Why John Bolton did not serve on active duty and go to Nam in the 70's

[BOSSHOG]

You know bolton that conservative cowboy, who kicks ass for breakfast and starts war for lunch; who proudly served at the pleasure of bush and bush. Well, ole john made the conscientious decision not to enlist in the Active Army and go to Viet Nam. Why?

Back in 1970 john figured out that the evil hippie peace mongers would force us out of Nam so john figured he would not go and fight for something that Ted Kennedy would eventually give back. Isn't that precious?? And doesn't it just ooze with patriotism and love of country? And john went on to say (supposedly lending gravitas to his story and also sounding incredibly rehearsed) my Daddy who served in WWII agreed with my decision, so Daddy gives his blessing to me.

Source: Diane Rehm interview of john of 12 Nov.

So there ya have it, another brave chickenhawk rationalizing why he chose not to serve his country when the opportunity presented. Do ya think there is a correlation between lack of military service (and a spine) and the strong desire to promote never ending war so that others may die on a daily basis?

[Alter Ego]

1. I thought it was because Yosemite Sam was a fictional character.

[appal_jack]

20. Bolton has a fictional idea of Democracy

I heard this comment too, and turned Diane Rehms off shortly thereafter in complete disgust. The fact that Bolton would "explain" his avoidance of combat by fingering Ted Kennedy is indeed pathetic. Bolton couldn't smell personal responsibility if it perched on his mustache and farted straight up his nose.

But worse yet for me is Bolton's erroneous perception of the conduct of war by a Democracy. The US "lost" Vietnam for a number of reasons, but hippies, liberals and protesters were not among them. Apparently Bolton thinks that the role for a citizen in a democracy once war has been declared (or not, as in Vietnam, or sort-of, as in the present day) is limited to that of cheerleader. But the fact is that we remain sovereign citizens (i.e.- the collective bosses of government) even after the bombs start dropping.

In my mind, Vietnam was "lost" the moment that Kennedy died (and I am among the citizenry that believe he was killed in a coup) and the Vietnam escalation began WITHOUT ANY DEBATE or careful consideration by the body politic as a whole as to what this war was about, or why we should (or shouldn't) send troops there. Of course, LBJ & McNamara & co. couldn't very well have a real open debate, because their side would have boiled down to "We have to prop-up a colonial extractive economy based upon severe oppression to keep the corporate clients whom we serve(including the US weapons makers) happy." Instead, LBJ, etc. trotted out the bogeyman of Communism, browbeat Americans into relatively blind (and consequently relatively shallow) support, and escalated from there. The problem was, eventually Americans caught on that their sons were dying for a cause that they never really considered, much less embraced. And did we really care how or who the Vietnamese wanted to rule themselves? Maybe not.

Flash forward to present day, when chickenhawks like Bolton, who avoided any painful service or sacrifice in Vietnam, have steered this country into a war that only profits the weapons-makers and oil companies. How did they do this? By stifling all debate on the war's necessity and merits in 2002-2003 (including promulgating some truly stupendous lies). Now they will try to blame the "liberal media" for their own failure to establish a worthy cause and follow it through to an achievable conclusion. But they will again be lying. The Iraq war was "lost" the moment a trumped-up reason for pursuing war was spat-out by a White House Press Secretary.

A robust debate within a democratic republic in advance of any elective war (that is, barring an attack on our soil, like Pearl Harbor or even 9/11-Afghanistan, when the country immediately rallied) is necessary if leaders expect the citizenry to do what it takes to prevail. They tried to have debate on the cheap: 'winning' by speaking of mushroom clouds and WMD's and so-on.

Those flimsy rationales by our 'leaders' make for flimsy commitments at best from We The People. Bolton didn't learn this lesson from Vietnam. His interview with Diane Rehms makes it clear that he continues to refuse to learn. He belongs in the corner with a dunce cap on, and should not be allowed anywhere near the levers of power and policy-making of our government.

-app

[Rabo Karabekian]

2. Send Other's Sons to Kill

Does this surprise anyone at this point? Very few of these warmongers serve, McCain is one of the only ones.

