What does section 2.5 of Executive Order 12333 mean?

[brainshrub]

Here is the text:

2.5 Attorney General Approval. The Attorney General hereby is delegated the power to approve the use for intelligence purposes, within the United States or against a United States person abroad, of any technique for which a warrant would be required if undertaken for law enforcement purposes, provided that such techniques shall not be undertaken unless the Attorney General has determined in each case that there is probable cause to believe that the technique is directed against a foreign power or an agent of a foreign power. Electronic surveillance, as defined in the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978, shall be conducted in accordance with that Act, as well as this Order.

In english, what does this mean? Does this give the president authority to do warrant-less searches of Americans?

[stevedeshazer]

1. After reading it three times,

I have no idea. :crazy:

Here's a stab: Alberto Gonzales can do anything he wants to deliver a warrant...or not...depending on whether he believes FISA will let him do it. Or not. :shrug:

[0007]

2. 'Tis over my head. I'm certainly not a law expert, I've had many

freepers tell me that junior has the power. :shrug:

[Wilms]

3. Sounds like he just appointed Gonzales to head the FISC. n/t

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

4. The Authority Ultimately Rests With The A.G., However He Is Still Bound By

FISA, as per the last line. In these cases they did not conform to FISA rules of conduct.

[GrantDem]

5. I think the last sentence says it all...

Electronic surveillance,as defined in the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978, shall be conducted in accordance with that Act, as well as this Order

Since they circumvented the court it seems that this order has been ignored along with the Constitution.

IMHO

[uppityperson]

6. "foreign power or an agent of a foreign power"

I think this is the key here. They can do anything so long as the AG has determined that he/she thinks it will be against a "foreign power or an agent of a foreign power." This includes electronic surveillance. So long as AG thinks agent of foreign power, can do whatever he likes.

[Warpy]

7. "The constitution is hereby suspended,

and no one has any rights left unless I confer them.

That's what it says, basically.

No, the USSC will likely not approve any EO suspending any portion of the constitution.

However, they have approved the forefeiture laws, which have trashed the fourth amendment for decades, so who knows any more?

[Trillo]

8. It seems to me he's granting a power the president has

to the AG: "hereby is delegated".

But I'm not a lawyer, and have only looked at what you have posted.

[sallyseven]

9. But they are not suppose

tap americans to americans. Like the Quakers in Florida or enemies of the president.

[BrotherBuzz]

10. Well, it's apparent that Gonzales had probable cause to believe....

Quakers are agents of foreign powers. Bushco has access to better intelligence then we do, don't you know? :shrug:

[jmowreader]

11. it says Bush is still a crook

The Attorney General hereby is delegated the power to approve the use for intelligence purposes, within the United States or against a United States person abroad, of any technique for which a warrant would be required if undertaken for law enforcement purposes

If the government wanted to tap someone's phone because they thought they were dealing child porn or something, they'd be forced to acquire a warrant. According to this E.O., the AG can sign off on requests to tap phones for intelligence purposes.

This isn't outside the purview of USSID 18. It very clearly states that the AG can sign off on tasking requests.

What screws Bush is...

provided that such techniques shall not be undertaken unless the Attorney General has determined in each case that there is probable cause to believe that the technique is directed against a foreign power or an agent of a foreign power.

Note: each case. The Attorney General would have had to go over Bush's entire tasking request, decide whether each person on it was a traitor to his country, and issue separate permission slips for each one. We're dealing with thousands and thousands of people; the AG wouldn't be able to do anything but sign off on tasking requests if he reviewed each person on them.

Short answer: no, he still doesn't have the authority to do warrantless searches of Americans.

[brainshrub]

12. Thank you.

Thats what I thought. I am working on a particularly interesting blog entry, and I wanted to make sure I read this properly.

[SPKrazy]

13. It alleges that Gonzales can authorize intel activities against

American citizens believed to be foreign agents either in the US or abroad without going through FISA

It is an executive order, which means that it is a law that the Prez made, but may not be constitutional necessarily.
The supreme court will ultimately decide this.

Wonder why * is so eager to establish people like Meirs on the SC, could it be to save his ass!?

Also, Roberts, and Alito are no doubt keys to saving his ass in this.

Remember that * knew that this info was in the hands of the NYT a year ago and that they were sitting on it but wouldn't sit forever.

Wondering about the death of Rehnquist now. He was old, and he had thyroid cancer (not necessarily a lethal type of cancer) did the cancer kill him? the treatments? age? or did * have him offed? :tinfoilhat:

[BeHereNow]

14. Your new passport will be chipped-

Courtesy of Wes Clark's favorite company to
invest in: Entrust, who just so happened to
win the Homeland Security contract to
plant the chips into your passport- so NOW
when you travel abroad, they will know exactly
where you are, just in case you happen to
violate some obscure section of the Patriot Act
and they need to haul you off to some black hole
prison in say, Poland!
Aint technology grand?
BHN