You know those stories about the evil twin doing it?

[LeftCoast]

Well...we may have a real-life case. Remember that strange story of former senior Bush advisor Claude Allen? Apparently he has an identical twin brother...

From the NYT

People who talked to Mr. Allen Monday said he remained surprisingly upbeat in the face of the charges. He said only one side of the story had been heard, said one former colleague who asked not to be identified because the conversation was private.

Like others who know him, his stepmother cannot understand the turn of events. "I simply have no idea where things could have gone wrong in his life," Mrs. Allen said.

Floyd was the twin who "kept running into bad times," while Claude Allen intervened repeatedly to help him, she said.

In 2001, Floyd Allen declared bankruptcy in Virginia; a year earlier he was ordered to pay $6,450 in a civil suit brought against him by a travel company, according to state and federal records.

Truth sometimes really is stranger than fiction...

[WilliamPitt]

1. I was thinking *exactly* the same thing

[gekeeley]

2. Maybe...

Bush could adopt the same argument:

"Hehe, it was mah evil twin who invaded Iraq and authorized illegal domestic wiretapping and was best buds with Jack Abramoff and choked on a pretzel. Remember that 9/11 speech at Ground Zero though... that was me!"

[Mr_Spock]

4. lol

You just gave Rove his next evil trick...

[LeftCoast]

9. LOL!

Brilliant! :thumbsup:

[Mr_Spock]

3. Wow - interesting story

Imagine if this was a big story and it flipped on that revelation?

[Kingshakabobo]

8. I think he still has a problem since HE was the one who got pinched.

I assume they finger-printed him. Also, he has some splaining to do why his brother had his card the previous 25 times and nothing was reported to the credit card company regarding suspicious charges.

Still, it's a shot at a not-guilty verdict.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

5. Ya right....

Until I see birth certificates... and a report of where this "twin" has been...I don't believe any of this.

We had 3 sets of twins in my grade growing up.... you would not believe the shit they tried to pull.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

13. Watching Snotty's press conference today, and he says...

Claude had already asked for resignation, claiming he wanted to "spend more time with his family"

Claude was "apprehended by security personnel at the store while returning some merchandise."
Straight from the scotty-spin-meister's mouth.

my BS meter is totally going off. Bells, whistles, flashing lights... the whole shebang.

[Mythsaje]

6. I'll buy it...

It struck me as a REALLY weird thing for the guy to do. Kleptomania I could understand, but this would be a very odd mental glitch indeed.

[tyedyeto]

16. I, for one, won't be caught in the 'spin cycle'. n/t

[Mythsaje]

17. Well, it seems ludicrous

that someone who's attached to this band of merry crooks currently stealing the country blind would be moonlighting by stealing from department stores... it just doesn't make sense. It would be evidence of a fairly odd pathology, far too complex for simple kleptomania, which would be the only reasonable explanation for this sort of behavior in someone like him.

It's not subscribing to spin if you didn't think it made any sense in the first place. Which I didn't. It's a fairly reasonable explanation for a rather unreasonable story. IMO.

[file83]

22. It's not so ludicrous - kleptos do it habitually NOT for the $$$ but for

the "rush" they feel when they pull it off. The other aspect of this whole ordeal is that maybe this guy wanted to get caught, subconsciously. Some people have self-destructive behaviors. Like Hugh Grant - why would he hire a Sunset strip street hooker and do it with her in the back of a car? He was rich, famous, and married to a beautiful movie star - it doesn't make any sense, until you realize he did it for the "rush" - because it was "bad". The chance of getting caught is a thrill for them.

The same goes for this shoplifter who had one of the best jobs he could ever dream to have.

[Mythsaje]

28. He wasn't just shoplifting, though...

He was going into the store, buying something, then going out to his car, depositing his purchase, then going back in to grab another of the same item and pretending to "return" it to the store for a refund.

I suppose that could give someone a rush, but it still seems like a low-rent scam, kind of a con of sorts, and, in my opinion, a totally different animal than shoplifting.

The "wanted to get caught" thing is a more interesting possibility, I have to admit. Kind of a "Hey, I'm a thief! Catch me!" thing.

