Most Canadians think we suck, & who can blame them?

[Philosoraptor]

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/06/16/1920/

Who can blame Canada for thinking we suck? EVERY nation thinks this now.

--------------------------

Canadians view the current U.S. debacle with both sadness and in some instances, outrage. Once widely admired in this big country, the U.S. is now seen as a leading threat to world peace.

In a recent Time magazine poll asking whether the U.S. was either a “good,” or “bad” force, 26 of the 28 countries polled responded negatively. Canada was among them with more than 70 percent of Canadians questioned saying they thought their American neighbors acted illegally and immorally in its invasion of Iraq..

Much of the Canadian resentment is directed at President Bush and his circle of advisers. Canadians share the opinion of many Americans that the invasion was initiated on false premises. Canadians also feel The U.S. pays little attention to Canada and that the U.S. expects its support for American actions to be forthcoming without debate.

Another, and this an early complaint against Bush, was that the President shortly after 9/11 paid tribute to countries who offered support and sympathy. More than a dozen countries came in for tribute. There was no mention of Canada, and yet Canada to its own peril accepted the arrival of hundreds of overseas air flights as U.S. airports were closed . Towns and cities such as Gander, Newfoundland, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Moncton, New Brunswick housed and fed thousands over a period of four or five days. Further shocked by the tragedy and in sympathy with its neighbors, religious services were carried out in hundreds of Canadian towns and cities. More than 100,000 are estimated to have attended the tribute on Parliament Hill in the capital city of Ottawa.

[acmavm]

1. Hell, I think we suck.

[Cha]

74. You don't suck..I don't suck

but the bushits do and Canadians and the rest of the world except albania, of course, know this.

How's Steve Harper doing?

[Spazito]

79. harper, like his idol georgie, has falling poll numbers

Canadians don't (gasp) trust him, go figure eh, lol. He did his version of "Bring it on" to the Premiers of the Atlantic provinces and Saskatchewan, daring them to take his government to court and......at least one, and probably more, is ...bringing it on!

[Cha]

83. Good on ya, Canadians,

Spazito!

[The Straight Story]

2. They hate us because we keep beating their teams at hockey, ask ottawa :)

[Philosoraptor]

3. & our inferior bacon & soda water.

[Mandate My Ass]

8. beer too

we suck at beer-making compared to just about anybody. :toast:

[Philosoraptor]

10. like sex in a canoe...

fucking next to water.

[EstimatedProphet]

54. Nah

Sam Adams, Anchor, Sierra Nevada, Fat Tire, Clay Pipe, Goose Island , Bar Harbor, Red Hook, Yuengling, Leinenkugels, Bells...I'll take any of those any day of the week over anything produced by Molsons or Labatts.

[Mandate My Ass]

63. I actually like most of the brands you mentioned

but to Canadians, I believe, Bud, Coors and Miller are the only recognized American brand names. I tried Sam Adams Summer Ale yesterday for the first time. Yummmy. :toast:

[EstimatedProphet]

73. That may have been true 30 years ago, but it isn't now

And Sam Adams Summer Ale is a treat!

[Philosoraptor]

70. I like all the Sam's flavors, but love Cream Stout.

[aquart]

13. What's wrong with our soda water???

[Philosoraptor]

15. It's Chinese.

[getmeouttahere]

16. Yeah, but Anaheim has more Canadian-born players on their team

than Ottawa, so ponder that! The real comparison should come with international competition, where Canada has topped the U.S. (and in some cases the rest of the world) for several years now (World Champsionships, junior championships, a Gold medal in Salt Lake).

[devilgrrl]

23. How 'bout those Swedes and Fins?

Helping all those NHL Canadian teams win games.... Sundin, Alfredsson, Koivu, the Sedins????? ;-)

[getmeouttahere]

77. Yeah, Koivu!!!!!

Next year, Koivu will help his team win the Cup!!!

[Canuckistanian]

47. Your Canadians beat our Canadians

Did you see the winning game?

It was like a big family re-union when they shook hands afterwards.

The only thing we were pissed about was that it happened in California, where it was barely noticed.

