TYT Interviews: Jane Hamsher On How Liberal Groups Are Being Silenced By...

[ihavenobias]

Run time: 13:43 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GLjUUwpvLM   Posted on YouTube: September 09, 2009 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: September 11, 2009 By DU Member: ihavenobias Views on DU: 5544

 
Note: After you watch the above video make sure you read Cenk's new article at Huffington Post, . And then watch this - .

Summary: This video is from TYT's new YouTube channel, . Cenk talks to Jane Hamsher of http://firedoglake.com/ about the Van Jones 'resignation' and how many progressive institutions have been directly and indirectly pressured with the threat of a loss of funding for going after Blue Dogs. You can .

Also Watch These 5 Clips You May Have Missed:

1)-

2)-

3)-

4)-

5)-

PS---TYT is now on Twitter: http://twitter.com/TheYoungTurks

[democracy1st]

1. K & R for later

[TankLV]

2. People should watch this one - it explains a LOT...!!!

Cenk gets it RIGHT - AGAIN!!!

[CherylK]

3. K & R, I want to see this on the front page!!!

:kick:

[ihavenobias]

32. I agree, it deserves to be there.

We'll see.

[burning rain]

4. Looks like the Turkophobic unwrecking crew's been beaten back for now!

Jane Hamsher's just plain sexy.

k & r

[ihavenobias]

6. Apparently Rahm Emmanuel has an account at DU!

I saw a couple of unrecs earlier.

;)

[ro1942]

10. joe wilson

and we are talking about what a problem he is

[ihavenobias]

11. Good point, that's much more important than this.

;)

[jgraz]

5. This is a really important interview. Please take the time to listen.

[slipslidingaway]

7. Listening now - knr nt

[slipslidingaway]

8. "What they wind up doing is giving liberal cover ..." n/t

[ro1942]

9. broken

boy do we have broken gov. big business in total control.

[Cowpunk]

12. Fascinating stuff

Kicked and Recommended

[slipslidingaway]

13. Great interview - HCAN was formed in 2008 with over 40 million...

and have become a dominant voice in the health care debate.

The 2007 Jacob Hacker plan was titled "Health Care for America" and many groups endorse the plan. All the major candidates come out with some variation of the public option plan (which keeps the for profit companies in business) that is why we heard Edwards say Hillary had copied HIS plan. Kucinich held his ground on pushing for a national, not for profit system and they ignored the issue in the debates.


CAF Blog Chronicles Impact of Hacker Health Care for America Plan on the Evolution of the Edwards and Obama Health Proposals

Health Care for America
By Roger Hickey on January 11, 2007 - 4:14pm.

http://www.ourfuture.org/files/documents/evolution-of-the-healthcare-debate.pdf


In 2008 'Health Care for America' Now is formed and pushes the idea of a "public option" and at the same time basically says that a single-payer, not for profit system would never pass.

As Kucinich says Kip Sullivan, the author of the bait and switch articles has figured out the real story.


Bait and switch: How the “public option” was sold
Posted by Andrew Coates MD on Monday, Jul 20, 2009
by Kip Sullivan

http://pnhp.org/blog/2009/07/20/bait-and-switch-how-the-%E2%80%9Cpublic-option%E2%80%9D-was-sold/

"...Representatives of Health Care for America Now (HCAN), the organization most responsible for popularizing the “public option,” repeatedly describe the House and Senate HELP committee bills as “strong” or “robust,” always without any justification for this claim, and have repeatedly failed to warn the public that the “public options” they promote today are mere shadows of the “public options” they endorsed in the past. On July 15, the day the HELP committee passed its bill, Jason Rosenbaum blogged for HCAN:

The Senate HELP Committee has just referred a bill to the floor of the Senate with a strong public option.

Searching the websites of the organizations that serve on HCAN’s steering committee – AFSCME, Democracy for America, Moveon.org and SEIU, for example – one will find not a shred of information that would help the reader comprehend how small and ineffective the “public options” proposed in the Democrats’ bills are, nor how different these are from the one Hacker originally proposed. Yet these groups continue to urge their members and the public to “tell Congress to support a public option.”


