West Virginia Voters Voted Against Their Own Best Interests, Twice

[louis c]

West Virginia is another tragic example of voters' attention being diverted on election day.

Instead of focusing on the important matters in their state and country, a majority became confused by issues such as gay rights, guns, prayer in school and other "non-issues" in 2000 and 2004.

This is a mining state. This is a union state. The dismantling of OSHA is critical in West Virginia. Education, health care, union issues such as organizing rights and stronger laws to enforce mine safety, that's what should have been important to them.

Again, we see the most vulnerable among us suffer because the Bush Administration worships at the alter of the all-mighty dollar and Fox News continues to confuse the voters, even more so than usual, with insignificant bull-shit every time an important election approaches.

God Bless the miners and their families. Are hearts and prayers are with you. You see, we real union folks know what's important, and that's you.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

1. Amen

I so feel for these families-the shock and sadness-one of the reasons we have government, imho, is to ensure safety for workers.

[Gatchaman]

4. It boggled my mind

when the decent, hard working people of West Virginia, home to Robert C. Byrd, voted out an incumbent republican governor, reelected literally hundreds of democrats throughout the state, and then voted for george w fucking bush for president in 2000.

Sadly, West Virginia, basing their votes on fear and paranoia stoked by karl rove and charlton heston (their president from 1993-2000, if bumer stickers can be believed), cost Al Gore the 2000 election. If WV had gone the way is could, nay, should have, all the disenfranchising, butterfly balloting, and hanging chads in Florida wouldn't have amounted to a bucket of shit.

[xxqqqzme]

29. You know that fantasy red/blue map

on the internet after the election? The United States of Canada and jesusland? I lived in WV for 10 years & make no mistake it IS jesusland. I knew families on food stamps & unemployment that still sent money 2 robert$on & fartwell.

[napi21]

2. I'm praying for the trapped miners too, but do you really think

having a Dem admin. would have improved things in the mines? I lived in PA. for years, and W. VA. being a neighbor state, we received a lot of info on what goes on there. Working in a mine is a terrible job and extremel risky. The only reason people do it at all is because the pay is good.I still don't understand, with all the technology we have today, why mining can't be done robotically instead of sending humans a mile or more deep underground?

I really hope they find these men alive and well, but I'm more fearful with each passing hour.

[The Stranger]

5. The answer to your question is yes.

Having a Democratic Administration would undoubtedly have improved things in the minds. Wake up. The cabal that has taken over the country has dismantled government in all of its beneficial forms, its protections and regulations of industry practices, and allowed corporations to murder for profit and continue business. Wake up.

[napi21]

7. I don't think I'm asleep! I just haven't heard anyone from either party

fighting for more safety in the mines! Unfortunately, most of the miners and their families are NOT the politically active types. I'd bet the mine owners ARE!

[The Stranger]

41. Becoming politically active could constitute waking up,

I suppose.

[The Stranger]

45. Apparently, a Democratic Congress did do something about this.

The explosion was West Virginia's deadliest coal mining accident since 1968, when 78 men _ including Manchin's uncle _ died in an explosion at a mine in Marion County, an hour's drive from here. Nineteen bodies remain entombed in the mountain. It was that disaster that prompted Congress to pass the Mine Health and Safety Act of 1969.


http://www.wral.com/news/5842512/detail.html

[terryg11]

10. that doesn't address mine safety

we had a democratic admin. for eight years and while he may not have worsened the working conditions in WV he didn't really address it either. It is a dangerous job as the poster said but no one especially a democratic president that practically lives and dies by unions is going to suggest replacing miners with robots. why? jobs,jobs,jobs.

Take it a step further, that process of blasting off mountain tops to look for coal is a real environmental winner but I dont know if the dems do much to stop that either (could be wrong here) again because of jobs

[MountainLaurel]

11. No, it wouldn't

Historically, pretty much all of the people appointed to MSHA on the federal level as well as the state mine safety organization have been in the pocket of the coal companies since they were created in the wake of the Monongah mine explosion (about an hour away from the current crisis). Same thing goes with state government officials, both Dem and Repub. Those government officials who tried to do something about mine safety issues were soon enough shown who was boss, and lost elections.

