Well just finished listening to Naomi Wolf LIVE in San Diego

[nadinbrzezinski]

and let me tell you something folks... if you are not scared yet, you are either in full denial or you
are not paying attention. She went through the ten points (well four of them and the final one) and that was a powerful talk.

I got some copies to give to friends and family and hopefully the twenty somethings will read it, and most importantly GET IT.

What was disturbing is that once again... where were the young kids? Excpet for teh single law school student using racist language... where were they?

Anyhow spent more than I was expecting to in getting copies to give away... and hopefully that will wake up some kids.

I am still having cold shivers running down my back... and quite frankly... we will soon get to the point where many of us who have been active will have to decide....

Do I want to face the torture?
Do I want to shut up?
Do I want to leave the country?

Either that or we have precious little time to stand up, pay attention and be counted.

[orleans]

1. if we get tortured, if we have to shut up or if we leave the country

we won't be voting for a democrat in 08.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. If we have elections it will be a miracle

you know there are so many of the deep thinkers now saying what some of us have for some months now... that was the other thing that sent more chills down my back.

Oh and I know the contrarian's arguments, Libertarians and freepers said this about Clinton... yep, but Clinton did not establish all the tools of a police state in place, nor did he joke about staying in office after the legal term is over

[AuntPatsy]

8. Seriously that is my biggest fear right now, but if they get their wish and Guiliano gets the nom

then they are right where they want to be and nothing will have changed and again, far too many Americans will get to comfy until it is too late and they realize that once again they ate the bait regardless of the danger of knowing what happened the last time they did it.

[nadinbrzezinski]

10. In a clean electoral system Giulani would not get the nom

and neither would HRC... early leaders don't.

So if either of them do, let alone both... we know somebody else is courting the votes, and it is not the votes we cast

[AuntPatsy]

12. I agree, I have already been told Giulani has it hands down, it was a promise

and he will do what is needed without question, so unless these guys are ousted, if he does win, knowing full well many conservatives do not want him, than I agree, its past time to worry, I fear if he does get it and just happens to win it, its game set match and we the people never actually having had a chance to make a move have lost the game we were never even aware we were playing.

[BenTrovato]

3. Going to see her in Palm Springs Friday night.

Already trying to determine how many copies to buy for friends and family:

One for my Yellow Dog Democrat friend here who doesn't believe me when I say that I fully expect the 2008 elections will never take place.

One for my mother who wonders how the German people ever allowed the fascists to come to power in Nazi Germany.

And one for my Bible-thumping sister in Alabama who believes all of this has Jesus' seal of approval.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Welcome to DU

and they had copies there for ten instead of the usual what is it... fiffeen bucks? And were all presigned.

I had one at home... but that is a good savings.

Hell now I have no excuses, one copy I am driving it over to my Congresswoman's office tomorrow.

[BenTrovato]

5. Thanks for the welcome;

Have been reading DU for years and already feel right at home.

I could've bought the book online for a lot less, but prefer to patronize our local, independent bookseller, whatever the price.

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. Lucky you, the proceeds of the book I think were going to our public

library and trust me, they need it.

[Swamp Rat]

7. "I... prefer to patronize our local, independent bookseller, whatever the price."

A man after my own heart. :toast:

[nadinbrzezinski]

11. I do that with sci fi and fantasy books

but I don't know too many indies in this town

And as I said, the proceeds today benefited the library

[tech3149]

9. Welcome Ben, I envy you

I live in an area where I don't expect I'll ever see either Naomi (Wolf or Klein). But I do value being able to hear and watch them thanks to the "internets". I hope your friends and family learn something from your gifts. We need all the help we can get.

[BenTrovato]

13. Amen to that.

I have been tearing my hair out trying to get my people to see what's going on and even some of my staunchest Democratic friends are like, "Oh, that could never happen here."

Well, it IS happening here.

Everyday I think it can't get any worse than this. And every morning I wake up and find out that it is.

Our Democratic Senator is now voting with the Repubs. What is up with that???

[AndyTiedye]

14. Bush** Took Her For a Ride (on AF1)

and she came back a completely different person.

[tavalon]

16. You might want to save that third copy

Fascism is always endorsed by God (or so the Fundies would say).

[earth mom]

15. For those who haven't heard Naomi Wolfs speech yet:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjALf12PAWc

The North American Union is the Ultimate Plan of the Powers that Be:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuBo4E77ZXo

This is a MUST SEE!

[IDemo]

17. I am midway through her book

I'm going to donate it to the library when I'm done, where hopefully many more will read it (and not get profiled for having done so).

Those who dismiss use of the word "fascism" in discussions of where America is now and where we are headed because there are no marching boots in the street or pounding fists on their door are failing to understand that 1933 Germany was not so different than 2007 America. It was through a steady pattern of legalistic steps that the Nazi party came to power, not through a bloody coup. Nobody is trying to cast images of death camps and gas ovens in describing the future of America. But imprisonment of innocent citizens, torture, control of the media, loss of free speech, and suppression of travel rights are all things which have occurred already.

"It can't happen here" is the weak-minded way to escape the truth for most Americans. "It" can and will happen here if nothing changes.

[nadinbrzezinski]

21. What is sad is that I have been making the same arguments she does

in the book for now years... partly due to my historical knpweledlge and party the reality of having grown up in
Mexico, which after 1968 student democracy movement had almost all steps applied to it

Hell... voting, you did it because it was a duty... but everybody was fully aware it was a joke... and is again a joke.

So that is familiar to people down there.

But watching what you say in the phone, self censoring... I remember that from growing up... and my dad telling us
to watch what we said on the phone and with whom we spoke... so a lot of this is extremely familiar. The fear raelly didn't stop until the 1980s... and even if we drive these idiots away and cheifly, prosecute them... the fear will not go away in my liftetime.

[mmonk]

18. The time to stand up is now.

First, get a PI to do a check on yourself to see if there is anything they can use. Then you'll know how to address any issue they throw at you. Then get active.

[tekisui]

19. The Un-Constitutional measures put in place by the Fascist Regime

Are there for a reason. Naomi Wolf makes it very clear----Secret Prisons, Illegal Surveillance, Torture---these steps are the beginning.

They are meant to keep people in line through fear. As it stands right now, any US citizen could be labeled an Enemy Combatant and disappeared. At least two US citizens have been: Hamdi and Padilla.

It is no joke or conspiracy. We live in a country that has methodically shifted to Fascism. Right now, it is a comfortable fascism, but it could turn very nasty, very quickly.

Everything the Nazi's did was done *legally* in Germany. Step by step with a willing Parliament.

And last night Senator Hillary Clinton, the Democratic front-runner stood on stage on national television
and proclaimed "National Security is most important than Human Rights."

If that is our leader of opposition, we are in serious trouble.

[mmonk]

20. Yep.

Security is not possible without guarantees concerning human rights. They make no sense apart.

[nadinbrzezinski]

22. A lot of what they have done was perfected in Central America

I am not kidding...