You know what the city of Anaheim did for their Stanley Cup winning team?

Nothing. No parade, no rally.

[getmeouttahere]

78. That's why I didn't want Anaheim to win....

because I knew it would barely be a blip on the radar in Anaheim. I mean, come on, no parade??? I lived in L.A. for 13 years and I know how little press hockey gets down there. Sometimes during the regular season a college basketball game with teams from outside the area would get better TV ratings than a Kings or Ducks game.

It was nice to see guys like Giguere, Beauchemin, Rob Neidermayer have their day.

[melody]

4. Those who genuinely think the American people suck are misguided

Or bigots.

There is a tide of old hatred flowing toward us that has nothing to do with reality or
real history. Canadians are as indoctrinated by that mindset as we are by Fox News.
It's the way the mechanics of history keep us separated and powerless.

[Philosoraptor]

It's the bush effect.

How can they respect the people of America when they have such people as 'leaders'?

[melody]

11. They should grow up and realize the people in power are always corrupt

It's the nature of primates.

Canadians would be doing the very same thing in the US' position.

Beyond which fact, they ought to realize that we didn't elect this monster -- he staged a
coup. But since old enmities exist, it's much easier to merely hate us. They're somewhat
indoctrinated with the Evil US mindset in school there, also, so it's hardly a new phenomenon.
They're just more vocal about hating us now because it's so popular.

[sharp_stick]

17. They should grow up?

they've done nothing wrong. You say their indoctrinated, where do you get that?

Like I said in a previous post I think most Canadians can and do distinguish between the people of America and the Government.

[melody]

21. That kind of innocent, we're good/they're evil mindset is child-like

My friend Wendy tells me she was taught about the "savage cruelty of American soldiers" during
the War of 1812, though they were never taught that the reverse happened. It's very similar
to the US Civil War perspective from one side of the Mason-Dixon versus the other.

[sharp_stick]

24. With all due respect, I think your friend Wendy is full of it

I say that as someone who spent 4 years in Canada as a Graduate Student and now spends a good amount of time there each year there with my in-laws.

While a grad student I audited two Canadian history courses because I was dating a Canadian (now my wife) and I wanted to impress her with my interest in the place. Not one word about the savagery of the Americans during the war of 1812.

[melody]

25. With all due respect, I'd suggest my friend Wendy has as valid an experience as yours

Not all textbooks are written with uniformity in mind.

You're obviously strongly sympathetic toward Canadians due to your family ties
and that's a good thing, but just as there are bad elements to the cultural
psychology in the States, there are an equal number of negative traits in Canada.
Domesticated primates are frighteningly uniform.

[sharp_stick]

28. Her experiences may be valid

buy yours are not.

Perhaps you should take a trip before making sweeping generaliztions about a country based on second hand information.

[melody]

29. Oh, please

My experiences are based on my knowledge of the way people interact. I'm making no
"sweeping generalizations" about any country, merely countering your own. If you honestly
don't believe there are equal, though different, problems in both countries, that's what
suggests to me bias, not my own perspective.

I have been to Canada and know many Canadians. I own property (and plan to retire to) Washington,
near the Canadian border, if I'm required to give my bona fides in order to have an opinion you
won't find emotionally objectionable.

[sharp_stick]

41. What does anything you say have to do with my original point?

You're "knowledge" to this point was based on "Wendy" and some non-political learning of all things Canada. Now you say you've been there and know a lot of Canadians, I don't care.

My original post, that you didn't like for some reason, said that Canadians are able to distinguish between Americans and the American Government. I don't think Canadians hate Americans, I think they hate the American Government. Perhaps you don't care for that statement because it doesn't fit the weird "child-like" vision you have of Canadians but really I have no clue what you could be going for.

You then added the "equal though different problems" line in a later post which now seems to be the central point to your thesis and which I never argued against. Much like your anthropological statements about primates and the "fact" that Canadians are child-like, this pretty much came out of left field and is meaningless in the context of the discussion. Really, it's a poor debating technique to try to change the topic halfway through.

