"It is arrogance--a jumbo jet to carry her and her buddies back

[rodeodance]

and forth"---I think it was the Rep. (R) from FL. saying this of
Pelosi and the transportation issue. They did have Pelosi on earlier
but I was only half listening (local Fox TV station).

[Virginia Dare]

1. It was okay when it was hauling Hastert's fat ass around..

now all of a sudden it's an outrage...:eyes:

Yeah, I agree with Waxman, they all need to crawl back under their rocks.

[aceman2373]

9. why not set an example?

I don't understand the "the repukes did it so why shouldn't we" mentality. The people voted for change and this thing is getting way to much attention from the media. If we are going to be different, lets be fuckin different.
She could fly commericial like every other member of the house and then call out Hastert for his waste of taxpayer money. It would be a perfect example of the Government being returned to the people.

[Evergreen Emerald]

10. the reason, cited by Hastert

is for security. Pelosi, as was Hastert, is third in line to the presidency.

I am wondering if you were concerned about Hastert's use of the plane?

[Name removed]

14. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[A HERETIC I AM]

26. It is a perfectly valid reason for her to use one of those aircraft

She is INDEED 3rd in line for the Presidency and therefore should be accommodated. She is no longer merely the Representative from San Francisco, She is Speaker of the House of Representatives!

BTW, to say "Military Plane" conjures up images of a C-17 Cargo plane or a C5 Galaxy Instead of the more likely Gulfstream executive jet she is probably flying on. The fleet of planes at Andrews AFB where AF1 is based includes several different types of airplanes, among them:

89th Airlift Wing Aircraft

VC-25A "Air Force One" (Boeing 747) (2 Aircraft)
C-20B (Gulfstream III) (5 Aircraft)
C-32A (Boeing 757) (4 total Aircraft in inventory, website unclear as to how many at Andrews)
C-37A (Gulfstream V) (4 Aircraft)
C-40B (Boeing 737) (1 Aircraft) { 1 other Aircraft is also at Andrews, used by the 201st Airlift Squadron, DC ANG)


<snip> "As the host wing for Andrews Air Force Base, the 316th Wing is responsible for maintaining emergency reaction rotary-wing airlift and other National Capital Region contingency response capabilities critical to national security and for organizing, training, equipping and deploying combat-ready forces for Air and Space Expeditionary Forces (AEFs). The 316th Wing also provides installation security, services and airfield management to support the President, Vice President, other U.S. senior leaders and more than 50 tenant organizations and federal agencies.

The 89th Airlift Wing -- an Air Mobility Command unit and also a partner unit on Andrews -- is responsible for worldwide special air mission airlift, logistics and communications support for the President, Vice President and other U.S. senior leaders." <snip>
from;http://www.andrews.af.mil/main/welcome.asp

[Liberal In Texas]

13. The DoD won't let her fly commercial.

All she wants is a plane with enough range to get back and forth. BFD.

[tigereye]

21. and she is next in line, after all

:eyes:

I hate the right and their endless tiresomeness.

[bottomofthehill]

28. Every other Member of the House is not 2nd in line to the President

[MoonRiver]

34. I don't remember any Democratic complaints when fat Denny was doing it.

And fyi, this is a security matter, which was determined to be necessary by the REPUKE Congress after 9/11. The reason Speaker Pelosi needs a bigger plane than fat Denny is that she has about three times further to go than he did. It certainly would not help her security if she had to stop a time or two to refuel. But I probably did not need to tell you any of this.

:eyes:

[MoonRiver]

36. "WE?"

:rofl:

[Virginia Dare]

37. My comment was about the hypocritical repuke in question...

I was not addressing the broader issue as to whether the SOTH should be using military aircraft. If it's a security issue, then it's valid.

[flpoljunkie]

39. Pelosi's security requires a plane that can fly non-stop coast-to-coast without refueling.

What's so hard to understand about that? The plane the Pentagon has offered her can only fly non-stop coast-to-coast under "optimal conditions."