[BOSSHOG]

3. Oh but I am

constantly impressed with their attempts to put the lipstick on their pigs of excuses for not SERVING THEIR COUNTRY DURING TIME OF WAR. Oh and Daddy loves me is really a sweet touch. What life loving war monger wouldn't swoon at hearing that story?

[Rabo Karabekian]

5. Why Support These Fascists

What surprises me is how the soldiers themselves continue to support Republicans. There seems to be a fair amount of troops who want war, and Republicans are obliged to start them. Good luck troops with your veteran's benefits, if the Rethugs have too much power in the federal government.

[JNelson6563]

4. Typical chicken-hawk.

"You know bolton that conservative cowboy, who kicks ass for breakfast and starts war for lunch"

Well said friend. :toast:

Julie

[Trailrider1951]

6. Doesn't surprise me a bit

Here ya go:

Prominent Democrats
Senator Jim Webb (D-VA) -- rifle platoon and company commander with the Fifth Marine Regiment in the An Hoa Basin west of Danang; was awarded the Navy Cross, the Silver Star Medal, two Bronze Star Medals, and two Purple Hearts. (1)
Representative Tim Walz, D-MN - Twenty-four years of service in the Army National Guard, retiring in 2005.
Representative Joe Sestak, D-PA - 31 years of service in the Navy, rising to the rank of Vice Admiral.
Representative Chris Carney, D-PA - Lieutenant Commander in the United States Naval Reserve, Carney served multiple tours overseas and was activated for Operation Enduring Freedom, Noble Eagle, and Southern Watch.
Representative Patrick Murphy, D-PA - extensive career in the U.S. Army from 1993-2004; earned Bronze Star and Presidential Unit Citation.
Representative Phil Hare, D-IL - Served in the United States Army Reserve for six years.
Representative Jack Murtha (D-PA) - distinguished 37-year career in the U.S. Marine Corps, Bronze Star and two Purple Hearts, retired from the Marine Corps Reserve as a colonel in 1990. (1)
Former House Minority Leader Richard Gephardt - Missouri Air National Guard, 1965-71. (1, 2)
Representative David Bonior - Staff Sgt., United States Air Force 1968-72 (1, 2)
Former Senate Minority Leader Tom Daschle - 1st Lt., U.S. Air Force SAC 1969-72 (1, 2)
Former Vice President Al Gore - enlisted August 1969; sent to Vietnam January 1971 as an army journalist, assigned to the 20th Engineer Brigade headquartered at Bien Hoa, an airbase twenty miles northeast of Saigon.
Former Senator Bob Kerrey... Democrat... Lt. j.g., U.S. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam (1, 2)
Senator Daniel Inouye, US Army 1943-'47; Medal of Honor, World War Two (1, 2)
Senator John Kerry, Lt., U.S. Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat V, and three awards of the Purple Heart for his service in combat (1)
Representative Charles Rangel, Staff Sgt., U.S. Army 1948-52; Bronze Star, Korea (1, 2)
Former Senator Max Cleland, Captain, U.S. Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star, Vietnam (1, 2)
Senator Ted Kennedy (D-MA) - U.S. Army, 1951-1953. (1)
Senator Tom Harkin (D-IA) - Lt., U.S. Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve, 1968-74. (1, 2)
Senator Jack Reed (D-RI) - U.S. Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army Reserve 1979-91 (1)
Former Senator Fritz Hollings (D-SC) - served as a U.S. Army officer in World War II, receiving the Bronze Star and seven campaign ribbons. (1)
Representative Leonard Boswell (D-IA) - Lt. Col., U.S. Army 1956-76; two tours in Vietnam, two Distinguished Flying Crosses as a helicopter pilot, two Bronze Stars, and the Soldier's Medal. (1, 2)
Former Representative "Pete" Peterson, Air Force Captain, POW, Ambassador to Viet Nam, and recipient of the Purple Heart, the Silver Star and the Legion of Merit. (1, 2)
Rep. Mike Thompson, D-CA: Staff sergeant/platoon leader with the 173rd Airborne Brigade, U.S. Army; was wounded and received a Purple Heart. (1, 2)
Bill McBride, Democratic Candidate for Florida Governor - volunteered and served as a U.S. Marine in Vietnam; awarded Bronze Star with a combat "V." (1)
Gray Davis, former California Governor, Army Captain in Vietnam; received Bronze Star. (1)
Pete Stark, D-CA, served in the Air Force 1955-57
Wesley Clark, Democratic Presidential Candidate - 38-year career of public service in the Army, culminating as Supreme Allied Commander of NATO.