You said that Canadians are indoctrinated into believing that America and Americans are bad and that is what I am calling bullshit on as that is not taught in Canadian schools. Your friend Wendy may have had a psycho teacher tell her that the Americans carried out all kinds of war crimes on the poor hapless British in the war of 1812 but that hardly makes for a case of indoctrination. You also claim that "they", meaning Canadians, should grow up and realize that power corrupts. Calling a people indoctrinated and then saying they should grow up are both sweeping generalizations.

Sorry this has gotten surreal, I'm going to wash my car

[melody]

49. I don't think you were following my point at all

Washing your car is probably more productive.

[sharp_stick]

84. Your point was in itself pointless

so no shit, washing my car was a lot more productive.

[EstimatedProphet]

85. Well. mine are

I lived there for 2 1/2 years in the 80's, and I encountered very similar attitudes in person to what Melody is talking about.

Canada is a very diverse place, as diverse as the US is. Maybe you have been fortunate to not encounter attitudes like she described. Maybe that's because you were in an area that was more accepting.

[breakaleg]

27. Your information is categorically incorrect. Child-like? Please.

[melody]

33. How is an Aristotelian, either/or mindset not child-like?

Show your work. I've already demonstrated it's a simplistic viewpoint base on primitive
psychology. If you're going to attack the argument, a statement is not proof.

[breakaleg]

35. Where is your proof that Canadians have a either/or mindset?

Is it based on knowing one Canadian of having gone their on vacation? That hardly makes you an expert.

[melody]

36. I didn't say that, please re-read my remarks

I made a very clear statement of opinion.

[breakaleg]

37. "my friend wendy"... What if I said to you that my friend Sam once asked me who the President of

Canada was? Am I to infer that all Americans are idiots or would that be a stretch?

My point is the "my friend Wendy" bit carries very little weight. If you are going to make such statements, you should gather better information.

[melody]

39. I've already given all the necessary, deductive examples, if you'd see them

Are you suggesting that Canada is perfect and doesn't have an equal number of problems?
We have Fox News, you have the Canadian Media Guild (that's a tiny example, but one with
which I'm familiar). I find it truly amazing that merely suggesting that Canada is equally
flawed (while acknowledging the US' problems) gets this kind of response here. If you had
written in defense of the US with similar alacrity, you'd be accused of being a freeper.

[sharp_stick]

14. I think most Canadians distinguish between the people

and the Government of the United States. Canadians by and large probably know as much about our Government as we do, they watch the same television we do.

Although I found out to my horror a couple of years ago that they dub Super Bowl Ads with really lame local stuff. No wonder my Brother in Law now comes down to our place to watch the Super Bowl.

[melody]

18. I doubt it

It seems to me there's a need (due to the old them-against-us primate mindset) to see the US as some awful
thing beside gentle, benign (and comparatively powerless) Canada. They've made great gains off of our
missteps.

I was taught all about Canada, with no political spin. We weren't told they were "enemy sympathizers" or other
nonsense -- we were given an overview from an objective perspective. My Canadian friends report a very different experience
in Canadian schools.

[Spazito]

31. Here is a link to a very clear poll

NOTE: The questions relate to US policy, George Bush and NOT to the US public. Unless YOU equate George Bush, the US administration as one and the same, which most progressives emphatically do not, you might want to revisit your "perspective", however, I doubt you will.

http://www.ekos.com/admin/articles/3nov2006domestic.pdf

[Amonester]

19. 70% Of Canadians Hate Bu$che/Chainy & Their PNAC Gangsters

70% Of Americans Hate Bu$che/Chainy & Their PNAC Gangsters

How is that a tide against us??

[melody]

22. The problem is 70% of Canadians also hate us the culture

They don't see that we all have the same view of these clowns. It just
benefits them (and by "them", we fall into this same either/or primitive
perspective) to see us as the problem, which further supports the idea of
comparatively benign Canada.

Nationalism is an international disease, I'm afraid.

[Spazito]

26. Bull! What a load of crap, imo

Canadians know more about the US, it's policies both historically and currently than do the US public about either their own country or others. If you cared enough to research how Canadians feel about the people of the United States as opposed to the government of the US you would not have posted such tripe. Canadians DO NOT hate the people of the United States, they do, however, despise the leadership of your country and, I suspect you know that but would rather post the following:



"There is a tide of old hatred flowing toward us that has nothing to do with reality or
real history. Canadians are as indoctrinated by that mindset as we are by Fox News.
It's the way the mechanics of history keep us separated and powerless."

for reasons of your own.

Sad.

[melody]

32. LMAO!

I love it -- all I do is suggest that Canada has the same problems we do, and I get this response.
If that doesn't speak to equal problems with nationalism, I don't know what does. Thank you for
the demonstration.

Sorry, anyone who uses words like "bull" and "crap" has already discounted his opinion in my eyes.
Welcome to my ignore list.

[Spazito]

34. Actually, if all you did say was we have the same problems

I would NOT have responded using your own words. I have NO problem being on your ignore list, I will continue to read your posts with interest and respond accordingly.

[whosinpower]

42. Your wrong Melody

Canada does not have the same nationalistic problems that you do. I can say this definitavely, because I am Canadian.

And no...we do not hate your culture. And no, we do not hate Americans as in the American Public.

Your culture is almost a part of our own, so closely intertwined we are.....food, music, entertainment, goods and services, commerce all cross the border freely. I think that 75-80 percent of our corporations are owned by American companies....more and more each quarter. In fact, there are those up here who worry that America would invade Canada,(control our oil) and my response is "What for? They invaded us years ago....and they own us now. There is no need to militarily control us." I am not saying this in anger....it is the truth that most Canadians accept and get on with their lives. And what we want in our lives, is very similiar to what most Americans want. A good job, good health, a safe environment to live and grow our families. Peace.

But we also enjoy/endure being able to see our southern neighbors in ways they cannot see themselves....because nationalistic glasses fog their view. And it saddens us to see a once great nation go schizophrenic.....paranoid....broken. It saddens us because America was supposed to be the ultimate role model of democracy and everything that is good in the world....but that is a fallacy. Yours is not a democracy - it cannot be without oversight and consequences. And guess what - American people are no better than the german people were....and they got tricked too. American people are not more savy, not more intelligent, not more wise, not more smarter. American people are just the same as every other "people". The American public puts up with the abhorrent acts of a president because the public knows no other alternative.....or the one alternative is unthinkable....just as it was with the german people. You aren't "bad" but you are the same....and if that is anti-american, then that is your rose colored glasses fogging reality.

Were you aware that America has been AT WAR for more years than it has not been? And that is the way of your economy. Like it or not....your prime export is weapons and war.

Our leaders up here have tried the nationalistic jingo in terms of our Afghanistan committment....but it just does not work within the Canadian mindset. Afghanistan has nothing to do with Canada's security or safety. Afghanistan has nothing to do with Canadian wealth or economic wellbeing. The only reason our troops are there is because of your leaders, and ours trying to suck up to you. That is a truth that we all bear up here. Do we hate you for it? No. Do we hate your president for it? ABSO-FREEKIN-LUTLY. Do we hate our leaders for kissing up to George so hard, pucker marks have become skidmarks.....YES WE DO.

But, at the heart of it--we do not feel superior to you, we do not feel better than you. YOU SCARE THE HELL OUT OF US, BECAUSE WE KNOW HOW EASY IT IS TO BE FOOLED. WE WATCHED HOW IT HAPPENED IN THE RAMP UP TO THE IRAQ WAR. WE WATCHED IT HAPPEN TO OUR CLOSEST NEIGHBOR, OUR FRIEND, OUR ALLY, OUR FAMILY. And it sickens us with how powerless we are, and how trully powerless the American public is....in America....the shining city on the hill.

[Philosoraptor]

45. The Good Germans.

I agree, we've learned nothing at all from defeating the Nazis, in fact, the bush family is using the Nazi playbook, and of course we know about prescott bush and Adolph Hitler and the bush family's 60 year business/friendship with the bin Laden family.

We've lost our way.

[melody]

50. this isn't about "wrong" or "right", it's about errant nationalism of all kinds

Your perspective is nothing but further evidence of my point. If I took out "Canada" and replaced
it with "America", I'd be arguing with the points just as avidly. You've been taught from the beginning
that your country is superior. We all get similar indoctrinations. We should, however, try to see
around them.

I've seen freepers go on and on about Canada being small, useless, powerless, envious, etc. I've heard
right-wing people in my family call it a "barnacle nation". And they're incorrect also.

I have continually been amazed on this board that, whenever somebody dares to bring up one point about
Canada that may be problematic, one is assailed with commentary about my own culture and people that would
never be tolerated if it wasn't directed at Americans.

But just as I would point out the US has vast problems, Canada has its own similar array of problems that
are distinctive, its own, but equally problematic.

[whosinpower]

56. Have you been taught in the Canadian system???

You are making assumptions Melody. I've been taught that Canada is superior - this is what you are infering. You are stating that we are indoctrinated the same as Americans are to feel superior. This is not the case. This is where you are wrong. Oh - I suppose to even suggest a thing makes proves your point that I somehow feel superior. The point I was trying to make is that the American people have reacted to their leadership just the same way as any other people. Doesn't make us, or any other nation superior....it makes you the same as us. And that scares the hell out of us, how easy it is accomplished....even moreso, because we were led to believe that it could never happen in American with its governmental system and checks and balances. You don't like hearing that do you? You are the same as us. We are the same as you.

You were the one who brought up culture, sweetie. I specifically stated that your culture was never the problem, has never been the problen and probably never will be the problem when it comes to Canada/US relations. And yet, you have the gall to tell me that this would never be tolerated if it wasn't directed at Americans.

So, spin away, and try to twist my words as it suits your perceptions. You brought up culture and stated that we, as Canadians were against your culture. This is not true. Unless.....your culture is defined primarily by war. If you feel this is the case....then I guess you are correct. We hate it.

Canada does indeed have its own set of identity issues. But do not try to fling accusations that Canadians hate your culture and that we have been indoctrinated to think so. We don't hate your culture. We hate your friggin wars!!!!!

[melody]

57. We are all indoctrinated.

Anyone who is so inculcated by their nationalistic perspective isn't about to be open
to the facts. We are all indoctrinated. There are national review boards in most
European countries put together to "oversee" the historical perspective taught children
in school. We learned all about "good, old Father Serra" and the California missions
without being taught about the murder and subjugation of Indians along the way. Because
the headmaster of my school was half-Canadian, we had a more benevolent perspective of
Canadians taught to us. Just so Canadians are given their own frame of reference. It's
usually called the "National Pride Coalition" or some other more palatable term for
propaganda.

[muriel_volestrangler]

66. No, this is about 'wrong' and 'right' - in the world's opinion

You are the one saying this is nationalism. OK, we'll take the opinion of other countries:

A majority of people believe that Israel and Iran have a mainly negative influence in the world, a poll for the BBC World Service suggests.

It shows that the two countries are closely followed by the United States and North Korea.

The poll asked 28,000 people in 27 countries to rate a dozen countries plus the EU in terms of whether they have a positive or negative influence.

Canada, Japan and the EU are viewed most positively in the survey.

In January, the BBC World Service revealed polling results that suggested most people think the US has a mainly negative influence in the world - and that the numbers had increased significantly in the last couple of years.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6421597.stm

See, it's not just about nationalism - some countries really are thought well of. But the USA isn't one of them, at the moment. Canada is.

[melody]

67. The world doesn't have an opinion

Of course the US isn't well thought of -- that was my point. There are
all manner of people who've always hated us as a people. Those who hate us as
a people are being given higher profile
now because of the actions of Bush and his group. They're going
to naturally be more vocal. The anti-French morons in this country
got a lot of spin out of French opposition to this insane war. If you're
talking government, I'm not going to disagree with you for a
nanosecond -- I despise everything we're doing these days. But
when you start talking about national opinion to varying degrees, you're
discussing the opinions of naturally biased people about people in another
culture. Ignorance, nationalism, etc, will always come into play.

The Spanish thought the natives were making "nonsense sounds", because they
didn't understand our language. Just so, the anti-US Europeans don't like us as a people
because we don't play by the game rules they play by, not because of any objective
assessment of the facts. We are "loud" ... yes, and my Cherokee forebears were
"immoral" because they wore "lewd clothes". lol

Consensus doesn't matter -- millions of people CAN be wrong. Was a time, millions of
people hated Jews for being Jews.

Once the neocons are out of office, I hope there's enough of my country to sweep
back together, but we were hated before and we will be hated after by those who
wish to hate us. As I've mentioned before, my own theory is that Bush and Co
represent an attack by our enemies against us so who created the current situation
is open to debate.

[muriel_volestrangler]

71. Are you really trying to blame non-Americans for Bush?

"my own theory is that Bush and Co represent an attack by our enemies against us so who created the current situation is open to debate"

Who do you mean by "our enemies"? I hope you're not trying to pass the buck for your politicians.

And what do you mean by "the world doesn't have an opinion"? "The world" here means "the people of the world".

You have ignored the point that many countries have positive views of other countries - so you can't just blame 'nationalism' for a poor opinion of the USA. You also ignore that the opinion of whether the US is a good or bad influence is going down - you can't just blame it on a long-standing hatred or 'natural bias' for which there isn't any objective evidence.

[melody]

72. I'm not ignoring the point, you're not seeing mine

The world isn't an entity, except in some philosophical abstract sense. All we have is an individual
assessment of that supposed global viewpoint which means it's never going to mean any more than each individual's
opinion.

We're not to "blame" for these people any more than the common, ordinary German was responsible for Hitler.
The dynamics happened in the upper 1% of society, which is where it always happens in primate societies,
human or not. The most powerful are the first to be corrupted. It only makes sense.

The neocons are an international phenomenon. In fact, it's arguable that it was first a British phenomenon
that spread (named after poor Henry Jackson, who was just a myopic optimist). I think we're seeing evidence
of it in everything that calls itself "Tory" or "conservative" in any nation.

These people started here in the 1960s and they are spreading your way. If you don't want to believe me now,
you won't, but it remains the case.

[mudesi]

58. What's wrong with bull and crap?

Are you trolling?

[melody]

59. I was wondering when that attack would be used

Yeah, I've got a star next to my name, been a resident for five years, a member for three,
I've made several thousand posts and donated to every fund drive. Yup, sounds like a troll
to me.

"Bull" and "crap" are fine in a barnyard, but when that's the best you can do to prop up an
argument, it says more about the poster than the matter at hand.

[mudesi]

61. There really wasn't a thing wrong with Spazito's post

Using "bull" or "crap" as in "I don't think your assertions are true" is not exactly a new phenomenon. But I suppose I'm slightly biased against you, because you obviously have something against Canada.

All I know is that your statements about Canadians in general are not true at all, but I understand why you may believe them, because a few of my American cousins sometimes say things that are similar. I have to remind them every once in a while that their perceptions are "bull". ;-)

[melody]

65. You think that because of your own biases

Anyone who makes either/or "all" statements, as you have with Americans, is doing that,
and it doesn't matter what your nationality is.

Now please have the last word and let's cease this ludicrous thread.

[Canuckistanian]

48. Unfortunately....

Good or bad, we all tend to judge whole groups of people by the actions of a few.

We know that all Americans aren't bad. But we sure see our fair share of those asshole Americans here.

They're the loud, obnoxious ones demanding immediate service, complaining bitterly about French on signs and just generally showing ignorance about our culture, laws or habits.

And, as such, many Canadians tend to base their opinions on these kinds of Americans.

But, I tell people, there ARE quiet, friendly, intelligent and unassuming Americans.

They just blend in with the native Canadians so well, we never notice them.

[melody]

52. And I've met Canadians that would make you cringe

They sit here and go on and on about our culture in ways that we simply don't accept here.
They spew commentary that is so baseless and arrogant, I don't even try to explain the biases
in their perspectives. Michael Moore seems to find a lot of them and put lollipop mikes in their
faces. Also, I've seen Europeans say things at the Pow Wow I attend (I'm part Cherokee)
that are hysterically funny. One poor German fellow had to be saved from being punched out by a Cherokee
elder (a three times decorated and disabled US military veteran) when the German guy asked him
why he "dressed like an American".

