Two Registered Sex Offenders Killed in Maine Homes

[OneBlueSky]

Sunday, April 16, 2006
Associate Press

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,191944,00.html

AUGUSTA, Maine — Two registered sex offenders were fatally shot in their homes Sunday morning, prompting the state to take down the Maine Sex Offender Registry Web site.

State police said the site, which contains the photos, names and addresses of more than 2,200 registered sex offenders, was taken off-line as a precaution.

Investigators said a 19-year-old Canadian man described as "a person of interest" in the case shot himself in a Boston bus station after he was cornered by police later Sunday.

- more . . . (but not much) . . .

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,191944,00.html

[Bluebear]

1. Barbaric to publish these people's home addresses. More info here>>>>

Yeah I know, hang them by their balls, that is usually what people say about "sex offenders", failing to realize that the term encompasses any number of offenses. I still say if an offender is so dangerous, he should be in prison. Once the sentence is complete, publishing their home address information is just asking for this to happen.


====

"Violent day started with slaying of two perverts" is Boston Hertald's headline

Joseph L. Gray’s sleeping wife barely had time to leave the bedroom yesterday and see what all the noise was before her husband was shot and killed in front of his TV, a family associate said.
“By the time she got to the living room he had been shot,” the associate said.
His violent death at 3:15 a.m. ended a life he had restarted in Milo, Maine, after leaving a troubled past in Massachusetts.
The family associate, who did not want to be named, said Gray had served time in the mid-1990s for sex crimes involving youths in Bristol County.

http://news.bostonherald.com/localRegional/view.bg?articleid=135459

[mrcheerful]

2. I agree as I just found out two of the cities Xain homeless shelters are

refusing to let anyone on the list to stay in the shelters. So now theres good knows how many sex offenders living god knows where. BTW, if a registered sex offender doesn't have a home they can use the street corner they stay around as their address. Yet when women molest boys its seen as cute and passed off as a joke.

[vptpt]

13. Mighty christian of them

I'm sure that's what Jesus would have done.

:eyes:

[mrcheerful]

14. More on the reason the Xian charities for not housing them.

Michigan's new up dated law on sex offenders, sex offenders can not hang around schools,public parks that schools use for sports or anyplace that children are found, which includes homeless shelters. Seems someone brought another law suite against the sex registry and lost. Michigan's sex offenders list includes all sex crimes, there are street walkers on the list now. Seems that anyone convicted of any type of sex crime now ends up on the list. I thought the list was to be made up of dangerous predators, seems that is a lie, plus the fact that in crime description, Michigan uses criminal code that just states what criminal code their crime fell under and its very confusing. 1st and 3rd degree criminal sexual conduct deal with penetration or attempted penetration. 2nd degree and 4th degree CSC deals with touch, 4th degree is the person touched was over 12, 2nd deals with those under 12. Most out there read criminal code as 1st and 2nd degree is rape, 2nd degree is raping a child under 12, which is false. Whats really funny is most on the states list of dangerous sex offenders doesn't make it on the national list.

[vptpt]

16. Thanks for that info, mrcheerful

I'd be afraid to live beside a murderer-rapist, but I wouldn't have any problems living beside some guy who got busted for having consensual sex with his 16 year old girlfriend when he was 19. Or whatever the age difference has to be.

[Peter Frank]

3. Get used to it???...

First the perverts are targeted -- then the political adversaries.

What a brave new world we live in.

[0007]

7. 'Tis a crazy house run by the insane.

I don't know what the answer is, but this isn't the way.

[Freedom_from_Chains]

9. Actually I am surprised this doesn't happen more often

given what most christian fundamentalist world views are.