Thanks for posting :)

[slipslidingaway]

14. For others - this is about more than health care..much more! n/t

[ihavenobias]

31. Thanks for the links. n/t

[slipslidingaway]

35. My pleasure...

we have been so totally sold out.

:puke:

Kip Sullivan would be a great guest for Cenk! As Kucinich says...'he has figured out the real story.'

Uniquely American Solution - What is it ? Why is it being pushed?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6289091&mesg_id=6289091

http://www.cjr.org/campaign_desk/one_step_forward_one_step_back.php

"If that’s not puzzling enough, some of the same language found in coverage of the HCAN campaign is identical to the language used by America’s Health Insurance Plans (AHIP), the industry’s trade association. In an ABC News story this week, HCAN’s campaign director Richard Kirsch said: “We are looking for a uniquely American solution.” When the campaign was announced this week in Maine, Alison Vander Zanden, of the Maine People’s Alliance, said: “We’re looking for a uniquely American solution to the health care crisis that is truly affordable, that provides quality care, that controls costs and that is available to all.”

Gosh, that’s the same thing that AHIP said in a press release issued after the ad campaign launched. AHIP president Karen Ignani said that her group intended to make a significant contribution to the debate over blending public and private strategies “to achieve a uniquely American solution that can work and be enacted.” Those words—uniquely American solution— have shown up before. This spring, in an interview with Lee Newspapers, Montana Sen. Max Baucus, chair of the Senate Finance Committee (though which health care legislation must pass), said: “We will have insurance companies in America. We’ll have uniquely American solutions….” Uniquely American solution is a new code phrase, intended to prod the public into approving this vague and unspecified “solution” without really understanding what the words really mean..."


http://www.amazon.com/Health-Care-Mess-Into-Well/dp/1420885510/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252693305&sr=1-1

"About the Author

Kip Sullivan has been teaching and writing about the American health-care crisis since 1986. His articles on this subject, which now number over 100, have appeared in the New York Times, the Los Angeles Times, The Nation, the Washington Monthly, the New England Journal of Medicine, and Health Affairs.Mr. Sullivan is a graduate of Pomona College and Harvard Law School. With the exception of a three-year stint with the New York Legal Aid Society, he has spent his entire adult life working for citizen organizations. From 1980 to 2000, he was an organizer, researcher and lobbyist for Minnesota Citizen Organizations Acting Together (COACT), an organization that teaches citizens how to work together for social justice. In 1986, COACT endorsed universal health insurance and appointed Mr. Sullivan as the campaign director for that issue..."

Reply to critics of “Bait and switch: How the ‘public option’ was sold”
Posted by Andrew Coates MD on Saturday, Aug 8, 2009
by Kip Sullivan, JD

http://pnhp.org/blog/2009/08/08/reply-to-critics-of-%E2%80%9Cbait-and-switch-how-the-%E2%80%98public-option%E2%80%99-was-sold%E2%80%9D/

[truedelphi]

38. I also noticed that MoveOn is now touting the importance

Of getting REFORM done now.

When the meaasures that Obama and Congress are REAL REFORM, I'll get on the bandwagon.

Otherwise you can count me OUT.

Universal Single Payer Health Care for all NOW

[slipslidingaway]

42. Me too, I never abandoned SP for some "idea" but my husband

probably signed some petition because he received an email from HCAN today...

they want you to buy a yard sign for $10. that says Health "Insurance" Reform Now.

LOL

We better hurry before more people figure it out.

[truedelphi]

46. Sometimes I wish they had just gone to the trouble of

Creating one COHESIVE EMERGENCY - so that Congressional actions Re: the IWR, Budget BailOuts and Health Care Reform could have all been done in one week.

This would have saved my adrenal glands their yearly workout.

[slipslidingaway]

47. :))) n/t

[theFrankFactor]

15. Powerfully Important! Many, many of us are "gettin' it" We May Reach a Critical Mass...

I SURE HOPE SO!

K&R!

[ihavenobias]

59. Many of us are yes.

But amazingly many of us aren't.

[20score]

16. K&R.

Disheartening

[seeker4ever]

17. We Need To Get Our Shit Together - Dare I Say it? REVOLUTION!!!

k&r.