Prominent Republicans

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-KY - did not serve (1)
Senate Assistant Minority Leader Trent Lott, R-MI - avoided the draft, did not serve.
Senate Republican Conference Chairman Jon Kyl, R-AZ - did not serve.
National Republican Senatorial Committee Chair John Ensign, R-NV - did not serve.
House Minority Leader John Boehner, R-OH - did not serve.
House Minority Whip Roy Blunt, R-MO - did not serve.
House Republican Conerence Chair Adam Putnam, R-FL - did not serve.
House Republican Policy Committee Thaddeus McCotter, R-MI - did not serve.
National Republican Congressional Committee Chair Tom Cole, R-OK - did not serve.
Former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani - did not serve.
Former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney - did not serve in the military but did serve the Mormon Church on a 30-month mission to France.
Former Senator Fred Thompson - did not serve.
Senator John McCain - McCain's naval honors include the Silver Star, Bronze Star, Legion of Merit, Purple Heart and Distinguished Flying Cross. Why did the Bush campaign smear him so in 2000? At least Senators Cleland (D-GA), Kerry (D-MA), Kerrey (D-NE), Robb (D-VA) and Hagel (R-NE) defended him.
Former Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert - avoided the draft, did not serve.
Former House Majority Leader Dick Armey - avoided the draft, did not serve.
Former House Majority Leader Tom Delay - avoided the draft, did not serve (1). "So many minority youths had volunteered ... that there was literally no room for patriotic folks like himself."
Former House Majority Whip Roy Blunt - did not serve
Former Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist - did not serve. (An impressive medical resume, but not such a friend to cats in Boston.)
Rick Santorum, R-PA, formerly third ranking Republican in the Senate - did not serve. (1)
George Felix Allen, former Republican Senator from Virginia - a supporter of Nixon and the Vietnam war, did not serve. (1)
Secretary of Defense Don Rumsfeld - served in the U.S. Navy (1954-57) as an aviator and flight instructor. (1) Served as President Reagan's Special Envoy to the Middle East and met with Saddam Hussein twice in 1983 and 1984.
GW Bush - decided that a six-year Nat'l Guard commitment really means four years. Still says that he's "been to war." Huh?
VP Cheney - several deferments (1, 2), the last by marriage (in his own words, "had other priorities than military service") (1)
Former Att'y Gen. John Ashcroft - did not serve (1, 2); received seven deferment to teach business ed at SW Missouri State
Jeb Bush, Florida Governor - did not serve. (1)
Karl Rove - avoided the draft, did not serve (1), too busy being a Republican.
Former Speaker Newt Gingrich - avoided the draft, did not serve (1, 2)
Former President Ronald Reagan - due to poor eyesight, served in a noncombat role making movies for the Army in southern California during WWII. He later seems to have confused his role as an actor playing a tail gunner with the real thing.
"B-1" Bob Dornan - avoided Korean War combat duty by enrolling in college acting classes (Orange County Weekly article). Enlisted only after the fighting was over in Korea.
Phil Gramm - avoided the draft, did not serve, four (?) student deferments
Former Senator Bob Dole - an honorable man. http://www.bobdole.org/bio/wwII.php
Chuck Hagel - two Purple Hearts and a Bronze Star, Vietnam. http://www.senate.gov/~hagel/Information/bio.htm
Duke Cunningham - nominated for the Medal of Honor, received the Navy Cross, two Silver Stars, fifteen Air Medals, the Purple Heart, and several other decorations Recently entered plea bargain on felony charges of bribery, etc. etc.
Senator Jeff Sessions U.S. Army Reserves, 1973-1986
Colin Powell. What are we to make of Powell? On the one hand, a long career as a military manager. On the other hand, accused of covering up the My Lai massacre. Back on that first hand, one of the seemingly sane voices in this administration when it comes to Iraq (or at least he used to be). On the other hand, a clear hypocrite ("I am angry that so many of the sons of the powerful and well-placed... managed to wangle slots in Reserve and National Guard units...")
Representative Wayne Gilchrest (R-MD), served in USMC in Vietnam; wounded in action.