[oldtime dfl_er]

2. Typical Repuke lies

The plane she's using now can't even make it to the WEst Coast without stopping for refueling. That's just ridiculous.

[boobooday]

7. There you go again . . .

Trying to bring relevant facts into the debate. God, you're such a Fox-kill.

:rofl:

[Freddie Stubbs]

33. Is stopping to refuel a problem?

:shrug:

[Horse with no Name]

46. It is a security issue

Does Bush or Cheney stop to refuel in random places?

[ronnykmarshall]

47. Only when they are flying overseas.

And of course those are always pre-planned for security.

If this is all the Repugs have got to throw at Nancy .... they need to hang it up.

[Horse with no Name]

51. I thought they refueled in middair?

Maybe I am mistaken. Hey, it could happen.:)

[Ganja Ninja]

3. I'd really love to see a comparison of Bush's AF1 expenses and

Clinton's. I'll bet Bush's are more than twice what Clinton's were.

[ronnykmarshall]

45. We paid to fly his sorry ass back ...

to sign the Terri Shiavo bullshit bill.

[Ganja Ninja]

52. The guy has been running a continuous campaign for 6 years

and he's been flying around our tax dollars but I guess the right wing media hasn't noticed. He even flew down to Florida for an appearance at a NASCAR race but it seems right wingers only count pennies when it involves a Democrat.

[rodeodance]

4. The Repugs are just not going to let this dog die and the media is happy

to assist them.

[Rose Siding]

5. The head of House Security TOLD her to get a jet big enough to fly non-stop to SF

And this attack is coming from the WH:

WASHINGTON — House Speaker Nancy Pelosi accused the Bush administration on Wednesday of publicly mischaracterizing her need for a larger military aircraft to travel back and forth from the West coast.

She said reports filtering out into the media regarding inquiries about the use of a military plane nearly the size of Air Force One for her travel to and from Washington, D.C., shows a "misrepresentation that could only be coming from the administration ... one would wonder why the practice deemed to be necessary from a security standpoint would be mischaracterized in the press."
...
House Sergeant at Arms Bill Livingood, who is responsible for the speaker's security,....suggested Pelosi, who is second in the line of presidential succession, inquire about the use of a military plane. According to sources involved in the talks with Pentagon officials and Livingood, Pelosi needs a large enough aircraft to fly directly from Washington, D.C., to her home in San Francisco since stopping along the way to refuel poses unnecessary security risks.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3100566&mesg_id=3100566

[liberal renegade]

6. Republicans are like flies

all they do is eat shit and bother people....

[MuseRider]

8. I thought that was Music Majors but

I like this as well!

[liberal renegade]

11. music majors are peculiar

but not bothersome. I heard it said about cowboys, drugstore cowboys that is, not real cowboys...

[MuseRider]

22. I saw that someone

had scratched it into one of the stalls in the bathroom outside our practice rooms. I thought it was pretty funny.

Second best (sorry to hijack your thread for a moment) was the one my husband found on a condom machine in the men's room. This Gum Tastes Funny

That's all I got.

[zbdent]

27. That was me ... I had to

correct my phone number ...

;)

[Sal316]

12. Speaking of facts...

An aircraft capable of flying nonstop coast-to-coast will burn less fuel (per pound of gross weight) than one which makes one or more stops along the way.

Climbing through the thicker atmosphere multiple times is much less efficient than cruising through the thin air at altitude.

[TX-RAT]

18. range of a C20?

I thought a C-20 was capable of a coast to coast run.

[Hangingon]

19. It does have the range for coast to coast...

depending on the load.

[A HERETIC I AM]

29. 4250 miles

C-20 = Gulfstream III

Here is a link to a fact sheet on the C-20's at Andrews;
http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=87

[eagler]

15. As long as dems won't support a FAIRNESS DOCTRINE

this stuff will continue to take on legs and get bigger. Pelosi tried to get out the truth but very few heard it!