[slipslidingaway]

18. Posted a link to this thread in the GD forum...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6519833&mesg_id=6519833

[ihavenobias]

19. Great idea. A minor suggestion would be to change the title to mention the article.

Like "Great interview (video and article) with Jane Hamsher...", just because not everyone likes or can watch videos, but they might enjoy Jane's article.

[slipslidingaway]

20. Good idea and done :) n/t

[ihavenobias]

29. Thanks

:)

[Turborama]

21. What happened to Obama's empathy and altruism?

I was just doing some research about Nero fiddling while Rome burns and funnily enough came across "http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/2/24/04124/0642/643/701081">The Obama Code" . After a quick read, this part linking Obama to Progressive Values seems like bullshit to me, after hearing what Jane had to say.

2. Progressive Values are American Values

President Obama’s second intellectual move concerns what the fundamental American values are. In Moral Politics, I described what I found to be the implicit, often unconscious, value systems behind progressive and conservative thought. Progressive thought rests, first, on the value of empathy —- putting oneself in other people’s shoes, seeing the world through their eyes, and therefore caring about them. The second principle is acting on that care, taking responsibility both for oneself and others, social as well as individual responsibility. The third is acting to make oneself, the country, and the world better—what Obama has called an “ethic of excellence” toward creating “a more perfect union” politically.

[truedelphi]

39. I think that Obama shares Bush's mental lunacy.

Except that Obama can put together entire sentences.

When Obama can actually mouth the words "Universal Single Payer is the best solution," and then go on to say, "But since we aren't starting from scratch, we have to work within the confines of the system we already have"

that is

LUNACY.

I mean, maybe if we were not talking about REFORM, it wouldn't be lunacy. But we are talking about reform.

Citation for Obama stating that he gets how important Single Payer Universal HC is:
http://tinyurl.com/l6sxaq

[DWilliamsamh]

22. K & R Now that's more like it

Now THESE are strong liberal voices. (I hate the progressive label - it feels to much like capitulation to the lies of conservatives)

[ihavenobias]

52. I see what you're saying.

But it cuts both ways.

[DWilliamsamh]

55. What cuts both ways?

[ihavenobias]

56. Using liberal rather than progressive.

I understand the arguments for using either one depending on the situation. For example, the right HAS demonized the phrase "liberal" in the eyes of many, including many moderates and independents.

So if you want to avoid (potentially) being negatively boxed in by someone you might say you're 'progressive' if the question is asked. Even though the explanation that follows might be exactly the same, language matters. Now if you want to argue that we should take back liberal, I understand that point too. There are pros and cons IMO.

[lonestarnot]

23. K & R!

[avaistheone1]

24. Thanks Cenk for putting the pieces together.

You and Jane Hamsher clearly explained why the Democrats are giving up on the public option.

Now we progressives need to figure what we are going to do next.

[Divine Discontent]

25. K&R 41! o f w h a t s h o u l d b e 4 4 1 ! ! !

:kick:


huge news about why that Rahm fella isn't a progressive & anyone doubting it and not realizing he's working to please the corporations (and perhaps the boss is doing the same) needs to breathe in deep and smell the, roses? oh hell no, the sewage!

[truedelphi]

37. I imagine that the trolls probably take a bite of

12 to 15 rec's out of any YT broadcasts.

But it should be 441 rec's.

[ihavenobias]

40. Sadly at this point it's not even going to make the front page.

At least it doesn't look that way.

[slipslidingaway]

44. I wish that I could have removed the Kucinich video last night

and replaced it with this instead.

:(

[ihavenobias]

45. Nah, the DK video was on a very substantive issue.

I'll leave it at that.

[slipslidingaway]

48. So is this...

I vote for sharing, just like health care.

:)

[joeycola]

54. I gave it one.

[sabrina 1]

26. So the WH doesn't want liberals

going after Blue Dogs? And they have reined in the liberal groups and silenced them? Because they don't want a public option?

This is the second time in the past few years that a revelation like this shattered people who thought these groups were on their side.

Moveon doesn't surprise me. I stopped respecting them after the election in 2004 when they became silent, almost immediately, and did not return until three months after the election thinking it was safe and the anger might have died down. Many people suspected back then that they had sold out. I have never donated to them since. And this is confirmation of the suspicions people had.

I know they have people on internet boards also, attempting to shut down criticism of Dems.

