Mother allegedly had sex with boyfriend in front of 9 year-old daughter to teach birds and bees

[Ian David]

Mother faces child-neglect charges
Allegedly had sex in front of girl, 9

By Associated Press | February 11, 2007

PROVIDENCE -- A Woonsocket mother and her boyfriend are headed to trial on charges they had intercourse in front of the woman's 9-year-old daughter as a way to teach the girl about sex.

Rebecca Arnold and David Prata have pleaded not guilty to felony child-neglect charges.

<snip>

When questioned by an investigator from the state Department of Children, Youth, and Families, Prata, 33, said he and Arnold, 36, had sex "all the time" in front of the child and that "we don't believe in hiding anything."

He said the girl would often be on the bed watching as the couple had sex.

<snip>

The couple is accused of "providing an environment that is lewd and depraved in a manner that makes their home unfit for the child to live in," according to court records.

More:
http://www.boston.com/news/local/rhode_island/articles/2007/02/11/mother_faces_child_neglect_charges/?rss_id=Boston+Globe+--+City%2FRegion+News

[trumad]

1. Birds and the Bees my ass---

they got off on it.

Stupid fucking people.

[Ian David]

3. No kidding. Who do they think they're fooling? n/t

[Ian David]

5. But he's a nice Catholic boy who graduated from The St. Mary School in 1991

Yes, he has a Classmates.com page.

[pnwmom]

23. Thanks for the anti-Catholic slur. The article contains no mention

of his religion, but you did your little investigation and you (unlike the reporter) thought this was important enough to bring up.

FYI, plenty of non-Catholics attend Catholic schools.

[Ian David]

25. I have nothing against Catholics, as a group, below the rank of Bishop or Cardinal.

But your point is well-taken.

[pnwmom]

36. Thanks for understanding.

And, by the way, I have plenty of my own problems with the hierarchy.

[Ian David]

40. I know that most Catholics don't like their hierarchy, either. And they sure didn't VOTE for them.

I really can't hold you responsible for the guys in the dresses and funny hats.

Still...

Have you considered joining The Unitarians or United Church of Christ?

[Clark2008]

47. I don't know about pnwmom, but I haven't thought about joining

that church because there ARE things about the Catholic religion I like: despite what you hear spewed out of the mouths of the Bishops and Cardinals, women are actully more involved in the church (and in positions of power, whether its recognized or not) than in a lot of other churchs. I like the structure and the prayers.

It's a shame the heirachy of the church has to do stupid shit like bad-mouth women and try to tell us who to vote for in elections.

[pnwmom]

50. No, and I haven't thought about becoming an Independent, either.

Both the Democratic parties and the Catholic Church have big enough tents to cover me.

And, as I hear so often on DU about the Democratic Party . . .

how will the Catholic Church ever change if it doesn't get pressure from people on the inside?

[Ian David]

53. You guys could always schism again. I predict VOTF will start a schism within 10 years. n/t

[pnwmom]

54. Now that is something I could seriously consider.

And I think we would take the Jesuits with us.

[qanda]

2. "makes their home unfit for the child to live in"

Ya think?

What awful parents!

[Jonathan50]

4. I know I'm going to get attacked for saying this

But before the modern era, sex in front of the children was the norm.

It still is in poor areas of the third world where entire families share a single room mud hut.

[Ian David]

6. And in some parts of the world, children are still breast-fed up until age seven

You may be right, but you're not going to be the keynote speaker at The Center for Missing and Exploited Children.

Besides, we don't know all the details.

Was it strictly under-the-blanket quiet sex, or were there demonstrations involved, like, "Now, watch how Mommy flicks the end of his penis with her tongue..."

[Eric J in MN]

12. I don't want American women to have their children taken away if they breastfeed

...for an age which is normal in the Third World.

[Jonathan50]

13. And in some parts of the world, children are still breast-fed up until age seven

And in some parts of the world, children are still breast-fed up until age seven.

And there is something wrong with that how?

You may be right, but you're not going to be the keynote speaker at The Center for Missing and Exploited Children.

I'm a grandfather.

[Ian David]

15. There's nothing wrong with breast-feeding chidren to age 7 where it would otherwise starve

I'm also not opposed to families who live in one-room huts or tenements having sex near their children if that is their cultural norm.

[Katherine Brengle]

30. The actual average age children are breastfed to worldwide is 4, not 7 --

using 7 is hyperbole and doesn't really help the conversation...

:shrug:

[Ian David]

33. Average, yes. But I remember reading that sometimes as old as seven.

And again, I'm not opposed to that if it's the cultural norm in a country where breast milk is essential to keeping a child alive.

[JackBeck]

44. A better number to look at would be the median.

A better indicator of what most people do.

[Ian David]

52. Or I could pull something out of my ass and get a job on Fox. n/t

[BlooInBloo]

56. ROFLMAO!!!!!

[JackRiddler]

18. Given that you can't actually answer your question...

("Was it under the blanket or did they give demonstrations?") this means that you don't know anything about this case other than what the newspaper reports about what the officials who brought the charges say (and what they in turn say the parents said). So you are merely putting your preconceived notions on display. Why don't you at least wait until you have a court record or a verdict to reference, before you try this case on an Internet thread?

[Ian David]

20. I'm saying I really have no idea what really happened, or how bad it really was. n/t

[TreasonousBastard]

16. I'm not attacking, just noting that...

this is a cultural thing-- somewhere along the line we decided that this is not a good thing.

I don't know whether it really is or isn't a good thing, but the cultural mores have been established, and they violated them, so they're gonna hang.

I'm no child psychologist, but somehow I'm thinking that the resulting kerfuffle over this and all the "experts" telling the kid how wrong it all was and how she'll be screwed up for life will screw her up for life a lot worse than just seeing Mommy get laid.

[slackmaster]

28. Welcome to the modern era

:nuke:

[Rock_Garden]

7. What kind of defense could their attorney possibly invent for this? n/t

[rug]

32. First, he has to commit the state to their definition of neglect in this instance.

Then he demonstrates that the facts of this case do not meet that definition.

Finally, he has to focus on whether the mental state of criminal negligence is present here.

[Rock_Garden]

41. Hey, thanks, rug!

You gave me a great answer. Sounds like the state might have a bit of trouble with the mental state thing, unless precedent had already been established with prior convictions for similar offenses (if those would be allowed).

[connecticut yankee]

8. Watch the Repukes

blame it on Clinton.

[Nimrod2005]

9. Are they Christians?

[Darth_Kitten]

27. Probably not very good ones if they are having pre-marital sex

;)

[Jonathan50]

42. Even Grandma had premarital sex, survey finds

Americans weren't any more chaste in the past, researchers report

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16287113/

NEW YORK - More than nine out of 10 Americans, men and women alike, have had premarital sex, according to a new study. The high rates extend even to women born in the 1940s, challenging perceptions that people were more chaste in the past.

“This is reality-check research,” said the study’s author, Lawrence Finer. “Premarital sex is normal behavior for the vast majority of Americans, and has been for decades.”

Finer is a research director at the Guttmacher Institute, a private New York-based think tank that studies sexual and reproductive issues and which disagrees with government-funded programs that rely primarily on abstinence-only teachings. The study, released Tuesday, appears in the new issue of Public Health Reports.

[liberalpragmatist]

55. I'm not sure

I'm not doubting that plenty of people from older generations had pre-marital sex. But that study posits that "even Grandma had premarital sex" when the highest age bracket they sample are people born in the '40s. That's pretty much Baby Boomers, so it's really no surprise.

Yes, an awful lot of boomers are grandparents now, but their grandchildren would typically be quite young.

[TXDemGal]

57. Premarital sex for decades?

Probably more like centuries. "A Midwife's Tale," a book by Laurel Thatcher Ulrich, provides a historical analysis of 27 years of diary entries by Martha Ballard, a late 18th century midwife in Augusta, Maine. Ulrich demonstrates that during Ballard's practice of midwifery, the majority of marriages in that region of Maine took place when the brides were either already pregnant or mothers. If anyone is interested, the book is a bit of a slog but pretty interesting for the light it sheds on day-to-day life in northern New England after the Revolution.

[Rage for Order]

43. Are they Muslims?

[PLF]

10. Probably a couple of Merck Lobbyists working for Rick Perry

[Ian David]

11. The guy graduated after four years of Catholic school, runs a computer repair business.

I haven't researched the mother, because she has a very common name, and wouldn't want to confuse her with someone else.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

26. Take your anti-computer-repairmen bigotry and shove it!

It didn't appear in the article, yet you felt the need to share it with everybody.

I'm fed up with anti-tech fanatics with an agenda!!!11!11cos(0)1!!