As for why it can't be done robotically: It can to some extent -- longwall mining is one example. However, that equipment is hugely expensive and requires a mine of a certain size. But almost all of the mines operating today in WV are small mines that go into the areas between the old large mines that were tapped out.

[hollowdweller]

19. True. WV'ians didn't see help on the way from the democrats either

So a lot of them voted on cultural issues.

Kerry came here and pretty much delivered his stump speech. He didn't really address many workplace or safety issues, or really promise any economic changes.

[The Stranger]

42. Another aspect of this no one has addressed is civil liability.

The Republicans have eviscerated consumer causes of action and any redress ordinary working people would have against the coal mining companies and their affiliates in a massive re-structuring of the legal system under the guise of "tort reform." It is a reversing of protections provided to working people that has prevented millions from dying on the job in the past 25 years.

Ever ask yourself how many men died constructing the Brooklyn Bridge -- that is, how many men left their wives and families in the morning for work and never returned? If you did, then ask yourself why far fewer die on the job today.

What is most ironic about it is the civil courts system does not cost the government any additional money to adjudicate the claims of the injured. It is already in place and runs for no additional funds. However, the Republicans have taken it upon themselves to create "administrative remedies" and governmental agencies to obliterate the jury's role in the process, notwithstanding the fact that these agencies are sheer big government and cost millions to create and support, unlike the courts.

[jdlh8894]

3. West (by G*D ) Virginia

I guess we will just have to get rid of 2 senators. eom

[cry baby]

6. Why get rid of Byrd and Rockefeller?

[jdlh8894]

15. Why get rid of Byrd and Rockefeller?

Was Meant to be sarcasm. Sorry!

[Divernan]

8. You Georgians got rid of Clelland; you can't touch Byrd/Rockefeller.

Your profile says you're from Georgia. You proud of draft-dodging Saxby Chambliss?

It was Bush & his political hack appointees who gutted the workplace safety regs and it was a Repug. majority house and senate which passed budgets which gutted funds for safety inspectors. So don't you dare come on DU and slam Rockefeller and Byrd.

[jdlh8894]

14. WV & GA

Born and raised in WV. Only here in GA for as long as I can hack it. Don"t know much about Chambliss.

[Hubert Flottz]

16. You should do fine in Georgia!

Trust me! How'd you like the ball game BTW!

[jdlh8894]

17. Unbelievable!!! eom

[two gun sid]

27. Self-Delete

[ohio_liberal]

9. West Virginia's biggest employer is Walmart

Not steel mills anymore, not coal mines, not other manufacturing jobs. Most WV citizens simply don't think about it.

[Hubert Flottz]

18. Wally world works a few folks in Ohio too, or so I hear.

And Ohio didn't do so good taking care of the election in 04. You're governor is a convict and your reps are all probably headed for jail, to keep Jim Traficant company!

Go ahead everybody and bash WV, if it makes you feel better though, hell everybody does it. * We can take it!

I NEVER walk into a Wal-Mart, NEVER! I have walked on building trades union picket lines in front of several Wal-Marts that some little guys from Mexico were building in WV and over in Ohio. I'll stay home next time and let you guys walk your own picket lines...

peace

[ohio_liberal]

21. You might go back and read again

I wasn't bashing West Virginia. I was trying to make a point that WV, like most other states in this country, isn't thinking "union" anymore when they vote because manufacturing and unions in that state are all but kaput. 10 years ago Weirton Steel was the state's largest employer. Now it's WalMart. That should be an eye-opener to everyone.

It isn't about walking into Walmart. It's that people have no choices but to WORK at Walmart. Jesus. Talk about a knee-jerk reaction.

[Hubert Flottz]

22. 12 of the 13 miners are believed to be alive families have just

been told!

I hope it's true...

[ohio_liberal]

33. I'm sorry Hubert, I was snippy in my last post

:hug:

[Hubert Flottz]

36. I'm sorry too, I was snippy all day yesterday...

It bothered me that I'd teed off on you, I felt bad about it all evening.

[ohio_liberal]

39. It's all good

I know poking fun at WV is some peoples' idea of sport. I live within spitting distance of WV and I know how it is. :grouphug:

[Hubert Flottz]

12. I'm a union folk from west bye gawd and I've NEVER voted GOP

in my life! ***** NEVER!

I watched the evening news with tears in my eyes. I get very sad when I think of what could have been.

Congresshack Shellie Moore Capito(R)ogue, up there at the mine campaigning and praising the coal company, made me sick to my stomach! What a selfish %$^%&^%$er! The only channel I saw Shellie on was FOX and they ate her photo op up as she was using the miner's famalies as a backdrop for her political stunt. I'd run against the %^$#@#$#%^&, but who would vote for me, I tell the truth sometimes and that don't sell in Washington anymore?

[oasis]

13. Trust in your B.O.S.S.: Bush Ownership Society Stupidity.

[BeFree]

20. I have to ask....

...but before I do, a moment of silence for the trapped miners. >>0<<

Ok.... what type of voting apparatus is used in WV? Surely, everyone has a general idea by now of the types of voting machines in use in their state, right?

Now, WV may not be your state, so the question then goes to someone who is.

We all know how easy it is to change votes through programming codes. Codes which are secrets. Codes which can be hacked. Codes that are being outlawed in many states these days.

Could it be that WV actually did vote for Kerry? Good question, eh?

[Hubert Flottz]

23. "Could it be that WV actually did vote for Kerry? "

We had lots of new registrations and lots of Repubs switching their registrations, so I have no choice, but to think that something was up. Even the old punch card ballots are suspect! I think there were several different types of voting devices used in the last three elections here, Diebold electronic machines without paper trails included!

They are saying for sure now, that 12 of the 13 miners are in fact alive and on their way out of that mine! That is great!

[laruemtt]

44. in 2000 wv used touchscreen voting for the first time

and just by "coincidence" it was the first time in eternity it voted for the republican pres. candidate. just sayin'.....

[linazelle]

24. What do you expect from people with no teeth? nt

[linazelle]

25. I keed, I keed.

:rofl:

P.S. I'm a born and bred West Virginian.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

26. as am I

your qualifier gives you my blessing. otherwise, i'd call you an elitist

[Hubert Flottz]

30. I started to say speaking of no teeth........... Bite Me!

But I don't talk like that!

[two gun sid]

28. As my Great Grandfather, who was a WVA Union miner...

always said: "Any workin' man that votes for a Republican is a goddamn idiot".

I am so glad that 12 of the 13 trapped miners have been found alive. My condolences to the family and friends of the one miner who was found dead. I'm an atheist but, I'm reminded of a song I heard in my youth. It was sung at miner funerals.


"The miner is gone
We'll see him no more.
God be with the miner wherever he goes.
And may he be ready Thy call to obey
Looking to Jesus the only true way."

[Hubert Flottz]

34. Sid, what I saw on tv last night was about the saddest thing I ever

Saw...Those guys are all dead but one. I stayed up about all night watching what was going on up there in that coal little town and I was shocked.

The coal company let those people go on believing the trapped miners were still alive, for three hours after they knew that was not the case. Those poor people are very pissed off and I don't blame them. So damned sad!

[Ioo]

31. I live here, and Jesus goes a long way...

I think they are having buyers regret

[underpants]

32. THe NRA baought WV in 2000 and it is now considered NRA (Repub)

territory. Gun people don't flame me for this, that is how it is.

[jody]

35. Or perhaps we Dems lost WV by not aggressively telling voters we had

changed our position.

Our 2004 platform said "We will protect Americans' Second Amendment right to own firearms, and we will keep guns out of the hands of criminals and terrorists by fighting gun crime, reauthorizing the assault weapons ban, and closing the gun show loophole, as President Bush proposed and failed to do."