But the worst of what she says, they remained quiet and did not fight the tea-baggers at Town Hall meetings, because it suited the WH to let the public think that there was 'real concern' over healthcare and opposition to a public option.

Iow, the so-called 'liberal movement' has sold out. Good for Jane for telling the truth. I wondered where the pushback was. So now, what? Money buys almost everyone.

Soon, we will start seeing Kucinich vilified again on 'left' blogs. And anyone else who expresses concern over this bill. It's just so despicable. But it's happened before and where did the money go? I hope I never donated to any of this ~

[slay]

27. Between this and foxnews...

progressives don't have much of a chance do we? Wow.

[midnight]

28. Toe the line or loose your funding. So your with us or we retaliate.

Shouldn't the White House be standing up for those who put them in the White House? Shouldn't the White House address the Republican attacks instead?

[slipslidingaway]

30. Morning kick and...

KoKo posted a good portion of the article in the Editorials forum.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=103&topic_id=479918&mesg_id=479918

[flyarm]

33. ( new) Reid Endorses Wellpoint’s Co-op Plan By: Jane Hamsher

please do read the comments..we have been 100% sold out and ..the blood of those that die because of lack of health care will be on everyone's hands who support this bullshit!

Reid Endorses Wellpoint’s Co-op Plan
By: Jane Hamsher Friday September 11, 2009 9:46 am



http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/09/11/reid-endorses-wellpoints-co-op-plan/#comments

The Senate Majority Leader endorses the Mike Ross/Kent Conrad/Wellpoint authored co-op plan:

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) endorsed the concept of health insurance cooperatives Thursday, siding with centrists in the House and Senate who want healthcare reform but oppose a public option.

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) also hinted she could accept that approach a day after President Barack Obama delivered an address to a joint session of Congress that offered encouraging words for both centrists and liberal Democrats who have demanded a public insurance option.

I think I may have to adjust my prediction for the co-op "squeeze play" on July 20:

The easiest political path to passing health care is still running the "co-op" crunch. Regardless of what the House does, the Senate can pass Conrad's shitty fake co-op. The Blue Dogs band together and refuse to vote for anything else, and that's what comes out of conference. There's a PR blitz to sell it as a "public plan" (which is why we've worked so assiduously to define it as NOT a public plan), and in a rush to get something passed, Rahm starts twisting progressive arms -- which have been historically very easily twisted.

Blue Dog Mike Ross presciently submitted virtually the same co-op plan in a July 31 amendment that finally emerged this week in Max Baucus's Senate plan. But since it now looks like Pelosi is on board with co-ops, that means the Blue Dogs aren't going to have to take the hit.

........................

it's all been a con game from the get go.............

The person who proposed Public Option..was Obama..no one else.
now We dems are being characterized as radical because we accpeted a compromise of Public Option..and now..we get totally fucked by the guy who initialized public option..Obama himself!

[nightrain]

62. more horrifying news. Thank you for posting it.

[FiveGoodMen]

34. Too bad I don't believe in miracles

Because that's about what it will take to stop America's imminent plunge off the cliff

[truedelphi]

36. Wish I could rec 100 Xs And to sum up the 13 minutes in SIX WORDS

Six words:

IT's ONE BIG MONEY PARTY PERIOD!!

[Apollo11]

41. For Rahm Emmanuel - it's all a ball game

All that matters is that the Blue team scores more than the Red team.

That's why all of these so-called liberal advocacy groups are being manipulated into following the Whitehouse line. Essentially they are an extension of the Whitehouse Communications effort.

Here's an example of the kind of material you can find on the Center for American Progress website (www.americanprogress.org):

President Obama Moves the Health Debate Forward
Karen Davenport provides analysis of President Obama's health care speech and insight into what we can expect in the weeks to come.

If you follow the link you will hear Davenport say that Obama "continues to support a public health insurance option but he also noted that a cooperative public-private health insurance plan might be able to reach the same goals."

Davenport is director of health policy at the Center for American Progress. She is a former aid to Senator Bob Kerrey who served on the White House Health Care Reform Task Force in 1993. In other words: a Washington insider.