[High Plains]

17. Or given the views of some DU posters

[Freedom_from_Chains]

22. Hm-mm, I was not aware there we any vigilante DU posters here.

[IdaBriggs]

18. Sorry, disagree here.

Turns out a man my husband grew up with (and brother of his best friend of thirty years) molested his thirteen year old step-daughter. Served TEN DAYS in prison because he earns a good living, and his (now ex-) wife wanted him to keep his job so she could collect alimony. (She also kept the house he owned before their three year marriage.) His name is common. If we hadn't seen both his picture and his address, our blatant wish to be in denial would have probably prevented us from "believing" he could commit such a heinous act.

You can see his picture here -- -- I just hope to God that's his driver's license photo, and he wasn't smiling like that for his mug shot!

Oh, and because we didn't want to "believe" how bad it was, we went to the courthouse, and got a copy of his file. Yes, she was THIRTEEN YEARS OLD. But her mama is collecting a nice hefty chunk of money from him....grrr....

:banghead: :mad:

ON EDIT: Supposedly he was "depressed" and he promises he won't reoffend ever again. We still choose not to associate with him, though. Who knows when he's going to get "depressed" again? I'm just sorry the SOB didn't kill himself instead of molesting his thirteen year old step-daughter....

[Terran1212]

24. So you knew him well and liked him before you found out about his past

It sounds like he was a swell guy and you brought back a demon that he was trying to leave behind.

[mrcheerful]

25. Also from the sound of things how do you know mommy didn't get the 13 yo

to accuse him for a divorce and settlement? Cause the least amount of time a person gets for touching an under age girls breast is 21/2 years. Just saying you don't know what or who or anything. You just know he was accused and convicted, the rest is up to courts and lawyers. Plea bargain time.

[IdaBriggs]

28. Actually, I read the court records, thank you.

He was accused of THREE FELONY COUNTS, and pled down to ONE. I completely agree with you that he should have served more time, but in his case, he served TEN DAYS. (!) His ex-wife was a character witness (!), and she begged the courts for leniency because he was the sole financial support with a good job that was paying her alimony. (She didn't file for divorce until after the initial probation was filed, which stated that he wasn't allowed around children unsupervised; she has since given him the impression that she wants to resume their relationship!) I also know she wasn't the one who turned him in, because I've read the complaint, and know the name of the person who did. He is on probation, isn't allowed around children "unsupervised" and goes to counseling. His ex-wife in my opinion pretty much pimped out her daughter, and I have no use for her, either. On a positive note, I expect her to sue him for everything he's got as soon as the "alimony" agreement ends, and if she doesn't, I hope to God his victim takes him to the cleaners when she turns eighteen.

Also, he admitted the crimes to both his brother and his sister-in-law, both in private, and in front of a counselor he was seeing, although he edited out some of the details that were in the court records, and kept saying how he was so depressed because he was in an unhappy marriage for three whole years, and when the daughter started paying attention to him, since he wasn't getting any attention from his wife, he started molesting her.

Seriously. That was his excuse. He was "depressed" and he was unhappy in his marriage of three years, so when his thirteen year old step-daughter, who had been living with him since she was ten, paid him attention, he REPEATEDLY MOLESTED HER.

If you want to become friends with him, I'll be happy to PM you his particulars. :) As for me and mine, we want NOTHING to do with him. :)

[mrcheerful]

31. Well I learned theres the truth and then theres the truth.

As no one was there besides the two invovled you have what him and his lawyers say, you have the minor, her parents and the DA saying something different, then you have the courts spin on everything. You'd be surprised at the way the courts really work, its not about justice its about getting convictions to look like your not soft on crime. I knew a guy that was convicted of CSC 1st degree after a step kid accused him of getting her pregnant. The problem was he had his testicles removed 10 years before because of testicle cancer. The judge said none of that mattered because the states doctors said he could get it up so he got life without parole. Sad thing was, if he would have taken the plea bargain he would have got 2 to 15. BTW, to get the plea bargain you have to say pretty much that you did the crime or you don't get the plea. Also when judges, DA's and your lawyer are telling you to take the plea or you will get a harsher sentence for fighting most don't fight. I'm not saying this guy is a saint, I'm just saying that with todays court system guilt and innocence are neither, its take the best offer and live with what hand your dealt.

[IdaBriggs]

33. Wow. Did you read what I read? Not only did he CONFESS IN COURT

(which I get what you are saying, because our system is so corrupt), but he ALSO CONFESSED TO HIS FAMILY MEMBERS AND ADMITTED WHAT HE HAD DONE, AND WHY.

He served TEN DAYS even though he was GUILTY OF (AT LEAST) THREE FELONIES BECAUSE HIS SOON TO BE EX-WIFE (only because he wasn't allowed to live with the child he molested) BEGGED THE COURT TO LET HIM KEEP WORKING.

The now Ex-Wife didn't want him in jail because she wanted his money (and screw what he did to her thirteen year old child).

Thank God SOMEONE stood up for this child because no one in her damn family was doing it!!!

Your guy seems to be the exception; in damn near every case of abuse and/or molestation that I am aware of (numbers in my IMMEDIATE FAMILY ALONE pushing near the twenty mark), the perpetrator serves little, if any, time in jail AS LONG AS HE CAN AFFORD A DECENT ATTORNEY.

Now, barring my ability to be omniscient, I'm going to stick with what I perceive to be COMMON FRICKING SENSE and keep CONVICTED CHILD MOLESTING FELONS AWAY FROM MY FAMILY -- I'm just CRAZY that way!

:crazy:

[mrcheerful]

34. And you didn't read that to get the plea bargain you have to admit to the

crime in court. Like I said, I am not saying the guys innocent or guilty. The city I was born in bragged to the local news team that the city had a 100% conviction rate during the year 1996. How come that was the only crime that got that kind of conviction rate? Robberies were only at 60% conviction rate for the city that year. I do not trust courts or what people say about who said what, now if the guy had told you that he did the crime then I agree with what your saying. People do lie, when it comes to getting money some people will say and do anything to get it. Maybe the money part of it is what bothers me. Also, if its a first offense probation is usually all they get unless its rape or murder. Nor am I saying that you are wrong in not wanting him around. My ex land lord, after I put money down on the apartment, told me he molested a child, I moved out as soon as I could, losing my rent and deposit. He molested a boy and we have a 15 yo, he was 14 at the time so yeah better safe then sorry. I'm just trying to say that don't judge all people by one person, thats what started this whole mess. Bottom line is no law can protect your kids from bad people, laws only work after they been broken. Stop letting the state do what you should be doing, watching your kids, because in the real world lists will not protect them. In fact lists make people good targets because while watching those on the list the one who isn't on the list comes along and blind sides you.

[IdaBriggs]

37. Plea bargains aside, we know this guy is guilty because of all the

CONFESSING TO EVERYBODY. As for his ex-wife, she was better off with him out of jail (and has been hinting she wants to get back with him). The reason I like lists is because "bad people" look just like "everyone else" -- and there is only so vigilant a person can be. I know one person who was raped in her parents home at eleven years old early one Sunday morning when her parents weren't home because they were at the home of her grandmother, who had passed away in the night; the "best friends" of the parents were at the grandmother's house, and they left their seventeen year old son to watch cartoons while they helped take care of things. Who would have thought he'd rape an eleven year old? :shrug:

No Jail. No Time. No Conviction. The parents were told that with no physical evidence (they didn't find out until two weeks later, and had assumed all of the crying had to do with the grandmother's death), it was a "he said/she said" -- although he did confess when confronted by all the grown ups -- and his parents "promised" to get him counseling. Want to take a guess as to how many times he went? And how much do you want to bet that was his "only" time? (It was found out later that the person I know was NOT his first victim -- surprise, huh?)

Its a good thing I'm not a Libertarian; I'd be in the "kill all molesters" camp. I'm pretty much already there now, but I won't do it myself. Somebody else doing it -- three cheers!!! Dead sexual predators get no grief from me.

[IdaBriggs]

27. Actually, he attended our wedding ten years ago, since he and my husband

grew up together. He hadn't been around much over the years -- we were there more for his mother as she was dying than he was -- but he had been hanging out with his brother's family (and hence us) since his "divorce" last year which he didn't talk about much. His crime was committed (or reported) in November of 2004, and the court stuff only finished up last summer. His "I'm such a victim" divorce story wasn't adding up, and one day a few months ago I typed him into the sexual predator database. (My radar was going off, but I didn't want to believe it when his name popped up.) We first confronted our good friends, who had been put in this terrible position -- reveal that he was a risky individual, and thus "prejudice" us against him, or "keep his secret" and watch us blow our stacks about socializing with a sexual predator? -- and then, before we made our final determination of whether or not to continue socializing with him, we went to the courthouse, and discovered the discrepancies between what he had been telling his brother's family, and what the court records said, with the biggest point being SHE WAS THIRTEEN YEARS OLD, and her mother wasn't the one who turned him in.

We offered to sit down and talk with him, but frankly, my prejudice regarding sexual predators is extremely well established since so many women in my family (including me) were victimized by them, and everyone knew it would simply be a pretense at politeness. In the meantime, I've been hearing the stories from his sister-in-law, and frankly, the narcissistic bastard doesn't really sound like he has changed all that much. (Did I mention how he stole close to forty thousand dollars of his mother's inheritance from his brother's family? He's SUCH an asshole! And his brother is *SUCH* an enabler!!! Argh!)

There is nothing the perpetrator can say that will make him safe in our world ever again. His excuse -- depression -- just didn't cut it for us, and I will be grateful when he is dead, and no longer a menace to anyone else. Apparently he is that particular breed where he only likes to do the deed when his potential victims are easily "available", and isn't someone who will "seek out" his prey, hence the easy availability of his step-daughter. I am very concerned for his niece and nephew, now age two and three; people have a tendency to "forget" such unpleasant things, and I believe his niece will be at particular risk as she approaches puberty. His brother is still torn between who he should be protecting, and I only pray that he wakes up and smells the "protect your children" coffee before his "I should forgive everyone" religion places everyone in an Ungodly Awful Situation. (Did I mention I wish this guy had just killed himself instead of repeatedly molesting his THIRTEEN YEAR OLD STEP-DAUGHTER?)

And our best friends have been put on notice that if they EVER expose us to a Sexual Predator again without our knowledge (when they know about it, obviously), then thirty years of friendship notwithstanding, the friendships will be terminated. I know too damn much about Child Sexual Molestation to EVER want to just "be friends" with such people -- my sympathy and energies will ALWAYS go the victims and once you step into perpetrator mode, you simply aren't worth my time.

[Bill McBlueState]

35. This is a personal anecdote, of course

And while I feel sorry for what happened to you, personal anecdotes do not make for good law. You should address the argument made in the post you're responding to, which is that publishing the personal data of convicted criminals may lead to vigilante "justice." A balance has to be struck between public safety and personal privacy, and widely publishing the personal data of anyone convicted of anything the state decides to call a sexual offense leads down a slippery slope, in my view.

Also, I think it's odd that you would assume a topic that's controversial in this forum would get you nothing but hugs and me-toos in the lounge. We're all able to read both forums.

[IdaBriggs]

38. If you want to talk about the lounge post, go there.

This is an emotionally difficult topic, and asking for emotional support while discussing it seems pretty sensible to me. This thread is DEFINITELY not the place for it, is it?

As for your "original" point, let me be clear on mine: I *like* publishing the personal data of convicted criminals, and I don't have a problem with vigilante "justice" -- don't like that attitude? Too bad. I'm a Law & Order Liberal, and I don't believe all convicted felons are simply innocent victims of evil bad police with nothing better to do but waste taxpayer dollars; I honestly believe some of them are (gasp!) CRIMINALS WHO SHOULD BE PUNISHED, who create a SAFER society when they aren't a part of it.

I have provided a very fresh personal anecdote as a clear example of how "some people" aren't just on the list because they took a piss in the woods, or had consensual sex with a partner of similar age, or any of the half a dozen ways people minimize the damage done by SEXUAL PREDATORS who are then placed on SEX OFFENDER LISTS. Consider it a "fair and balanced" counterpoint to the "everyone on the lists is really just an innocent victim!" mentality displayed by so many posters in this thread.

And, please, don't feel sorry for me in the case I mentioned, as I wasn't the victim. If you wish to feel sorry for the fact that I am a survivor of child sexual abuse, thanks, but no thanks. I don't need your pity, and neither do the other survivors in my family; what we need is SAFETY -- and either permanently locking away perpetrators (or killing them), works fine with me. Unless you want to guarantee their future good behavior with YOUR LIFE, perhaps? Maybe that is a good way to handle things: find one to three people willing to PUT THEIR LIVES ON THE LINE for the future good behavior of released perpetrators. If the perpetrator re-offends, immediate death penalty for the criminal AND the folks who "vouched" for them, or even life without parole in a maximum security prison.

Sound harsh? Why yes, yes it is. But in essence that is what the folks who ALLOW repeat offenses to occur are condemning future victims to: a lifetime of having to deal with HELL.

This "lets play pretend" crap doesn't sit well with me: one out of three women and one out of seven men were sexually molested as children, and we have a bunch of idiots on this board going "sometimes they were just taking a leak in the woods" ???

Do you have any clue as to how many people in prison will tell you that they were framed? That they are innocent? Even if they are caught on tape with DNA evidence everywhere, Etc.? Convincing TWELVE SKEPTICAL PEOPLE of someone's guilt isn't as easy as it sounds, and the people who work in our criminal justice system, while not always perfect, do a reasonable job in my opinion.

I am a practical woman, and if you (meaning a perpetrator, not you the poster) are so narcissistic that you can't distinguish between appropriate and inappropriate sexual behavior by the age of twenty-one, then society is better off without you, and the resources we waste on trying to "fix you" just don't seem worth it to me. I won't kill you myself, but I'm certainly not going to cry if someone else is kind enough to do it for the rest of us.

Its called "vigilante JUSTICE" for a reason, you know, and sometimes, whether we like to admit it or not, its a Damn Good Thing.

[mrcheerful]

39. And people say they have nothing in common with the freepers

[wakeme2008]

4. A couple months ago one city in Florida Sheriff Depart was giving out the

WRONG addresses of sex offenders and people living at the Sheriff Dept. provided address were having problems.....

[Bluebear]

5. Holy moly.

WRONG addresses . . . can you imagine the hassles the homeowners had to endure?

[wakeme2008]

8. From the ppl that can not do voter reg. databases we have

sex offenders databases... Think about that.... :scared:

[Eugene]

6. Update: Man tied to 2 deaths kills self aboard bus - AP

Man tied to 2 deaths kills self aboard bus

Canadian was 'person of interest' in Maine slayings

By Ralph Ranalli and Hailey Heinz, Globe Staff and Globe Correspondent | April 17, 2006

A 20-year-old Canadian man described as "a person of interest" in two killings
yesterday in Maine fatally shot himself in the head in front of stunned passengers
on a bus in Boston last evening as police closed in, authorities said.

Maine State Police spokesman Stephen McCausland confirmed that the person who shot
himself was Stephen A. Marshall, of Cape Breton, Nova Scotia. Marshall had been sought
in two homicides of registered sex offenders early yesterday in Maine, one in Milo and
the other in Corinth.

http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2006/04/17/man_tied_to_2_deaths_kills_self_aboard_bus
(Boston Globe - free registration may be required)

[femmedem]

10. I know a man who's a registered sex offender.

He committed a terrible crime when he was a young man. When he got out of prison, he was middle aged. He was homeless for the next seven years. He was barred from shelters, barred from federal housing. No one would employ him, except for occassional odd jobs. During those seven years, he committed no crimes, nor does he have any substance abuse problems.

Local activists were finally able to push for more flexibility on who's allowed into shelters. Cops had the discretion to say, "This guy's okay." Then an advocate was able to help him qualify for disability, and get into supportive housing. He has taken a lot of anger management classes. He is an active advocate for the homeless himself.

I have great sympathy for people who want to protect themselves and their children from sex offenders. I am a rape survivor myself. ButI don't think it's right to let people out of prison, then make it nearly impossible for them to rejoin society.

[slackmaster]

23. I know one who committed a modest crime about 20 years ago

He fondled a teenage girl. There was no genital contact. He is attracted to young women but I think his actions were partly a result of the more touchy-feely culture of his native Greece.

She wasn't traumatized for life. His life was basically ruined. He's on the same Web page as violent rapists and child molesters.

[ikojo]

11. In today's climate an 18 year old kid can be labeled

a sex offender if he/she has a sexual relationship with a 16 or 17 year old.

Before people say this is justice, how many people on this board were shtupping kids a year or two younger than themselves when they were 18 years old? Many kids turn 18 in their senior year of high school.

[Bassic]

12. Such abuses of the term are completely barbaric

My hope is that no 18 yo sees his life ruined by a fundie father who doesen't want his daughter to be defiled.

[Solon]

15. Not to mention other stupid shit...

For example, a guy who doesn't have access to a bathroom, but REALLY has to go, pisses on a tree, and is caught, could also be on a sex offender list in some states, indecent exposure or some crap like that.

[mrcheerful]

19. Worse yet, a guy in Michigan got 2 to 15 years lock up. Why?

He had some land, it was pretty well grown over with trees and brush. The nearest house was 1/2 a mile away, its was around 25 acres of woods. He had it posted, well he was cutting trees down in his woods and took a leak. Unknown to him was the kids from the house 1/2 a mile away were out playing in the woods and saw him. They went running back to their house and told mommy that the guy pulled his thing out in front of them. Mommy called the cops, the guy was arrested and convicted. At the trail the judge said it didn't matter what his intentions were, its how the victims felt about seeing the guy. BTW after being sentenced the state took away his land for not paying back taxes while he was in prison. He is now on the sex offenders list, CSC 2nd degree.

[Bozita]

20. Urinating in public can earn a "Sex Offender" label -- indecent exposure

If you've ever drank beer, you likely qualify for the list.

[davidthegnome]

21. Mixed feelings

I have no problem at all with convicted child mollestors being listed by name. However, "sex offender", is far too general. I live in Maine myself, far, far Northern Maine, right on the border with Canada. I can tell you that we are extremely protective of our children. But this is wrong, regardless of what these men did, killing them isn't the answer.

[rodeodance]

36. agreed.

[regnaD kciN]

26. This happened in Washington state last year...

A couple of sex offenders were sharing a rental house. Their info was posted. Some vigilante gained entrance to the house, posing as a law-enforcement officer, and blew their brains out. (He was later apprehended and pled guilty.)

Before the blood had dried, newspapers throughout the state were editorializing that this incident, however "regrettable," wasn't sufficient reason ("merely an isolated incident") to change the law regarding community notification.

I'll bet the newspapers in Maine are saying the exact same thing right now. :eyes:

I wonder how many more of these we'll see?

[Ron Green]

29. "Your crime is worse than my crime."

That's the attitude of lots of guys in prison, too.

[mrcheerful]

32. Funniest thing ever heard on the prison yard

well I never molested a child, the guy that said it was doing life without parole for killing a 7 yo and an 8 yo during a drive by shooting, he accidentlly shoot them in the face, 12 gauge with double 00 buck shot.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

30. This was bound to happen sooner or later.

Some psycho who read one Punisher comic too much starts wadind through sex offender registries and offing them one by one.

If you're reading this and think this is a good thing, come here and say it.