But what worries me is that we, as a group, are jumping on this with both feet and pointing fingers, when, if it DOES shake out the way they're saying it does, it'll manage to make us look pretty damn stupid.

[file83]

30. Semantics. He was "shop lifting" the products off the shelves and

returning them to the store AS IF they were his (which they weren't). That's shoplifting, let's not split hairs here.

[Mythsaje]

31. I'm a master hair-splitter...

It's shoplifting, sure, but it's also a step beyond simply sneaking something out of the store. I don't think it's the same thing at all.

There's a point when simplification becomes obfuscation.

[file83]

33. One could argue that he was a con-artist - he is guilty of defrauding

the store of their money. So, yes, that is different from shoplifting which would be defrauding the store of it's capital investments.

But ultimately part of his scam involves shoplifting too. What's the difference if he stepped outside of the store with the merchandise (clearly shoplifting) and then turned around, walked back in and then claimed it was "his" and he wanted money back....what's the difference between THAT and just walking from the shelf straight to the counter?

It's a silly discussion, but I get your point that simplifying the crime too may ultimately mischaracterize the crime.

[tabasco]

29. Winona Ryder is a multimillionaire. She was caught shoplifting.

Are you denying her crimes as well?

Why are you jumping to Allen's defense when he is the one apprehended in the act of theft?

Of course he is entitled to a fair trial, but your version seems ludicrous to me, considering it was CLAUDE ALLEN, not his brother, apprehended in the act of felony theft.

[Mythsaje]

32. We'll see.

It just smells funny. I'm curious to see how it all shakes out.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

7. Then there were the Korean twins, women, where one was a model citizen,

and the other was some kind of black sheep criminal, who kidnapped the first one and had some wacky scheme to assume her identity. It wasn't entirely clear to me but I think the intent was to off her sister. The kidnapped sister had a cellphone and managed to make a call while abducted and was rescued. I can't remember their name but it was pretty bizarre.

[davidinalameda]

10. was her name Erica Cain

or Susan Lucci?

[LeftCoast]

12. Who knew that the soaps had it right all along?

LOL

[The_Casual_Observer]

11. jr is gonna have some splain'in to do about all that "I'm disappointed"

shit. He jumped away from that guy quicker than if he had farted.

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

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[The_Casual_Observer]

27. Bullshit, he was shaking his head saying "I'm shocked!"

"I'm shocked!", He might as well have been the judge, jury and executioner.

[tabasco]

14. Republican politicians know how gullible their supporters are.

They throw out the baloney story, and you can bet, a lot of republican voters believe it.

So what he has a twin brother. Claude is the one who got caught stealing.

Nevermind that. The same people that believe Clinton killed Vince Foster and trashed the White House will lap this fairy tale up too.

[Mythsaje]

18. Why would someone who's complicit

in the pillaging of our treasury be out scamming department stores? That's like eating dog food when you have top sirloin in your freezer.

[tabasco]

26. Never underestimate the power of greed.

Are you suggesting that it really was his twin brother, despite the identification by police?

Allen was raking in good dough, but not enough to prevent him from enjoying free stuff.

The police apprehended Claude Allen, not his brother, in the act of theft.

[moobu2]

15. Picture of the Allen twin brothers from TPM

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/

[file83]

19. I still think that Mr. Allen was....

...just carrying out Bush's Domestic Policy Plans as ordered:

Mr. Allen, the president's former domestic policy adviser, was arrested in suburban Maryland and charged with stealing thousands of dollars in merchandise from Target and other stores in a scheme to fake returns.

Isn't that what BushCo has been doing to the taxpayers for the last 5 years?

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

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[moobu2]

23. He once refused to allow a low income rape victim

the funds to get an abortion.


Carmas a bitch.

[catmandu57]

24. Practise makes perfect

He was just keeping his skills honed.

[Igel]

25. This must be the third or fourth thread on this, and yet

I have yet to see even one They Might Be Giants allusion.

How strange.

(As for the actual crimes involved, there's no reason for me to form an opinion, so I won't until I have more facts.)

[allalone]

34. he forgot the first rule of thievery

if you're gonna steal, steal BIG

[TheBaldyMan]

35. Tom Tomorrow's website has picture of twin

Uncanny!