[Seldona]

43. Amazing piece.

The progressive, grassroots, movement is seen as an obstacle to be co-opted, cajoled, and if not kept under control, cut off. Threatening to cut off money to liberal think tanks if they go off message?

Well, Mr. President, just what think tanks would that leave you with?

[Hutzpa]

49. hmmm....

:think:

[flyarm]

50. Joe Wilson and AHIP Team Up to Write Max Baucus’s Health Care Bill By: Jane Hamsher

Joe Wilson and AHIP Team Up to Write Max Baucus’s Health Care Bill
By: Jane Hamsher

http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/09/11/joe-wilson-and-ahip-team-up-to-write-max-baucuss-health-care-bill/

Friday September 11, 2009 7:06 am


There really doesn't seem to be any limit to what the administration will do to pass Rahm Emanuel's neoliberal giveaway to the insurance industry. The "author" of the plan released by Baucus (and apparently by Mike Ross) is a former VP of Wellpoint. Now AHIP is boasting about their role in crafting it:

Many of the changes to the insurance system now under discussion are the ones that have been advocated this year by the insurance companies themselves, said Karen M. Ignagni, the chief executive of America's Health Insurance Plans, the industry trade group. "The industry has been the leader in creating the proposals everyone is about to endorse," she said.

No wonder insurance company stocks shot up after the President's speech.

But now we find, per John Aravosis, that Kent Conrad and Max Baucus are changing their bill to appease Joe Wilson:

"We really thought we'd resolved this question of people who are here illegally, but as we reflected on the President's speech last night we wanted to go back and drill down again," said Senator Kent Conrad, one of the Democrats in the talks after a meeting Thursday morning. Baucus later that afternoon said the group would put in a proof of citizenship requirement to participate in the new health exchange — a move likely to inflame the left.

As John says, if Wilson's outburst turns out to be successful, it'll keep happening over and over again. And it will work every time.

If you want to stop this travesty from going forward -- and it's turning into a complete travesty -- ask these members of Congress from strong Democratic districts, all of whom have cosponsored Single Payer in the past and know better, why they aren't pledging to vote against any bill if it turns out to be nothing more than an insurance industry bailout:

read the rest at the link..........

[slipslidingaway]

53. Insurance company statements from Nov 2008, mandated coverage...

and no pre-existing conditions.

AHIP & BCBSA support guaranteed issue and individual mandate
http://pnhp.org/blog/2008/11/20/ahip-bcbsa-support-guaranteed-issue-and-individual-mandate/

[earth mom]

51. I'm not surprised. Traitorous so called liberals are here on DU every day pushing their b.s.

It just can't be more obvious. Those fuckers have been gaming the system and the message ever since the primaries.

[BREMPRO]

57. insightful interview-She makes a very point I haven't heard before:

The giveaway to the insurance industry by Rahm Emmanuel, to require a mandate and millions of new customers, is to keep the industry's lobbying and campaign money out of the hands of the Republicans. So instead of fighting for a good health care plan, we get political manuevering for campaign money. Is that too cynical? If it's true that that this is the major reason they are whittling down the public option to such a small (5 percent) of the total, or a vague trigger, as a favor to the industry- that's really depressing. The part i don't get, is if this is the plan, HOW are they going to meet the presidents mandate to be deficit neutral? Sure, We do need comparative effectiveness study and implementation to control costs. waste, fraud, abuse blah blah blah... heard it before. I just don't' see how the Dem's can put together a bill without somehow restricting the profits of the middleman- the health insurance industry.

Now Jane is certainly tooting her own horn and effectiveness- I don't doubt they've worked very hard and appreciate their work, but i think her characterization of HCAN as completely useless, may be a little exaggerated and self serving. There have been lots of spending on advertising, maybe not the same kind of grass roots phone calling that Firedoglake engages in.

SO we wait to see the bill- How do the Dem's proposed to get this to be deficit neutral? How are they going to get everyone covered, if most people can't afford the coverage in the first place? Devil's in the details.

I'm withholding judgment on this most cynical view of the process as totally controlled by the insurance industry as a giveaway until i see the result.

[flyarm]

58. by then it will be a day late and a dollar short!! eom

[nightrain]

60. knr. Thank you. Insightful interview. Horrifyingly good info...

[WillyT]

61. Big K & R !!!

:kick: