Are Human's Naturally Evil?

[bryant69]

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[atreides1]

1. No

But then again they are not naturally good either. It all depends on the individual, the circumstances, and how they adjust to their own particular situations.

[bryant69]

3. So we are naturally a-moral?

[JFN1]

37. I believe we are naturally amoral

A great saying, and my own experiences, back this up:

"Goodness without wisdom always accomplishes evil." - Robert A. Heinlein

And consider - morality is so often circumstantial. We all have to eat. If you haven't eaten in a week, and a cute little puppy crosses your path, and there is no other food around that you can detect, I guarantee you're going to have puppy steaks for dinner. Is eating the puppy, in these circumstances, immoral? So if you believe it would be moral to eat the puppy in these circumstances, should I then think you're immoral for doing so, since from my outside circumstance, with my own belly full, I can comfortably predict I would never eat a puppy?

Wisdom comes to the rescue, thankfully, to help us through such moral dilemmas... :yoiks:

[Az]

2. Definitively no

In fact our basic wiring tends towards good. We are wired to be compassionate and empathetic to one another. But isolation and ignorance can lead to distrust and defensiveness which in turn lead to cutting others off from moral consideration. This is why when leaders want to take a people to war they must first make the enemy appear inhuman and a threat. Otherwise people will not be likely to agree to kill another people.

We can also learn to be greedy and override our natural sense of connectivity. But that is more influenced by Corporations and advertising telling us to think of our selves and compete with our neighbor rather than help them.

[RaleighNCDUer]

12. I absolutely agree. nt

[Speck Tater]

13. We may be wired to be compassionate and empathetic, BUT

generally speaking we are empathetic only with members of our immediate tribe, social or family group. Our fierce dedication to save and protect our own tribe also motivates violent intolerance of outsiders who are seen to threaten our tribe. This natural in-born tendency can be repressed to a certain degree when times are good and there is food and water enough to go around, but when times get tough, and bare survival becomes an issue, the veneer is stripped away in a hurry.

[Az]

30. Ignorance and isolation

Those are the keys to understanding evil. It is awareness and connectivity that allows us to understand that others deserve our sense of moral connection just as much as those near us do. The more you learn about others the more you can internalize them. The more you cut them off or vilify them the easier it is to disconnect them from our sense of morality.

[AngryAmish]

21. We are social animals

Social pack animals. We create hierarchy and know when someone is not of our pack. Therein is the problem of authoritarianism and racism.

We are changing and yes evolving (in a DNA sense) away from violence and towards a more trusting nature. Civilization would not be possible if we had the same savage genes as out hunter/gatherer ancestors.

We are neither good nor bad by nature: we are. Understanding our nature and fighting against the less civilized instincts is the challenge for us.

[MonkeyFunk]

4. No

we're just naturally human.

[Posteritatis]

5. Who needs broad brushes when you've got a big damn paint roller? (nt)

[bryant69]

6. Actually i'm using one of them spray machines

The paint just sprays out - no need for brushes at all - more powerful than a fire hose. Thanks for asking.

Bryant

[undergroundpanther]

7. Some are

Psychopaths, narcissists,authoritarians bullies and control freaks they are evil.And yeah they are born that way, psychopathy can be recognized as young as age 2..
The rest of us are mixed with evil more or less because we live in a evil world where the living prey upon others to live. That kind of predatory parasitic way to exist can corrupt the best of us if put under enough threat or stress,people can get damn evil.
But being under duress and doing something evil does not make a person evil.

The state of being evil all the time is in who you ARE your personality type..

Sometimes stuff at first glance looks evil but it is good and vice versa.Sometimes it's ignorance or reaction..but true evil is beyond reactions..it is deliberate, chosen and wanted.Certain personalities among us lack the ability to police their actions from within they have no conscience,and they wear a mask of the good to cause cognitive dissonance to get away with doing evil.

I blame the way the world IS for evil.I think this world is evil.It might look pretty sometimes but it is not really alive for it dies all the time too,.For some of us we realize this gilded jail and state of living/dying hurts and it's sick and ghastly.And un fixable.For me,this mess is not my true home.And I for one await my chance to escape again. And go to my real home..My source..

But just because I hate this world does not mean I have to hate the good imprisoned here with me or do asshole things that make it worse. Discernment and cultivating an impeccable character that is NOT like this world as best as you can,is defying the world. So caring fighting sharing speaking truth the best I can,this is what I do while I wait to get out of here.

[BlooInBloo]

Sigh. No. Humans are naturally short-sightedly selfish.

[Speck Tater]

8. Not evil, but stupid and lazy, which produces the same end result. (nt)

[Az]

9. Consider Socrates defence

He was accused of teaching his students evil. But he countered why would he do that for they would only turn around and conduct such things against him as soon as they had the chance.

Society would not exist if we did not turn to each other to help each other. That is what society is. An expression of our basic goodness. Good and evil in the end are an expression of how an action impacts individuals or society. If we were naturally evil we would all be holed up in caves throwing rocks at each other instead of working together.

[JacquesMolay]

10. there is no evil, just different motives.

Evil is a social construct that varies from culture to culture.

[bryant69]

11. Can actions be evil? Or evil does not exist at all?

Bryant

[JacquesMolay]

24. 'Evil' is just a designation for 'not permitted'...

... it associates the desire to do illegal things with a mindset, usually with the understanding that the 'evil' acts as some type of 'force'. As such, it's trapped up in myth, and those vary from culture to culture. As the poster below notes, some of those myths may share some common ground, but there are plenty of customs of judgment that are unique to cultures. Gang rape has been doled out as punishment to 'dishonored' women in Pakistan and Afghanistan. South American indian tribes used to leave twin babies out by the river to die, as they thought that twins were 'evil'. I should say that I find these practices savage and abhorrent. To me, the argument comes down to which customs are backward or progressive. Evil is in the mind of the group that determines what it is in it's particular social context.

I have spoken.

[RaleighNCDUer]

18. I disagree - there are acts which could be called 'evil' which are

so regarded in every society. Murder. Torture. Rape. Incest. There is not a society in the world that does not condemn those practices, though sometimes the definitions get distorted to the point of being unrecognisable.

Ultimately, evil is that which breaks, or breaks down, the social contract. As a tribal animal, men are hardwired to cooperation for survival. That which makes cooperation difficult becomes classed as 'evil'.

[Mythsaje]

14. Only those who don't know the difference

between a plural and a possessive.

:evilgrin:

And those of us who point it out.

;)

But, no. I don't think so.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

15. "Evil" is a societal/cultural construct. As is "Good".

We humans tend to attach morality to what is essentially a societal/cultural need. Thus we end up with blatant ambiguities like murder is "evil" but killing to "defend" your country is "good". Or, lying is "evil" but telling your friend that her ugly child is beautiful is "good".

"Life in Lubbock, Texas, taught me two things: One is that God loves you and you're going to burn in hell. The other is that sex is the most awful, filthy thing on earth and you should save it for someone you love." - Butch Hancock

[bryant69]

17. So if society told me that killing muslims was the right thing to do

It would be moral and "good" for me to kill Muslims?

Bryant

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

20. See the crusades for precedent. Or, more recently, the jihadists or Bush.

When I was in boot-camp some captain told us that we should ready to kill Cubans (the bogeyman of the day) because, and I quote, "Castro is a commie and has a dirty, smelly, beard."

The world is full of monuments to "heroic" murderers who were justified morally for killing.

[bryant69]

23. Do you think your captain was wrong?

Or do you think it doesn't matter?

Why do you put heroic in quotations? They were heroic murderers if they were acting according to what they believed was good.

Bryant

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

26. I just thought he was insulting.

I'm not sure I understand the point you're trying to make.

I consider the idea of killing people for whatever reason repugnant. Is that a "moral" judgment? Of course it is, based on what I consider moral/immoral. But, society condones murder for any number of reasons and calls it "moral". Just as it condones almost anything that it also condemns as "immoral" under specific circumstances.

Just as it's considered "moral" in some societies to mutilate young women to protect them from "immorality". Or, stone women for being "immoral". Or, gas Jews, behead "unbelievers", or lynch blacks for insulting a white woman. The perpetrators being convinced that those acts were the height of morality.