Kerry and other Dem candidates did not tell voters about our new position and paid the price. :shrug:

[Hubert Flottz]

37. People need guns here, to keep the coal barons straight!

The sorry, out of state, carpetbagging, GOPer Bastids! I have a feeling there are some Addingtons from KY who are BIG stockholders in that coal company. The Addingtons donated more money to Bush in 2000, that anyone else in the US. One of the Addington klan is Dick Cheney's right hand man since Scooter Libby got busted. I'll bet the federal mine safety people never came down hard on that company that had so many safety violations, because the company had some federal level political pull somewhere. I will snoop around and see if Addingtons are involved. The fact that the company HQ is in Ashland KY, makes me think Addington brothers! I don't know if that mine was a union operation or not, but I will almost bet you it was not!

You might want to hang on to your shootin' irons in case the Terra-ists show up in Richmond!

[underpants]

40. Without being too specific Hubert

Massey energy is just a few blocks away-Seen any Massey people on the TV recently???

Yes the Addingtons are OLD coal money. OLD.


This whole thing stinks to high heaven. Turns out it wasn't a union mine-they probably bought into profit sharing or the promise that they could each become management some day. Not knocking them its just that those are two of the big union busting techniques.

Daily kos has something about 160 violations only costing Mr.Hatfield (yep Hatfield and the survivor is a McCloy) about $3,600. What good are fines if you can pay them out of your pocket?

[Hubert Flottz]

43. It didn't take much snooping to find out about the Addington...

connection.

Ross to move International Coal Group headquarters from Ky. to W.Va.


"We don't have any mines that are right near Ashland anyway," Ross said in a telephone interview Thursday. "The Ashland headquarters is sort of a historic accident from the days when Addington controlled the company."

The Addington family ran what was known as AEI Resources Holding Inc. Ross bought the renamed Horizon Natural Resources Co. out of bankruptcy last year to form International Coal Group.

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/centredaily/business/11976045.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp

I'll bet you Addingtons retained some ownership.

EDIT...Damn check this out!

Massey's big mess
Coal miners fight union-busting bankruptcy
By David Hoskins
Charleston, W. Va.

Allegations have been flying that Horizon Natural Resources and Massey Energy Co. have conspired to undermine the wages and benefits of unionized workers. In response, a progressive coalition of miners, students and community activists was formed after a fightback rally in a town near the Cannelton, W. Va., coal mine.

In September of this year Horizon placed its Cannelton mine on idle and laid off all its unionized workforce. Horizon recently sold the mine to Massey Energy Co. Union activists claim that Massey did not place the highest bid; other bidders had promised to keep the union workforce mostly intact.

Horizon had filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in November 2002. This is the second time that owners of this company have used the bankruptcy court to slide out of their obligations to the workers. Horizon is a reincarnation of AEI Resources Inc., which had filed for bankruptcy in February 2002. According to the company's web site, "Less than three months later, on May 9, it emerged as Horizon, the nation's fourth-largest coal company. Horizon operates 42 mines, including 27 surface and 15 underground, in five states: Kentucky, West Virginia, Illinois, Indiana and Colorado."

The United Mine Workers of America protested the recent sale of Horizon because it would strip more than 5,000 active and retired coal miners of health benefits and job security.

http://www.workers.org/ww/2004/miners1111.php

These people have been fighting with the UMW and a crony judge has ruled in their favor right down the line! This thing might blow up Big Time now! "WV Mine Wars" Part 2 ?

[two gun sid]

46. That reminded me of the Union meetings they used to hold...

in the school in the coal camp my grandparents lived in. Us kids knew not to go sneakin' around while the meeting was going on. The Union posted armed guards in the woods around the meeting. People will find it hard to believe, but, those miners were not being paranoid, they knew they couldn't trust those fuckin' operators.

[CornField]

38. Whoa... just a second

Not all of West Virginia did that -- not all. We cannot continue to judge entire states based on the way their votes stacked up.