[frylock]

53. eggzaklee!

[rodeodance]

16. here a few previous DU posts on this issue:

Wed Feb-07-07 07:36 PM
Original message
Source: Pentagon Rejects Speaker Pelosi's Request for Military Aircraft
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=2858225&page=1

A source close to the controversy over the request made by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., for use of a military plane that can fly to and from her home district in San Francisco, Calif., without having to stop to refuel, tells ABC News that the Pentagon has rebuffed Pelosi's request.

The source says that Pentagon officials and the Bush administration have instead offered Pelosi use of the same plane made available to former Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Illinois: a C-20, which seats about 12 passengers and five crew members.

A C-20 can make the 700-mile flight to Hastert's Aurora, Ill., district easily but would generally have to stop to refuel to complete the 2,800-mile trip from Washington D.C. to the San Francisco Bay Area, depending on the headwinds.

Pelosi has expressed concern about having to stop and refuel, primarily for security reasons, her office says. Since 9/11, the Speaker of the House — second in line behind the Vice President in the line of presidential succession — has been able to use a military plane for travel, for security reasons.

In response to the Pentagon offer, Pelosi spokesman Brendan Daly tells ABC News, "We appreciate the Defense Department's continuing concern for the Speaker's security. We are reviewing their letter."

Bet this order came down straight from Chimpy or Darth Vader.
Wed Feb-07-07 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. CNN Champions Pelosi Smear, Covers False Washington Times Story Six Days Straight
I wish people would get their facts straight. Do you forget all the lies and smears of the last six years?

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/02/07/pelosi-smear


1) Dobbs: Pelosi “wants the U.S. Air Force for personal accommodation.”

FACT: Pelosi’s use of a military aircraft is about security, not “personal accomodation.” It was House Sergeant at Arms Wilson Livingood who initiated inquiries into the aircraft. “I advised Speaker Pelosi that the US Air Force had made an airplane available to Speaker Hastert” following 9/11, Livingood wrote, and “I offered to call the U.S. Air Force and Department of Defense to seek clarification of the guidelines .”

4) Dobbs: Pelosi “wants a plane that accommodates 42 people, private stateroom. … She could take a circus with her.”

FACT: Pelosi’s office says “it is up to the Air Force to decide what type and size of plane will be required,” and that “she has never asked for a plane or space on a plane to accommodate ’supporters.’”

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - --
http://thinkprogress.org/2007/02/05/pelosi-military-air... /

FACT CHECK: Washington Times Publishes False Report On Pelosi’s Use Of Military Aircraft

1) The House Sergeant at Arms, not Pelosi, initiated inquiries into the use of military aircraft. House Sergeant at Arms Wilson Livingood, who has served in his position since 1995, released a statement today clarifying the facts. He writes, “In December 2006, I advised Speaker Pelosi that the US Air Force had made an airplane available to Speaker Hastert for security and communications purposes following September 11, 2001.” Additionally, Livingood writes, “I offered to call the U.S. Air Force and Department of Defense to seek clarification of the guidelines .”

2) A larger plane was requested because Hastert’s plane required refueling to travel cross-country. The Washington Times says a larger plane was requested to accomodate Pelosi, “her staff, other Members and supporters.” That’s not true. In fact, the plane used by Speaker Hastert was too small for Pelosi since it “needs to refuel every 2,000 miles and could not make the nonstop haul to California. ‘The Air Force determined that safety would be best ensured by using a plane that has the fuel capacity to go coast-to-coast,’” a Pelosi spokesperson said.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Google is your friend.

[n2doc]

17. They won't be happy until she is taking Greyhound

And even then they probably would find something to scream about. Hey, idiot repukes, how about complaining about the 600 BILLION DOLLAR WAR BUDGET???? Pelosi's plane is in the rounding error costs, and she is the 3rd most important Pol in America right now. Maybe we should suggest that dead-eye Dickie travel commercial..."Flyin' the Friendly Skies" would take on a whole 'nother meaning!