[bryant69]

27. Well of course I'm aware that Humans have done evil in the name of Good

throughout history. But once you say that Good and Evil are nothing more than societal constructs, doesn't that preclude you (or me) from saying any action is morally repugnant?

Bryan t

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

34. Not at all.

But, I believe that we, as individuals, are the arbiters of what we believe to be "moral", "immoral". I wasn't about to shoot Cubans (or, later) Vietnamese, because society said it was "moral" to do so.

Nor do I think I would acquire a child bride, or stone a woman to death, because society considered it a "moral" duty to do so.

We all decide on what is or isn't "moral" and define our own morality. i.e. Here I am, drinking imported Russian tea, smoking a cigarette, looking forward to a nice evening of a good meal, living in comfort, while people are dying of hunger, of cold, of disease. Am I "immoral" for doing so? Or, am I "moral" because I donate to charities that alleviate hunger, homelessness, and disease?

Are you "moral" because you protest the war in Iraq, or "immoral" because you pay taxes that buy the weapons that kill Iraqis?

Is a mosquito "immoral" when it bites you? Are, you "immoral" for swatting it?

My contention is that cultures and societies define morality according to what they see as necessary but we, as individuals, make the decisions of what constitutes our own "morality".

[lumberjack_jeff]

16. No. Morality is hardwired into us.

Most neurotypical people have to consciously override it to do something they know is evil. Doing this is more common in some people than others, but it's not because their moral code is 180° out of whack. They know right and wrong, and rationalize themselves into doing wrong.

[Douglas Carpenter]

19. I have lived all over the world and traveled all over the world and have

been exposed at first hand to every kind of darkness and cruetly..but to quote Anne Franks; "In spite of everything, the vast majority of people are good at heart".

[insane_cratic_gal]

22. Naturally? No. Inherently?

At times I believe we can be quite nasty to one another.

We live in a world full of me me's and ego, if we could all do what is best for the person beside us regardless of sex, age, weight, color, political stance, income, etc I'd like to the think the world would be a little more improved.

[Exiled in America]

25. Humans are inherently niether "good" nor "evil." They simply are, then their actions define them.

[agent46]

28. humans evil? sure but...

Humans are a potent complex
of every possible consciousness.
We are whatever combination of aspects
we decide to express at any time.
Other animals are like individual wave lengths
while humans are the whole spamn dectrum...
er...I mean the whole damn spectrum.

:silly:

I think we're an evolutionary bridge
between the beasts and the angels -
an uneasy blend of divinity and instinct.
Being human can be a bitch sometimes but
we're capable of so much beauty
I think it just has to be worth it.

O8) :mad:
:grouphug:

That's why we shouldn't give up on ourselves.
Evil of every kind - petty to monstrous
always gives rise to its opposite eventually.

:headbang:

We just have to be patient
and we have to help it along.

:toast:

That's why the world needs you.
:bounce:

[Taverner]

29. I dunno - are sharks evil? are raccoons?

Are any other animals who have adapted well and sit on top of the food chain evil?

[dipsydoodle]

31. We are the only animals

apparently willing to destroy their own environment. That's evil.

[napi21]

32. Every humnan has both good and bad. Most control the bad thoughts

and ideas.

[Odin2005]

33. People generally desire to do good, but there is also a potential for sociopathy in all of us.

IMO people cannot be inherently evil. Immoral actions are the result of ignorance, upbringing and life experiences(which is sometimes the same as ignorance), or mental illness. Hitler's evil acts, for example, are the result of all three. Racism is a mix of ignorance and upbringing. Before the rise of enviromentalism in the late 60s most environmental destruction was the result of ignorance (and thus the Environmentalist Movement originated as a way to eliminate that ignorance).

[MrSlayer]

35. Evil is just a term people put on things they are afraid of or dislike.

It's all subjective.

[Hosnon]

36. No. I do not believe that evil - in the religious sense - exists.

Getting pleasure from the pain of others is about how I'd define the extent of "evil" in this world. And to be evil requires every action one takes be in furtherance of that goal.

