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CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:49 PM
Original message
Is your phone service connected via the Internet? Poor Skype users
How a million Windows users killed Skype

Skype's developers have just posted a fascinating explanation for last week's massive service disruption, in which millions of people were unable to log in to the popular Internet phone service for more than a day.

On the company's network-status blog, Skype explains that contrary to many rumors, it wasn't terrorists or hackers or other nefarious types who caused the system to go down. It was us: me and you and everyone else who loves Skype. More or less at the same time, last week, a huge number of us restarted our computers -- and all those simultaneous Skype login requests triggered a previously unknown bug in the software that "prompted a chain reaction that had a critical impact," Skype says.

But wait a minute -- why did everyone restart their machines at the same time? Because Microsoft put out some updates for Windows last week; people rebooted after installing the patches. The Windows updates were routine, and there was nothing in the updates that interfered with Skype -- it was merely that the patch caused folks to log out and then log in to Skype.

Skype operates on a peer-to-peer network. On such networks, data isn't sent through a central server, but is instead routed through many network nodes; peer-to-peer networks are hailed for stability, because they contain few critical locations whose failure could cause the whole network to come down. This outage, though, highlights an intriguing vulnerability in such networks: social behavior. A peer-to-peer network is nothing, after all, if a huge number of peers suddenly quit the system at the same time -- and who can predict when that'll happen?

Well, maybe you say that Skype should have predicted this; after all, Windows updates aren't unusual. The bug uncovered in last week's outage has apparently been lying dormant in the software for more than four years -- shouldn't someone have spotted it by now?

But this is a classic peak-load problem. Tens of millions of people logging in at the same time is a very rare thing, and it's unreasonable to expect any network to handle that well. I'd venture it's also bad management to spend engineering resources planning for such an unusual problem rather than what happens during ordinary use. Perhaps Skype could have run simulations to test the system in the event of a flood of login requests -- and, who knows, maybe they did, and missed this bug still.

And that's in the nature of bugs; through use and testing, we clean them out, but there are many others lying in wait. Skype has had four years of pretty good service. This outage, it says, "was unprecedented in terms of its impact and scope."

The company says it will put out "a number of improvements to its software to ensure that our users will not be similarly affected in the unlikely possibility of this combination of events recurring." That's good. Just don't expect perfection.

http://machinist.salon.com/
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FormerDittoHead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
1. I paid for 2 years in advance for the now out-of-business Sunrocket...
THAT'S made me a little gun shy...

Besides, even on the best of days, the outgoing bandwidth on Comcast is like trying to blow boulders through a cocktail straw - I was never happy with it.

Maybe my new fiber optic service will be better when it's available...
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CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. I have home phone service with Comcast
so far, so good.......
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FormerDittoHead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. I would imagine they "unblock" the "pipe" for their own, expensive service...
My inlaws have it too - they've been happy with it.

Sunrocket was like $10 a month, while it lasted. It seems the only good service is the "in-house" variety...
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Schema Thing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
15. you too, eh?
kinda sucks.

I bought myself and my daughter an amped mobile phone too, and now they are kaput. SunRocket at least had responsive customer service, even if the actual product had lots of glitches. Amped seemed to have spent all their money on slick advertising, and not a dime on actually helping their customers get the phones into service.
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BlackHawk706867 Donating Member (670 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
3. Yep, I depend on Skype as my phone service... It was kind of a bitch..
to have had it down for that period of time... But got thru it and realize that this is the risk when using VOIP as your primary service.

ww
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CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. were you refunded any money?
did they charge you for all of the "down" time?
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BlackHawk706867 Donating Member (670 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. I never asked for any, but the service is very cheap in any case...
My entire setup including USB phone for a Skype in # cost me less than a hundred bucks Canadian... for a years service.

ww
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King Coal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:56 PM
Response to Original message
5. Skype Yipe!
How do, Cat? :hi:
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CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Hi, KC
:hi:

:)

it's hot as the dickens here!!!!
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xultar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
6. WOW. I'm thinking of going with Vonage.
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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
10. Been with Vonage for 2 years
2 phone lines no problems with Vonage.
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CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. I was initially going to go with Vonage
but I have internet and cable with Comcast, so it made it easier for me to go with them.
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BlackHawk706867 Donating Member (670 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. I've had a few problems with Skype prior to this weeks outage, but...
Edited on Mon Aug-20-07 01:03 PM by BlackHawk706867
for the most part it has been reliable... I have been using Skype for almost a year now.

ww
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NashVegas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 01:04 PM
Response to Original message
13. I'm Sticking With My Land-Line
I know it's pretty luddite, but the thought of a power outage ...
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Hosnon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
14. I think the author was spot on here:
Edited on Mon Aug-20-07 01:10 PM by MJDuncan1982
I'd venture it's also bad management to spend engineering resources planning for such an unusual problem rather than what happens during ordinary use.


Skype was down for, what, a day? Assuming that the bug was difficult to find, e.g., hundreds of thousands of dollars, thousands of hours, the best business move was to leave it be and let it come to light on its on, as it did here.

Now the bug can be fixed. Of course, I'd want to know how much Skype lost during that one day...

Edit: Style.
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frylock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
16. just curious to know how many people here using VOIP also have wireless service..
and if so, why the need for the voice over line? I dumped my land line 3 years ago and use my mobile phone exclusively.
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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. No Cell Phone here
Dumped land line for Vonage. Don't have to pay local phone company and long distance company too.
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Mutineer Donating Member (659 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
17. A friend of mine has that-it sounds like crap when I talk to him
another has vonage. Sounds almost as bad and is very prone to frequent "drop-outs". I hate the bill that I have with the phone company but at least it sounds decent.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
19. I used to use Skype..back when it was in beta and was free..
I remember the day I posted about it in the lounge.. a bunch of us signed up ,a dn I actually talked to some DUers..

My new computer has no microphone , so I don;t use it anymore, but it was fun:)
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Jim Warren Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Me too
Used it for almost a year, they had free international days too.

Then ebay sucked it up.
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