You sit there with your own prejudices and problems, not seeing that they distort your viewpoint as much
as any "ugly" American's viewpoint is distorted.

[Canuckistanian]

53. What did the Canadians say?

And what objectionable things did a Canadian say to Moore? I watch his movies and the Canadians seem to be reasonable to me.

Is there something specific?

[melody]

55. The Canadian said ...

And let's give him a name, his name is Edwin, that "all you Americans are lazy ... you don't work and collect
welfare and yet you talk about the socialist state". He then went on and on recounting proved-to-be-false
urban myths about the US (and no, I'm not going to recount those ... they're out there to be read on the web).

He's a bigot. He is. I pointed this out to him, as I'd point out to any American calling Canada a "barnacle
nation". And your agreeing with his points doesn't make them correct. Given your comments about my people,
I'm not surprised you agreed with all the Canadians in Moore's films (which I love, by the way, but he has an
adolescent fixation on Canada and Europe).

[Amonester]

60. Alright, "Edwin" is one of the 30% minority.

Please, do not generalize your bad "encounter" with one of THEM on all 70% of other Canadians.

Thank you.

And Michael Moore has family in Canada. :^)

[melody]

64. I didn't for a moment, why do you think I did?

Sometimes I wonder if people read posts past the first line.

I have family in Canada, too, however Moore is still an American, last I checked.
And he's always been starry-eyed about the old empire days. lol

[Karenina]

69. Get off it and get a clue!

AMIS (as a collective and present company excluded) SUCK!!! :evilgrin:

[Random_Australian]

76. ..... and the other 25 of the 26 countries too, I bet.

Or, you could look a little closer and see the OP had nothing to do with what Canadians think of Americans. It was about what Canadians think about America.

Simple.

Canadians indoctrinated to hate the U.S. ?

Yeah, right. I'll believe that.

..... after I believe dems are indoctrinated to hate the U.S.

..... which will be shortly after I see Satan skating to work.

And given that there is no such thing as satan, I kinda doubt that's gonna happen. ;)

[MADem]

5. I have to say from my interactions that they think our GOVERNMENT sucks.

Not us.

But then, the vast majority of "we, the people" think our government sucks as well.

So really, we're in accord, and closer than ever!

[treestar]

6. If I weren't American, I would probably think we suck, too

Some of the attitude thrown out into the world as ours makes me ashamed of us, at least in the last 6 years or so. We're like the self centered person in the room - makes everything about them and demands constant attention and thinks everybody else is just a prop in our drama.

[DFW]

7. A friend of mine used to be an important Canadian Foreugn Service officer

And I can only confirm the OP, sadly to say.

I should add: as far as our current government is concerned.
The Canadians are not idiots. They can distinguish between
Bush and America. I only wish we had been as discerning in 2004.

[TahitiNut]

9. I remember when Canada was more conservative than the US - with "blue laws" and social oppression.

... at least compared to what I regarded as "normal" in the US. My! How times have changed ... and we've moved towards fascism in leaps and bounds while Canada has nearly become a model for human rights and civil liberties.

[Canuckistanian]

51. Tell me about it

As an example, let me tell you about what it was like going to a liquor store back in the early '60s.
Of course, all liquor stores were government owned. Here in Ontario, it was the LCBO (Liquor Control Board of Ontario).

Here's the procedure for procuring ONE bottle of booze.

1. Go to the catalog section to decide which brand to buy. I think there were pictures. Look up the product code.

2. Fill in a small piece of paper with the product code.

3. Stand in line.

4. Hand in your paper to the unsmiling, uniformed clerk.

5. Show identification if you looked anything under 30 years old. Pay for the bottle.

6. Clerk disappears into the back, comes out with the bottle in a plain brown wrapper.

And all of this was done in near silence. I remember as a kid thinking it was like a hospital or something.

[ananda]

12. lol

I think we suck too. I think I suck for being a part of all the suckiness around.

