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We Underestimate McCain at our own Peril

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Stevendsmith Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:14 PM
Original message
We Underestimate McCain at our own Peril
I am amazed at how many people here so easily dismiss the possibility of a McCain presidency. McCain is the most popular and well-regarded politician in the country, he has burning presidential ambitions, he is almost universally BELOVED by the pundit class (and a sickeningly large segment of Democrats), and he could raise gobs of cash. I'm not buying the "the base doesn't support him" argument. Nor am I buying the "he's too old" argument.



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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
1. i don't underestimate his attraction for many moderates but i worked on
his campaign in 99 and did not fight back at all and this time his gopers are going to start kneecapping him harder and earlier imo.
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Burning Water Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
2. But the Republican base
dislikes him intensely. He'll have to run as an independent, becasue he will NEVER get the R nomination.
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mattclearing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
3. And his Party base hates him.
He'll never get nominated.

If you aren't buying "the base doesn't support him" argument, then you aren't paying attention.

They can't stand him. They think he's one of us.
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soleft Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. do they feel the same about Rudy?
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mattclearing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Honestly, I'm not sure.
He's pro-choice though, right? Can't help.
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reichstag911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Between Rudy's extremely public extramarital dalliance...
...and his pro-choice history, the fundies won't support him.
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LSparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. Dunno -- but Rudy's also pro-choice so he may have problems
Also, there are LOTS of skeletons in his closet (divorce, etc.). The Rethug base may not like McCain but they won't love Rudy either once they learn more about him/his past.
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Burning Water Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #4
16. Pretty much so, yeah.
At least among those I have talked to.
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. John McCain, Hypocrite
John McCain, Hypocrite
by Doug Ireland

John McCain, the media's darling, has found a clever way around his own campaign finance reform law to take big corporate bucks in furtherance of his political ambitions while carrying water for the corporate mammoth providing the dough. But the national press is ignoring the story.


The Associated Press first ran the story of John McCain's odorous but lucrative Senatorial service to the communications giant Cablevision on the afternoon of March 7. But, while some local papers in McCain's home state (like the East Valley Tribune) have run the story, nothing has as yet made it into the print editions of the New York Times, the L.A. Times, the Washington Post, or any of the half-dozen other big city dailies I checked (although, if one searches the hundreds of AP stories available on the Post's website on its Politics page by clicking on "Latest Wire Reports," one can find it there--but how many readers would bother to do that?) One notable exception: the Kansas City Star.


Here's what the AP's investigation found:


McCain repeatedly intervened on behalf of a policy Cablevision favored -- one which "congressional and private studies conclude could make cable more expensive" -- while his chief political adviser, Rick Davis (who's masterminding McCain's probable '08 presidential rerun) solicited $200,000 in contributions from Cablevision to an institute that promotes McCain and pays Davis a $110,000 annual salary.


The Reform Institute was set up to promote McCain and his issues--especially campaign finance reform, embodied in the famous McCain-Feingold law. This Institute is "a tax-exempt group that touts McCain's views and has showcased him at events since his unsuccessful 2000 presidential campaign," and it "often uses the senator's name in press releases and fund-raising letters and includes him at press conferences," the AP says. And, of course, it provides a cushy sinecure with no heavy lifting for McCain's main man, Davis, as he prepares the pontificating Senator's next presidential run. Cablevision's contributions account for a whopping 15% of the Institute's budget.


http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0309-35.htm

McCain hypocrisy:

The Bushification of John McCain

By Ari Melber, AlterNet. Posted November 15, 2005.

The bad blood between the two men has been infamous since 2000, when Bush's campaign lied about McCain's family and war service, and McCain told Bush to "get out of the gutter."

But during Bush's reelection in 2004, McCain strained to embrace his former rival -- literally. In their first joint appearance, they hugged dramatically before 6,000 soldiers at a Fort Lewis rally. Those events made for great campaign visuals. Yet while most Americans saw McCain's big heart, Republican leaders saw hungry ambition.

Rich Lowry, editor of the conservative magazine National Review, recently described that campaign bear hug as nothing but proof of "the senator's presidential ambitions." Lowry argues it's just part of McCain's scheme to get "the Right to stop loathing him." In targeted moves since the election, McCain has continued his Bushification by changing positions on conservative priorities like creationism, gay marriage and tax cuts.

As the costs of Hurricane Katrina mounted, McCain went on national television and told Chris Mathews the Bush tax cuts must be maintained. But McCain voted against those tax cuts.

In fact, he was one of only two Republicans to oppose Bush's signature 2001 tax cut. Given the surging costs of Katrina, Iraq and Medicare, there is no policy rationale for reversing his position now. The only rationale is political pandering. And that's exactly how some influential conservatives see it. Grover Norquist, president of Americans for Tax Reform, recently said that although McCain has "flip-flopped on a number of issues," he is still "anti-taxpayer" because "he's voted against every tax cut."

Yet the mainstream media is so attached to McCain's maverick image, most journalists didn't cover the tax reversal.


http://www.alternet.org/story/28266 /


McCAIN: "I am proud of my pro-life record..."

On “Meet the Press,” McCain said he had “come to the conclusion that the exceptions for rape, incest, and the life of the mother are legitimate exceptions” to an outright ban on abortions. “I don’t claim to be a theologian, but I have my moral beliefs.” If Roe v. Wade is overturned and abortion outlawed, McCain said he believes doctors who performed abortions would be prosecuted. “But I would not prosecute a woman” who obtained an abortion.
Source: Boston Globe, p. A9 Jan 31, 2000

“Family Conference” if daughter wanted an abortion

KEYES : What you would say if your daughter was ever in a position where she might need an abortion? You answered that the choice would be up to her and then that you’d have a family conference. That displayed a profound lack of understanding of the basic issue of principle involved in abortion. After all, if your daughter said she was contemplating killing her grandmother for the inheritance, you wouldn’t say, “Let’s have a family conference.” You’d look at her and say “Just Say No,“ because that is morally wrong. It is God’s choice that that child is in the womb. And for us to usurp that choice in contradiction of our declaration of principles is just as wrong.

McCAIN: I am proud of my pro-life record in public life, and I will continue to maintain it. I will not draw my children into this discussion. As a leader of a pro-life party with a pro-life position, I will persuade young Americans understand the importance of the preservation of the rights of the unborn.

More here: http://www.issues2000.org/Senate/John_McCain_Abortion.h...
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Teaser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:19 PM
Response to Original message
5. Who underestimates McCain?
The "base doesn't support him" and "he's too old" contentions are areas we can exploit against him, not firewalls guaranteed to prevent him.
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mattclearing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. I don't think people get it. He is their Joementum.
That's how they think of McCain.
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LSparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:19 PM
Response to Original message
6. I agree with you, especially if we end up with Hillary
Edited on Thu Mar-09-06 04:22 PM by LSparkle
There's no way she's going to beat a war veteran in a post-9/11 world. We REALLY need to keep our eyes on McCain because his fortunes and Hillary's are linked (if they run him, we CANNOT run her).
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
9. But he has too many people who don't trust him
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Malikshah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:22 PM
Response to Original message
13. It's not underestimation of McCain
But rather the DINOs and DLC types.

And the stupidity and moral vacuity of the "heartland" types who would even ponder supporting the miscreant.

McCain is a traitor to the US for his insider-support of the regime. He, too, should go down with that particular ship.

No quarter to traitors.
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MisterP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:23 PM
Response to Original message
14. in Mexican-American politics class, I kept noting McCain cropping
up as a vocal "moderate" on Latino issues--with some Latino support in his Southwestern state: NV, AZ, CO, and NM are all swing states, especially in up-for-grabs '08
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dogday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:24 PM
Response to Original message
15. What is going on with his Skin Cancer?
one day his face looks ok, the next it looks like the tumor has grown again... His medical history going to play a part in this?

Also what one would one expect from a man who leaves his first wife to marry a wealthy second wife....
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elfin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
17. and he WILL be nominated
He will make just enough moves to appeal to the base and get the "blessing" of of a few prominent fundies and pundits to squeak through the primaries.

This time he doesn't have to face GWB and his cutthroat strategy and his bottomless money.

Melanoma McCain will have his day and we are screwed.
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mattclearing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. No way in hell.
Do you know any of these people?

The few rabid Republicans I know plan to leave the country if McCain is elected.

There is no way in hell they will nominate him.

It won't happen.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
18. I certainly don't "misunderestimate" the guy at all
Just say the primaries are done, and the choice comes down to Hillary Vs. McCain (this is simply ONE scenario of many, it is NOT a foregone conclusion, so don't get exorcised about it). It would be a horserace. The fundies would probably stay home, or vote for some clown running on the Rapture Party ticket, and you'd see some INTERESTING crossover voting. People criticize Hillary for trending right on this side, and they criticize McCain for trending left on the other side. What they say in the primary debates, and how the media covers it, could shift big chunks of the population (those who only pay scant attention every four years) one way or the other.

There are also people on both sides of the aisle who either do not want a female on any Presidential ticket, or would vote for Paris Hilton, damn near (that IS hyperbole) just to see a female in the WH.

I do suspect though, that the BushCo machine has come to some sort of accomodation with him. The cake-eating picture, and the sweaty embrace, quite plainly SUGGEST something. It could be a simple agreement not to engage in dirty tricks in exchange for McCain not ratting someone out about something, or it could be a bury the hatchet/agreement to appear at fundraisers and rallies sort of deal.

We'll know for sure as the primaries start gearing up. In the meantime, I still wonder if McCain doesn't have a monkey by the balls:

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BillZBubb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 04:45 PM
Response to Original message
20. If McCain gets the Repug nomination, he'd be hard to beat.
The difficulty for him will be getting the nomination. He will get it if the Repugs are desperate by then.
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