[EvolveOrConvolve]

29. LOL. Sweet :)

[Ian David]

34. Never trust anyone who asks you, "Why don't you have the original disc?" n/t

[undeterred]

48. I ALWAYS ASK THAT!

Because I love to make people mad! :rofl:

[Ian David]

35. But seriously...

If he went to a Catholic School, it's unlikely that he's a member of the Fuckinfrontofthechildrentyrian religion from Letthekidswatchistan, which makes it doubtful that he comes from a cultural background where this is the societal norm, as opposed to a kinky fetish.

But I could be wrong.

It's possible he converted to Fuckinfrontofthechildrentyrianism later in life.

[Dorian Gray]

14. Child abuse

That's awful. Crazy, even. I doubt that there is a far move from this to sexual molestation.

[proud2BlibKansan]

17. They were arrested 2 years ago

I wonder why it took so long to charge them?

[JackRiddler]

19. One can think of several reasons...

That's a very good question!

[WinkyDink]

21. Why the historical/cultural comparisons (BTW, links, please)? It is not

OUR culture.
E.g., breast-feeding a second-grade boy? I don't THINK so.

[Samurai_Writer]

22. And who knows what other kind of abuse went on?

I'd bet anything that there was more involved than just having that girl 'watch'. One of my dearest friends was severely physically, sexually and mentally abused by both her parents. The sexual abuse started when she was very young, being forced to watch her parents have sex. It only escalated from there. I won't go into details -- she told me the entire story once, having to let it out to someone, and it seared into my memory forever. The most horrible story you can ever imagine. She died at age 32 of complications from the flu, but I really think it was her parents' abuse that killed her -- she became an alcoholic (who wouldn't after all that) and her body just gave out on her. She left an 11 year old son behind.

Anytime I see stories like this, it reminds me of her. If the authorities know about the 'smaller' forms of abuse, you can bet there are larger forms of abuse going on they probably don't know about.

RIP, Melody.

[slackmaster]

24. Woonsocket?

:wtf:

There is NO WAY IN HELL I could achieve or sustain an erection with a child in the room.

I've had several lovers with kids (was actually married one of them for 10 years), and frankly I've found the awareness of a child in the same house to be a massive turn-off.

[Ian David]

37. There is no way I could acheive or sustain an erection in a town called "Woonsocket"

Or, for that matter, "Braintree."

And I'm dreading the possibility that we may move to a town called "Hanson," where I'll never be able to get that damn "Oom-bop" song out of my head.

[sweetheart]

31. prudes and puritains can be so stupid... casting their asparagus

The girl learned better than she would have from the locker room,
from someone she trusts and loves... but the nanny mommy's won't have it!
No, its a crime... because they know better about how to fuck up a kid.

[Ian David]

38. But then again, it's not like they did it once and called it a lesson learned

This was a day-to-day occurrence.

[dysfunctional press]

46. well, they teach math to kids for more than just one day too...

lots of things are learned through rote repetition.

[Ian David]

51. You think they had the Teacher's Edition of The Kama Sutra by the bed? n/t

[Marrah_G]

39. This is the same town where mothers have been charged

With helping their young daughters beat up other girls (2-3 incedents in the last month or so). I lived there for 12 years. It is a working class- poor city. Once it was a big industrial Mill City, but most of those are gone now. It is highly catholic (by birth not practice), the base population is french canadian, with a large mix of Vietnamese. It is not a right wing place. LOTS of people in this area go to Catholic school, especially if the public schools in their town are not good. Woonsocket has Mount Saint Charles, well known for its Hockey Program. Many students are not catholic and many of those who are are not practicing catholics.

My guess would be this is just another case of clueless people raising children with no concept of parenting skills or what is appropraite for them. I really hate to say it, but you see crappy parenting there alot. That is the main reason I moved from there. I did not want my children having to deal with those kids as peers.

[dysfunctional press]

45. so? what's wrong with the use of visual aids...? it's better than a filmstrip, imho.

is there a law against having sex in the presence of your own children?

[undeterred]

49. Were my parents criminally negligent?

They never talked to me about sex, not a word. Mom talked to my older sister, dad talked to younger brother no one talked to me. (About menstruation yes, about sex, not a word.) I learned in school or from other people or at the library. Were my parents neglectful? Criminally? I mean, who decides?

I think the above situation is a little weird but within the range of normal. Maybe counseling is in order, but not prison.