You know I was strongly in favor of "turning the other check"

[Joe for Clark]

Inviting a bipartisanship. I think we had to try.

Well, we tried and got our teeth kicked in.

That is it for bipartisanship attempts for me.

We tried - now lets see where "tar and feather" politics takes us!!

I think - end of the day - the vote yesterday will be written on many republicans political tombstones next year.

We did try though.

Joe

[Kagemusha]

1. Gotta admit, Hagel and Warner supporting the surge was a spectacle

Not that I personally bought their schtick in the first place but, that was beneath and below my depressed expectations...

[Joe for Clark]

2. I still tthink Hagel was genuine.

He knows what a war costs - for real.

I am seriously disappointed in him right now. He knew better.

Joe

[YellowRubberDuckie]

3. Fucking Republican Hypocrites.

They treated the democrats like shit for 12 years, and now they want to be treated nicely?! What the fuck, you assholes! You hypocrites. Didn't anyone ever teach you the golden rule?! Those bastards need to go down. They need to be taken down a notch.
Duckie

[Joe for Clark]

5. It had to be done - they had to be given a chance.

I agree - we tried and they bit our hand. Medicine will be very bitter.

If we didn't try - how much more bitter would it be??

Anyway - we did try and do the right thing.

I really think that is what counts in the end - that you try.

Joe

[Nevernose]

16. In the immortal words of Jesus Christ, Our Lord and Savior:

"Someone hand me a whip. There's a problem in that temple I got's ta attend to."

I was inferencing.

[mmonk]

4. Sometimes, it's difficult to shake hands with a rattle snake.

Best to get the hoe.

[Rageneau]

6. The only reason to turn our cheek is to reach into our shoulder holster.

[Joe for Clark]

7. You ever really talk to anyone in a fight about regret -

What that really means to them in life??

I have - most of my life.

You know what is telling - the nightmares. I never met a combat pilot that had nightmares about what happened to them in a fight. I knew many that had nightmares about what they did in a fight.

You know what I mean??

You can only really regret that which you can control - and they do. It is so sad.

It is a consequence of war - all wars.

That is exactly what this whole thing is really about.


Joe

[Tinksrival]

8. Hi Joe

Did you read Wes Clark's speech at the Dem Winter Meeting? I thought of you after I read it cause I thought you would have liked it.
He has fought hard to get Dems in power and I think he is getting pissed that they are not using their power to reign in Bush.

If he runs again it will be to send an important message that needs to be heard, AGAIN! (IRAN NOW) Why won't people listen!

If you hadn't read the speech here is the link: http://securingamerica.com/node/2197

I hope you have heard again from Troy! Take care!

[Joe for Clark]

12. Hi Tink -

I read it.

I think so highly of Clark. He is probably the best military mind produced in the US in more than 100 years. SO sharp.

Troy is alive - the most anyone can ask now.

You know he asks the same questions we do - why do we send them out for "target practice" in a war they can't win - who the hell is sending them out for such a thing.

God, he asks good questions.

You know - he would have gladly died for us in Afghanistan - that is where he was supposed to go all those years ago. That is why he signed up at all.

No one will ignore Clark anymore you know - Maybe some did in 2004 - not now.

Personally I want him in the SOD spot - I am afraid our army really is breaking at this point.

I think he can build it - and I doubt too many others can get it back up - I really do.

I hope all is well with you, man.

Joe

[Beelzebud]

9. Democrats always stick their hand out just so Republicans can spit on them.

Why oh why did anyone actually think the Republicans would suddenly start playing "fair"?

Reid needs to get ruthless with these bastards.

[helderheid]

10. Is that like a penny for your thoughts or giving your two cents?

:evilgrin:

[Joe for Clark]

18. It is always about our two cents worth -

Maybe this one is more.

[Nikki Stone1]

11. Turning the other cheek just gets you a broken tooth

Wonder why they are being so careful.

[meldroc]

13. Turning the other cheek is actually a gesture of defiance.

That's how Jesus meant it.

Somebody hits you, you turn the other cheek and demand he hits you AGAIN, to show that mere violence won't break your resolve.

So by all means, this should be in our playbook.

[Joe for Clark]

14. I think he clearly did mean it as such.

We give people a chance to hang themselves in our way.

And they did.

Yep - means exactly as you suggest.

Hell, it is even american.

Joe

[Nikki Stone1]

17. No, he did not

Look at the context. (See above)

http://etext.virginia.edu/etcbin/rsv2www?specfile=/texts/english/religion/rsv/rsv-pub.o2w&act=text&offset=4570100&textreg=0&query=cheek+turn

[Joe for Clark]

19. Nikki - I think he did mean it that way -

I think so because he says later the we should render unto Ceasar that which is Ceasars -

Implies the opposite by extension.

I think - in my most humble CCD learnings.

Joe

[Nikki Stone1]

20. Your opinion doesn't change the context in which the "other cheek" remark occurred

The "rendering unto Caesar" quote comes from a different part of the New Testament and is not related to the Beatitudes, The Caesar remark has been interpreted in different ways as well; to some, it is some kind of clever resistance, to others (like Robert Eisenman, professor at Cal State Long Beach) it indicates a Pauline influence, which Eisenman interprets as collaborationist (with Rome.)

CCD teachers are not usually experts in Bible history and can be wrong about many of their facts. (I lived through them too.)

[Joe for Clark]

22. I surely agree with you about CCD teachers.

Mostly I didn't pay too much attention to them.

But conceptually - it is the core of the religion, isn't it?

Joe

[Nikki Stone1]

15. Not correct. Look at the context: The Beatitudes

38: "You have heard that it was said, `An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.'

39: But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also;

40: and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well;

41: and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles.

42: Give to him who begs from you, and do not refuse him who would borrow from you.

43: "You have heard that it was said, `You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.'

44: But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

45: so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.

46: For if you love those who love you, what reward have you? Do not even the tax collectors do the same?

47: And if you salute only your brethren, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same?

48: You, therefore, must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.


http://etext.virginia.edu/etcbin/rsv2www?specfile=/texts/english/religion/rsv/rsv-pub.o2w&act=text&offset=4570100&textreg=0&query=cheek+turn

The context is about going above and beyond "An eye for an eye", going beyond being nice to one's friends and hating one's enemies. It is about showing kindess and/or non-violence to enemies.

[marmar]

21. Agreed. Never try to pet rabid dogs.....

I'm with Mike Malloy on Republicans: Miserable, lying, rotten bastards - all of them. (the elected ones, anyway)

[JacksonWest]

23. My theory is that there should be no cheek. Only do what is right for the people.

As it turns out, you can't expect most Republicans to get in line anyway. There's no need to play politics with them or fight dirty. I think most Dems feel dirty just sitting in the same room with them.