Has FISA ever declared that Bush's spying program is legal?

[free_spirit82]

I'm have a verbal smackdown with this conservative asshat via the opinion section of my hometown newspaper. He stated that FISA has already declared that Bush's spying program is legal. I looked through several search engines and haven't found one thing that would suggest that FISA agrees that this program is legal. Does anyone here have any information that I missed?

[fooj]

1. I know that a FISA judge stepped down in opposition.

I don't believe that they have ever claimed it was legal. Why? BECAUSE IT CLEARLY IS NOT! Welcome to DU!

Peace.

[Skidmore]

2. I don't believe so.

Today Feingold asked Negroponte if he had ever been told that the program was legal and he said he had not.

[free_spirit82]

3. Thanks Y'all

I didn't think so. I checked three search engines and never got one article saying that FISA said it was legal. Thanks again.

[MrMonk]

4. A small, niggling point

FISA is an Act of Congress.
However, it does not authorize Bush to spy on US citizens without a warrant.
The FISA court is in place to issue warrants that would allow Bush to spy on U.S. citizens, if he shows that there is sufficient reason to allow such spying. The bar for such a showing is set really, really low, and the FISA court has only denied four warrants.
No judge on the FISA court has come forward to say that spying on U.S. citizens without a warrant is legal. How could they, when the express purpose of having the FISA court is to issue warrants that would allow such spying to be done legally?

On edit: sorry to be late. I was still typing when the OP posted his thanks.

[endarkenment]

5. FISA is a court. It doesn't declare shit.

It does routinely issue warrants when asked to do so but in this case the Imperium has not bothered to ask for any (presumably because it has no suspects to search so the warrants would not be granted.)

Your freeper friend should be asked to provide a link that documents the FISA courts approval of illegal warrantless bush domestic monitoring operations. When he can't you may simply point out that he is a fucking liar.

You generally cannot prove a negative (prove that the FISA court didn't approve of the monitoring.) What are you going to do, examine every newspaper article on the planet to verify that no such action occurred. Your lying asshat freeper friend made a positive assertion of fact: "the FISA court approved the monitoring", one valid link will suffice. Don't let them get away with their unsubstantiated bullshit. Make them prove it every time.

[BuyingThyme]

6. FISA explicitly declared Bush's spying illegal.

That was the point of FISA.

As for the secret court created by FISA, they have been left out of the loop.

[SillyGoose]

7. Tell him to prove it with a credible source. Betcha he can't.

[free_spirit82]

8. He probably wouldn't even bother to prove it.

He's an older guy in our community, and used to bullying and getting his way. A lot of people in our community will just take what he says as gospel, which is why I'm challenging him on it. He's already brought out the "Clinton did it too" argument, and when I debunked that, he told me that it was irrelevant, Clinton wanted to be allowed to do it. WTF??? Anyway, he spends most of the time bashing the "evil liberals" and making an ass of himself. But I'm not going to let him lie repeatedly when he's in the position to influence so many in the community.