I do not believe anyone like that exists. However, there may exist some people with a majority of "evil" but they would be the exception, not the rule.

So, no, humans are not naturally "evil".

[mitchum]

38. Humans are naturally bestial, but not evil

[ecstatic]

39. Depends on what traits are reinforced I think

Left unchecked, I think most people would act in a way that produces the most rewards.

[JTG of the PRB]

40. I think we are, at least to a miniscule extent, naturally evil.

That isn't to say that we all act on the evil inside us, because clearly we don't or we would have sher anarchy. I'm just saying, there is a dark side to every last one of us. Those who cannot see the darkness in themselves aren't looking hard enough. Just because we may have evil inside us at some deep level, that doesn't make us bad - merely human.

[KoKo]

41. Just read the "Beatitudes" about what "Jesus Said."

Trust me....I'm no Fundie...but I am a Christian...but it's hard in these times to get to the essence of what Jesus Said...that for over 2000 years he could have lead a movement that got corrupted in MESSAGE.

Anyway...

[KoKo]

42. Link for "Beatitudes" from Catholic Site...I'm a Protestant....but I found them good as a starter...

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02371a.htm

[Douglas Carpenter]

43. one of the teaching of Islam that I do agree with

(I am not a Muslim) But this teaching about human nature I think is quite correct, is that "ALL people are a mixture of angel and devil". This differs from conservative Christian doctrine of "total depravity - but for redemption" or certain Christian-humanistic views that people are inherently good.

[Douglas Carpenter]

44. I would add that I believe it is -- The Will to Power -- that brings out the evil

in people. I think this can be observed everywhere from a kindergarten playground to work place politics to struggles over global dominance.

[porphyrian]

45. Evil is a human construct, not a universal truth. - n/t

[mondo joe]

46. "Evil" is a useless word.

Oh, except in manipulating situations and people - it's useful there.

[The2ndWheel]

47. Just like there is no actual up or down in space

There really isn't good or evil. We just are. We're products(for lack of a far better term) of evolution.

[bryant69]

54. Than each action has an equal moral value?

What about species survival morality?

Bryant

[SmokingJacket]

48. Most humans are good.

Though a sizable minority are not, and they do a lot of damage.

Also, good humans who **don't think**, even though they're good and make the right decisions when they do think, fuck things up too.

[Gruenemann]

49. Not good or evil, just don't know when to use apostophes. n/t

[The Inquisitive]

50. No, naturally chaotic.

Humans seem naturally chaotic to me rather than evil. Chaos describes the human condition, I believe as population, and for some individuals and in certain instances we act with complete disregard for consequence on immediate needs and impulses. We seem to be predictably unpredictable, as in there is a discernable pattern to our collective insanity.

I think evil is an incredibly weak concept. The good/evil dichotomy is extremely poor in creating a sufficent framework to describe individual and collective human behavior. For many traditional theists morality is a rather concrete and undisputable concept. For atheists the concept of morality becomes much less rigid, making evil a difficult concept to define.

[Withywindle]

51. No - we're just apes with giant brains.

Smart, adaptable, self-aware, imaginative - but still animals. No more inherently evil (or good) than a gorilla or a crocodile or a sea anemone or a parrot. (And no, I don't believe in any "Fall" - we are exactly as we were "meant" to be, as we've so far evolved to be. But we could do better. And I don't think that's contradictory.)

Because of our big brains, though, we have the potential to do more damage to our planet (which every living thing depends on) than any other creature if we don't also use our potential for foresight, and that's pretty damn close to evil in my book.

[flvegan]

52. Evil? No. Selfish, yes.

It's the action upon selfishness that might prompt one to call someone "evil" but I don't think that most of the time it's intended.

[WindRavenX]

53. Evil is just a social construct, so, no, we're not "naturally" evil.

NT

[The Vinyl Ripper]

55. Just watch how children treat someone who does not fit into the group..

Without a considerable amount of instruction the great majority of children will be remarkably cruel to anyone who is considered "different" from the norm.

Not all children, true. But I'll bet it's more than half.