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Level 3 storm about to hit Wall Street

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donsu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 12:02 PM
Original message
Level 3 storm about to hit Wall Street


http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/IK03Dj03.html


There's a mystery on Wall Street. Merrill Lynch wrote off $8.4 billion in its subprime mortgage business, a figure revised up from $4.9 billion, yet Goldman Sachs reported an excellent quarter and didn't feel the need for any write-offs. The real secret of the difference is likely to be in the details of their accounting, and in particular in the murky world, shortly to be revealed, of their "Level 3" asset portfolios.

-snip-

We may be about to find out. From November 15, we will have a new tool for figuring out how much toxic waste is in investment banks' balance sheets. The new US accounting rule SFAS157 requires banks to divide their tradable assets into three "levels" according to how easy it is to get a market price for them. Level 1 assets have quoted prices in active markets. At the other extreme Level 3 assets have only unobservable inputs to measure value and are thus valued by reference to the banks' own models.

-snip-

The reason analysts should worry is that not only are Level 3 assets subject to eccentric valuation by the institution holding them, but the ability to write up their value in good times and get paid bonuses based on their capital uplift brings a temptation that few on Wall Street appear capable of resisting. Both Goldman Sachs and Merrill Lynch are reported to have made profits of more than $1 billion on their holdings of Level 3 assets in the first half of 2007, for example, profits on which bonuses will no doubt be paid at the end of their fiscal years. Given that we have had five good years on Wall Street, years in which nobody has known the amount of Level 3 assets on banks' balance sheets, and no significant media waves have been made questioning their valuation methodologies, it would not be surprising if many banks' Level 3 assets had become seriously overstated, even without any downturn having occurred.

-snip-

The capital underlying Wall Street, at the top, is not all that large - a matter of a few hundred billion. Given the piling of risk upon risk that has been engaged in over the last few years, and the size of the losses in the mortgage market alone that seem probable - my own estimate last spring of $980 billion looks increasingly likely to be somewhat below the final figure - it appears almost inevitable that in a bear market in which liquidity dries up and investors become skeptical, Wall Street's capital will be wiped out. Only the commercial banks like Wachovia and Bank of America whose investment banking ambitions have been largely thwarted and whose portfolios of Level 3 rubbish are correspondingly lower, are less likely to disappear.

Given the size of the overall figures involved and the excessive earnings that Wall Street's participants have enjoyed over the last decade, a taxpayer-funded bailout of Wall Street's titans would seem politically impossible, however loud the lobbyists scream for it.

In the long run, that is probably a blessing for the US and world economies.
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
1. Accounting fraud!
...that is what Wall Street is guilty of and the hedge fund managers have been using which in my book sets the true value of these stocks to ZERO! Even the Federal Reserve is part of the fraud by hyper-inflating the U.S. dollar and making unlimited funds available to these people to allow them to show value on their books where there is no value. These stocks are worthless to any and all serious long term investors.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. Wall street is a casino..nothing more..nothing less
Edited on Fri Nov-02-07 01:06 PM by SoCalDem
At least when you sit down to a slot machine in Vegas, you pretty much know what to expect, but the secretive Wall Street bookies are doing deals in secret, after-hours and are hiding the really ugly flops they create...until AFTER the CEOs get their trades in and pull the cord on that golden parachute they all wear these days,

These creeps are supposedly the CREAM of the CROP..the most savvy businesspeople on the planet, and yet everyday housewives saw the folly of the sub-prime nonsense..and we are supposed to just accept their lame excuses about "errors" and "boo-boos"... :grr:

and then pay them millions in BONUSES?

They should all be forced to give all that money back...

Anyone over 40 KNEW that an online, or on the phone, approval for 125% OVER the "appraised" value (again over the phone sometimes) of a house..on an interest only loan..to people making $25k sometimes (with little or no verification), was a VERY BAD idea..

Every time one of these money-bombs drops on us (usually during a republican administration) lots of people act all surprised and don't remember the LAST ponzi scheme they pulled on us all..

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tridim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 01:34 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. It's more of a flat out scam.. At least Casinos are bound by laws that guarantee..
a certain percentage be paid out in winnings. Wall street is a sucker's bet every time, unless you're an insider and then you can steal the money us poor saps invest in hopes of getting rich.
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nightrider767 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Yes, The Casino's At Least Have A Level Playing field
Or at least to the extent people are willing to become knowledgeable about the games. Not so with Wall Street.

Want to invest wisely? Do your home work. Study the fundamentals, read the articles.... !?!Damn!?! Looks like all that work I did didn't pay off after all!!! Since the insiders had access to that information before I did, and by the time I invested, the stock price already moved and I just traded on nothing.

I like the stock market though, even with it's short-comings. The biggest draw for me, is unlike casino's, you can actually create your own game.



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Buns_of_Fire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #9
17. On the other hand, Merrill Lynch won't give you free booze while you're watching the ticker! (n/t)
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
18. Wall Street is a Casino...and they are gambling with our economy & going to ruin us all!
Can you say Great Depression 2?!