[Strawman]

20. Typical repuke bs. Hastert traveled in John Engler's Oldsmobile

ya know. :sarcasm:

Their playbook never changes

[in_cog_ni_to]

23. She needs to call a press conference and call these rat bastards on their LIES. GO on KO's show!!!

She needs to play their game. Make them looks like the fools they are. Maybe go on KO's show and set the story straight. KO will let her talk and explain what the hell the repuke's are doing!

[Norquist Nemesis]

35. Send out the minions instead

Get surrogates out there to say, "Apparently, the Cons aren't very strong on security. What they're saying is that Speaker Pelosi, second in line to the Presidency, should take risk her security. Or maybe they're really just unconcerned about the security of a Democratic Speaker of House. That's irresponsible."

Rinse, repeat, and loop playback.

[fla nocount]

24. Dem.s don't fare well in small planes.

Paul Wellstone,Mel Carnahan, Jerry Litton, John Tower, Mickey LeLand, Ronald Brown and JFK Jr. make a short list. All died taking off or landing; can't really blame the lady for only wanting to roll the dice once per trip.

[MonkeyFunk]

31. John Tower was a dem?

[fla nocount]

42. Nope, got me

He was sitting on the truth of the Iran-Contra deal when he died. Another Repub., Sen. John Heinz who was associated with the same investigation died in a plane crash the day before Tower.

I've always associated Tower with LBJ, my bad.

[MonkeyFunk]

49. no worries

I, for one, don't believe "they" kill their enemies by coordinating plane crashes. The list of "victims" is just too random, and many of their real opponents go on unscathed.

Small planes crash every day in the US, and people who fly small planes regularly have a much higher risk of dying in a plane crash.

[budkin]

25. Glenn Beck is having a shit fit right now

His entire radio show has been a bile spewing Pelosi smear fest. What a worthless piece of shit that guy is.

[Norquist Nemesis]

32. Just goes to show that Beck doesn't believe Bush's BS or his own

about "They're trying to KILL US!" Unless, of course, he's saying it's perfectly fine and a 'good' act (vs. and 'evil' act) to jeopordize the security of the Democratic Speaker of the House.

[treestar]

30. Projection at its finest

[Raffi Ella]

38. meanwhile...

Bush is about to attack Iran and more soldiers have been killed along with countless Iraqi civilians while Republicans refuse to even DEBATE the war issue.

[MoonRiver]

40. Hey you're off topic. Get with the program!

The OP is all about bashing Dems for bogus issues. No substance allowed!

[Raffi Ella]

41. lol, right, my apologies.

Dems could use this issue though and turn it around and throw it back in their faces SO easily.I don't know why they aren't or if they are I sure as hell haven't heard it.

It's instances like these that Dems need to take advantage of.

[MoonRiver]

44. Seriously, I agree.

I think Pelosi should demand to appear on Lou Dobbs, one of her main bashers, and read the Homeland Security requirements for how the SOTH is supposed to fly.

[sweetheart]

43. rent a bloody gulf stream and expense it

why are we hearing about silly things, making the lawmakers in to the news
rather than what they are doing.

[blogslut]

48. CNN's report on it was just as bad

I think it was lovely Candy Crowley that helmed the CNN report. I remember her using words like "big issue", "fly (Pelosi's) family and friends", "greed"...

No bias there, Candy sweety.

[VP505]

50. Watching the House

floor debate, as expected the usual lineup of RePukes are whining about Pelosi's transport, but with a new twist. Now all of a sudden they are worried about Global Warming and the effects Pelosi using a "big jet" spewing all kinds of stuff into the atmosphere will have on the enviro. jeez, what a bunch of whiny ass wankers!