate his birthday too?

[book_worm]

37. Who said anything about celebrating his birthday?

I asked where does Hillary or any of the Dem candidates stand on gay marriage?

[Maven]

38. Hillary doesn't support equal marriage but she hasn't spewed hateful rhetoric about GLBT people

on the floor of Congress, and she never supported the FMA. Byrd is guilty of both.

[book_worm]

41. Well I sure hope she won't support Bush again on a war with Iran.

like she did with Iraq.

[DefenseLawyer]

42. Was Paul Wellstone a bigot?

Bill Bradley? Biden? Dodd? Harkin? Reid? Bill Clinton? Not exactly a profile in courage for any of them.

[Maven]

43. If you can't see the difference between Paul Wellstone and Robert Byrd

and how each man comported himself vis-a-vis GLBT rights, then I can't help you.

[IndianaJones]

45. this is the part where it gets completely ridiculous and the hole gets deeper. nt.

[DefenseLawyer]

48. If you can't see the difference

between rationalizing a vote for someone you like and vilifying THE SAME vote for someone you don't, then maybe you don't want to. My point is simply that a lot of people found themselves on the wrong side of this issue, especially in 1996. It was smart politics to be on the wrong side of this issue in most places. Maybe Byrd is a bigot for voting that way and Wellstone was a savvy politician. Then again maybe not.

[Maven]

53. Excuse me.

Wellstone voted for DOMA in 1996, which was wrong. However he also supported hate crimes protection and a ban on workplace discrimination against GLBT people.

I dare say if Sen. Wellstone were alive today, his position on equal marriage would have evolved much the way Dennis Kucinich's did.

Byrd voted in favor of the FMA as recently as 2006 and by all accounts has been an active agent against gay rights since Clinton proposed letting GLBTs serve openly in the military in 1993.

That's not to mention rhetoric like that in OP along with the many other occasions Byrd has spoken out against our rights. His public racism has been replaced by public homophobia.

Sorry, no comparison.

[racaulk]

46. It's not a "demand for political correctness." It's a demand for full equality under the law!

I hate Byrd. :mad:

[terrya]

50. And that doddering old bigot speaks.

My loathing for that homophobe knows no bounds.

"We live in an era in which tolerance has progressed beyond a mere call for acceptance and crossed over to become a demand for the rest of us to give up beliefs that we revere and hold most dear in order to prove our collective purity". Well, fuck that shit. This is EQUALITY we're demanding, Senator.