:grr:
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flashl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-03-07 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
23. Thanks for saying what I suspected for years. n/t
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IronLionZion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 01:37 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. Wouldn't Sarbanes-Oxley get these guys if that's the case?
I trust them about as far as I can sling a piano.

America as a nation is way too reliant on stock prices. It's an inconvenient truth that young 20-something stock analysts run every corporation in this country, because they control the stock prices. Everything a corporation does these days is to please the stock analysts. Nobody gives a shit about sound business principles anymore.
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nightrider767 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Yes a HUGE problem
Our Companies build business models, not to run good companies, but to please the Wall Street "ideal". Which just as often as not, are opposite matters.

The whole crappy system is fueled by executive stock allocation and stock option programs, guaranteeing that the CEO's are virtual slaves to Wall Street. America's gambling Mecca.
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IronLionZion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. CEO's don't give a fuck about anything other than themselves
they just want to raise the value of their stocks, then quit and sell it. They often ruin companies during this quest with massive layoffs and senseless sell-offs and acquisitions. CEOs rarely last very long. It's like they are rewarded for failure.

The CEOs that are successful tend to think very long-term, like Lee Iacocca, Warren Buffett, and Steve Jobs, and I'm not surprised that the truly successful executives tend to be Dems and support social responsibility.
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conscious evolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-03-07 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
22. That or RICO nt
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
2. Very interesting article...
Thanks for posting it. Recommended.
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Blackhatjack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
3. 446k foreclosures and rising, and No Home Equity, and Credit Cards Maxed Out, MEANS...
The US Consumer is 'busted' and will not be able to service the debt load currently being carried.

This comes at the worst possible time for top CEO compensation to be maintained. Some of the people who have been pulling down the millions and billions are gonna have to take some cuts.

'True inflation' has been masked, and unemployment is bound to rise.

Food, gas, and utilities are going up while wages are continuing to remain low.

We are in for a jolt to not only Wall Street, but Main Street.

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nightrider767 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
4. Aha,,, So We Have A New Twist!
One thing criminals have in common, and it doesn't matter whether they're small time crooks in the state pen, or active money managers on Wall Street, is that they will always find a new slant. A new con.

I don't know if Enron invented "virtual assets". But this seems to be the next generation swindle. Take a real asset, and set any price that's convenient for you. I guess lieing and being a crook doesn't feel so bad when you have a choufer driven car and security.

I've seen that same game played out the other way, with intentionally undervaluing assets. United Airlines is now run by the new breed of corporate hacks. Customers satisfaction is at an all time low, but as long as the money keeps coming in, they're happy. The fact that people are hugely dissatisfied with the product means nothing.

But United played the same game during their bankruptcy. They had an asset now valued at over 4 billion dollars. But at the time of the bankruptcy, they not only didn't show it as an asset, they showed as a liability. SO in the end they ended up screwing their creditors, employees lost most of their retirements, and tax=payers had to pick up what was left of the retirement program through the Federally funded PBGC.

As for the CEO, Glen Tilton, he awarded himself the most lucrative benefits package of any airline exec.

The new American Business model.

The Turn of the Century Robber Barrons on back!

WHere's Upton Sinclair when you need him?

Cheers, mates.
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Ezlivin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. "Where's Upton Sinclair when you need him?"
He's working in the meat packing plant under the name Juan Gonzalez.

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sicksicksick_N_tired Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 01:59 PM
Response to Original message
10. Almost leaves me with the impression their magic acctg will be exposed.
I doubt THAT will happen.
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Joanne98 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 02:01 PM
Response to Original message
11. Goldman Sachs is full of shit.
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nightrider767 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. And Paying Dearly Today
CNBC is trying to cover for them, but the stock going down.
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Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 02:08 PM
Response to Original message
13. Open up your fucking books, Merill. Your damn time is up. n/t
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donsu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-03-07 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #13
19. read an article this a.m. that said Merill would do an Enron


(can't remember which site)
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Didereaux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-02-07 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
15. k/r
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-03-07 11:58 AM
Response to Original message
20. If this reflects the thinking of the Chinese and Japanese banks, we are all truly screwed.
This is bad news for the Middle Class. Truly bad.
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GETPLANING Donating Member (370 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-03-07 12:30 PM
Response to Original message
21. Hall of Mirrors is a better description
I have been a trader since 1998 and the one thing I have learned,(if anything) is that Wall Street is nothing more than teams of the sharpest minds in the country, equipped with the latest technology available, whose only goal is to screw each other out of as much capital as possible. Everything you see on the tape, on the news, in the paper, is carefully crafted deception, designed to either trick you into selling your asset, or trick you into buying theirs.
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flashl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-03-07 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Welcome to DU. n/t
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A HERETIC I AM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-03-07 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. When you say you have "been a trader since 1998", what does that mean, exactly?
Do you work on the floor of an exchange? Are you a licensed broker? Or are you using that term because you have an account in which you do stock trades for yourself?

Just curious.
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