source: http://www.awolbush.com/whoserved.html

send this to your freeper acquaintances.

Oops, on edit, they forgot that infamous bleeding-heart ultra liberal dove, Sen. George McGovern.
Who earned the distinguished flying cross in WWII.

[BOSSHOG]

7. Yeah but

you are dealing with factual data. Facts do not play well in conservative circles. Fiction, lies, ignorance, fake patriotism and made up resumes are all conservative values.

Thanks My Friend. I'm happy to say that I don't have any freeper acquaintainces I am attached to via email.

Doesn't bolton's story just warm the cockles of your heart? It makes ya wanna go out and hate something, in a warm and patriotic conservative way.

[DCKit]

12. Thank you!

On edit: Funny how the few Republicans I actually respect SERVED. And we should all understand why John McCain has dropped his marbles. Long past time for him to retire and get some long overdue counseling anyway.

[SpiralHawk]

8. Bolton = yet another pathetic republicon homelander chickenhawk

He is as pathetic as Rush Limbaugh, the republicon chickenhawk propagandist who dodged the draft with a freaking ASS PIMPLE.

Or Dickie "Five Military Deferments" Cheney --

Pathetic...

And the freeper homelanders LOVE these guys, lionize them as heros.

Twisted...

[BOSSHOG]

9. but daddy supported johnnies decision

johnny could see the future and found no use in serving his country. No doubt the right wing lie machine weaves these stories like the rest of their lies. They weave because they know their audience. and don't forget tommy delay and all those minorities in front of him in line to enlist. Lil tommy was just heartbroken that mean ole minorities got to go to NAM and he didn't.

I feel a musical coming on. All My Chickenhawks and all their excuses.

[appal_jack]

21. More fiction...

Fictional Yosemite Sam with his Fictional reasons for not serving and his Fictional notions of democracy is now waving around his Fictional (and posthumous!) approval from his WW2-vet dad.

Meh!

K&R, cuz this needs further attention.

-app

[tabasco]

10. Plus, the minorities took all the good combat jobs ...

so what's the point??

I'm sure he and Ted Nugent would have been like Rambo and Audie Murphy put together if the rotten liberals and minorities hadn't messed it up for them!

[spindrifter]

11. So how did he actually get out of it?

The draft, I mean? Mentally unfit?

[NNN0LHI]

13. Someone here the other day was suggesting we should be listening to what this clown has to say

I couldn't believe what I was reading.

Don

[BOSSHOG]

14. I enjoyed

listening to him yesterday. More reinforcement that he and his kind could not possibly be more off base about what is right for America.

[TahitiNut]

15. Funny ... I sure have a totally different understanding of what 'SERVICE' means.

I guess Mr. Bolton thinks Pharmacists should refuse to dispense medications whenever they disagree with how they suspect they'll be used. I guess Mr. Bolton thinks 'free speech' is about speech he finds acceptable.

[unhappycamper]

16. Because he's putz? n/t

[BOSSHOG]

17. I've yet to develop the art of saying so much with just a few words

Thank You Teammate. And yes indeed, mr bolton, who cares not for the constitution or our troops is indeed a Putz!!

[unhappycamper]

19. Thanks BOSS. n/t

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

18. He's a typical "save your own ass" neocon. They NEVER sacrificed for ANY ONE,...

,...other than themselves. EVER!!!!

They NEVER served anything other than their self-interests, EVER!!!

His poor father is probably rolling in his grave at such usury and arrogance and awefulness.