Sue

[getmeouttahere]

20. I'm Amerkin, and I think we suck!

We've allowed this to happen. Just like the Arab in "Putney Swop" I say, "When does the revolution start???"

[Fredda Weinberg]

30. I love Royal Canadian Air Farce

Canadians think *they* suck ... it's an honored to be considered.

And with my local climate warming, I might just visit soon and scout for real estate. Woot!

[Cleita]

38. I realized one day that most of my friends are Canadian even

if they are ex-pat. There is something to their logical thinking that clicks with me that I get with only a few Americans. They certainly can see where we don't make sense and how rude we are. We really are rude.

[Prophet 451]

40. So do most Brits

The Bush admin is a big part of it but really, he's the whitehead on the prevelant American arrogance that the rest of the world sees and Americans resist (often violently) seeing.

[Forkboy]

43. Well that's ok...they're still cool in my book.

Who the hell can blame them? Only a nation of idiots would think America is actually doing something useful right now.

[moondust]

44. Nobody likes an arrogant bully.

Except maybe his/her fellow arrogant bullies and their fools.

[kitty1]

46. As a Canadian, I can tell you that Bush and Cheney.....

are the culprits behind this pervasive image lately. I myself know as a fellow du'er, that not all Americans are impressed with the global monopoly game that this administration is intent on.
Unfortuneatly though, the MSM is the only place that the majority of Canadians get their info from, and the impression from that is less than flattering.
Basically, the Americans in general are looked upon as being arrogant, overbearing and controlling. The shoot from the hip mentality is displayed as a pervasive trait here. The main point of contention I think is this Go it alone, do what we want attitude at times when it comes to international matters. Not coming on board with various agreements and treaties, or ignoring the same. Whether it's the environment, weapons proliferation, Criminal court, etc...
Iraq needless to say, was an insurmountable mistake that to many sealed their already negative opinion of the U.S.
The behind the scenes corrupt secretive deals and workings of the government with the CIA is another sore point. The bookshelves are full of this subject matter alone.
We Canadians on the other hand are very far from perfect, and have work to do ourselves on image. We've been lambasted internationally for the way we deal with domestic problems such as poverty, environment and other issued too.
It's too bad the the U.S. is painted with this negative broad brush by so many people that don't the real sentiments of Americans out there.
They would never guess that over half of you want Bush and Co impeached for example. And that not all of you want to save the world while picking it's pockets at the same time.
You guys have achieved a lot of good needless to say. Be proud!

:)

[Elspeth]

62. What? They never got over the South Park movie?

:D

[Adelante]

68. Heh heh

Another one of those kick me, I'm American threads. I love 'em.

[CHIMO]

75. "Geography has made us neighbours; history has made us friends."

"Nothing is more vital than the unity of the United States and Canada," says President John F. Kennedy in his address to Parliament. The U.S. president encourages Canada to join a coalition meant to increase military ownership in the Cold War era. Though President Kennedy's speech is a serious one, he still manages to charm Canadians during his two-day visit. Newspapers write about his "Florida-tanned figure" and "smiling first lady."

Kennedy's Parliamentary address is met with frequent bursts of applause, cheers and standing ovations. It's because his speech is studded with eloquent turns of phrase. He unveils his famous aphorism:

Members of Parliament interpreted remarks on increasing military ownership as a dig at the Canadian government. Prime Minister Diefenbaker had been wavering for over a year on whether to acquire nuclear weapons.

http://archives.cbc.ca/IDC-1-73-676-3868/politics_economy/presidents/clip4

[Siyahamba]

80. Most Canadians think the US goverment sucks

Not the US people.

[Madspirit]

81. Canada is Right

Aside from Melody's hand wringing above...(hey, add me to your ignore list too)...we deserve all the hatred the world has to offer us. We are bullies, warmongers, imperialists and our country is a theocracy. I view us with hatred and sadness too...and lots of fear. The whole world had sympathy for us on 9/12 and Bush ruined that completely. We are rightly reviled.
How many Iraqis have we now MURDERED?
Lee

[Breeze54]

82. What else is new?

:shrug: